Advice For Condensation Over Winter

bigbadphil

Hi all

I am after a bit of advice. Every winter, we get a lot of condensation on the front windows (never the back). If it is not managed it leads to mould on the window seals, wall paper seems moist and develops mould spots. It has started to effect the clothes and bedding in the house. They are not wet, but seem to retain moisture. Things like the slats on the beds start to develop mould and upholstery has a musty smell to it. 

Don't get me wrong, I have scoured the internet for remedies. I am pretty sure of the causes. We have tried opening windows for more ventilation, drilling through the downstairs vents that have been closed up (house gets really cold in the winter through these), de-humidifiers, cheap water catchers, you name it we have probably tried it. We can't leave windows open as the house starts to get really cold and my wife has a neurological condition which cold can effect. 

A bit of background to how we are living (The cause of all the moisture)
There are 4 of us in the house. 3 adults and a 7 year old. We pretty much get showers everyday, (the 21 year old not so much). Washing machine is on pretty much every day with washing hung up on the landing (top of the stairs). Bathroom does not have a fan in so steam from showers has to go somewhere. 
Windows are double glazed and about 25/30 years old at a guess. They are not energy efficient but getting new ones is impossible. Cannot afford them. (Open to ideas on how to)
House was built around 1920 and is solid brick, no breeze block, old school.

I know this all boils down to ventilation and the fact the air in the house is different to that outside which causes the build up of moisture. Is there anyone I can search for that can come and do a free and honest evaluation on the house and see what the options are? Do I just need vents on the roof to let the heat escape? Every year I say I want to do something about it and then the summer comes and its fine. Then the winter comes and it always seems worse than last year. 

Thank you in advance.

Phil

moneysaver1978

bigbadphil said:

Hi all

I am after a bit of advice. Every winter, we get a lot of condensation on the front windows (never the back). If it is not managed it leads to mould on the window seals, wall paper seems moist and develops mould spots. It has started to effect the clothes and bedding in the house. They are not wet, but seem to retain moisture. Things like the slats on the beds start to develop mould and upholstery has a musty smell to it. 

Don't get me wrong, I have scoured the internet for remedies. I am pretty sure of the causes. We have tried opening windows for more ventilation, drilling through the downstairs vents that have been closed up (house gets really cold in the winter through these), de-humidifiers, cheap water catchers, you name it we have probably tried it. We can't leave windows open as the house starts to get really cold and my wife has a neurological condition which cold can effect. 

A bit of background to how we are living (The cause of all the moisture)
There are 4 of us in the house. 3 adults and a 7 year old. We pretty much get showers everyday, (the 21 year old not so much). Washing machine is on pretty much every day with washing hung up on the landing (top of the stairs). Bathroom does not have a fan in so steam from showers has to go somewhere. 
Windows are double glazed and about 25/30 years old at a guess. They are not energy efficient but getting new ones is impossible. Cannot afford them. (Open to ideas on how to)
House was built around 1920 and is solid brick, no breeze block, old school.

I know this all boils down to ventilation and the fact the air in the house is different to that outside which causes the build up of moisture. Is there anyone I can search for that can come and do a free and honest evaluation on the house and see what the options are? Do I just need vents on the roof to let the heat escape? Every year I say I want to do something about it and then the summer comes and its fine. Then the winter comes and it always seems worse than last year. 

Thank you in advance.

Phil

you mention you already have a dehumidifier but how powerful is it? When you hang laundry, is the dehumidifier on?

We live in a 1930s solid brick wall and we noticed a lot less moisture since we got a dehumidifier (with dryer mode). Over winter, we turn it on with the laundry near by.

sammyjammy

Do you mean an electric dehumidifier or those ones you can buy in B&M type shops with the crystals that absorb moisture?  If the latter you need to invest in a proper electric dehumidifier, I have one in a terrace house built 1899 and its the best thing I ever did.  I never close my bathroom window (and always close bathroom door so that moisture doesn't creep from bathroom into the rest of the house, but do have an extractor fan wired into the light, that would also be a sensible lowish cost solution.

bigbadphil

moneysaver1978 said:

bigbadphil said:

Hi all

I am after a bit of advice. Every winter, we get a lot of condensation on the front windows (never the back). If it is not managed it leads to mould on the window seals, wall paper seems moist and develops mould spots. It has started to effect the clothes and bedding in the house. They are not wet, but seem to retain moisture. Things like the slats on the beds start to develop mould and upholstery has a musty smell to it. 

Don't get me wrong, I have scoured the internet for remedies. I am pretty sure of the causes. We have tried opening windows for more ventilation, drilling through the downstairs vents that have been closed up (house gets really cold in the winter through these), de-humidifiers, cheap water catchers, you name it we have probably tried it. We can't leave windows open as the house starts to get really cold and my wife has a neurological condition which cold can effect. 

A bit of background to how we are living (The cause of all the moisture)
There are 4 of us in the house. 3 adults and a 7 year old. We pretty much get showers everyday, (the 21 year old not so much). Washing machine is on pretty much every day with washing hung up on the landing (top of the stairs). Bathroom does not have a fan in so steam from showers has to go somewhere. 
Windows are double glazed and about 25/30 years old at a guess. They are not energy efficient but getting new ones is impossible. Cannot afford them. (Open to ideas on how to)
House was built around 1920 and is solid brick, no breeze block, old school.

I know this all boils down to ventilation and the fact the air in the house is different to that outside which causes the build up of moisture. Is there anyone I can search for that can come and do a free and honest evaluation on the house and see what the options are? Do I just need vents on the roof to let the heat escape? Every year I say I want to do something about it and then the summer comes and its fine. Then the winter comes and it always seems worse than last year. 

Thank you in advance.

Phil

you mention you already have a dehumidifier but how powerful is it? When you hang laundry, is the dehumidifier on?

We live in a 1930s solid brick wall and we noticed a lot less moisture since we got a dehumidifier (with dryer mode). Over winter, we turn it on with the laundry near by.

Thank you for the reply.

Apologies, dehumidifier wasn't an electric one. I should of been more clear. We have had the cheap plastic ones from the bargain stores and we have had the ore expensive ones from unibond. Ideally, I don't really want to resort in having an electric one running all the time. I would rather try and sort the problem out permanently. 

I have been doing more research on it and have read that having a vents in the soffits and/or replacing roof tiles with vents can help sort out the problem.

We bought the house from my grandad nearly 20 years ago and before we moved in, I don't think there was a problem. It is only really since the loft has started gathering junk and things being stored up there and the occupancy has increased that it has gotten worse each year.

Out of interest, what dehumidifier did you get?

bigbadphil

sammyjammy said:

Do you mean an electric dehumidifier or those ones you can buy in B&M type shops with the crystals that absorb moisture?  If the latter you need to invest in a proper electric dehumidifier, I have one in a terrace house built 1899 and its the best thing I ever did.  I never close my bathroom window (and always close bathroom door so that moisture doesn't creep from bathroom into the rest of the house, but do have an extractor fan wired into the light, that would also be a sensible lowish cost solution.

Yes, it was the cheap versions. What dehumidifier did you buy if you don't mind me asking?

Thank you for the reply

the_lunatic_is_in_my_head

No mention of heating OP?

Warm air holds more moisture than cold, put the heating on and then run a dehumidifier, a decent one that will probably cost a few hundred pounds to buy, the running costs per hour, even at 90% relative humidity, should be less than whatever you pay for 1kWh of electricity and it doesn't need to be on all day, maybe a couple of hours a day rotating rooms through the week. At the moment the house is damp, once you even that out a bit it's a case of keeping on top of it and you shouldn't need to run the dehumidifier so much. 

Once you get the damp out the house the air will take less energy to heat which should save you in the long run. 

Those tablet things are useless for a large scale issue. 

I'm not sure about the idea of having vents in the walls, why heat the house and then have cold air coming in? I would have thought you're better off plugging any drafts and then opening the windows for 10-20 minutes a day.

Don't hang the washing on the landing if you can avoid it (tumble dryer or outside on the line), an extraction fan in the bathroom should be a relatively small cost.  

If you have mould use a mould spray to keep on top of it, bleach just wipes the mould away, the sprays you get in the shops have an extra ingredient to kill off the roots of the mould, doesn't have to be the expensive £5 a bottle stuff, one we use was £1.29 in a poundshop type place. Again dryer, warmer air and previous growth killed off will in the long run improve things.

You mention it getting worse in recent years, humidity has been bad at the end of summer for the last few years, it hasn't stopping raining this winter and instead of crisp dry days it's just constant wetness, it's sadly going to have a greater affect given the current conditions and activity in the house   

coffeehound

Extractors in the bathroom and kitchen are essential these days really.  Yes you can open windows but that cools the house down causing problems in other ways.  Putting washing out on the line whenever possible would also help but it hasn't been a good winter for that.

I'd also be wary of focussing only on ventilation at the expense of warmth.  Avoiding condensation is a balance of ventilation and heating, and it sounds like you may have excessive ventilation that is making the house cold, meaning that condensation doesn't really get removed.  The soft furnishings demonstarte this -- cold fabrics hold on to more humidity when they are cold than when they are warm, and feel heavy and clammy.

So extraction of big humidity sources as they are produced, plus raising the general indoor temperature a bit if possible might be enough to swing the balance back enough.  If this means actually reducing the ventilation a bit, it would be worth trying IMO

Edit -- hadn't seen the post above!

Albermarle

bigbadphil said:

Hi all

I am after a bit of advice. Every winter, we get a lot of condensation on the front windows (never the back). If it is not managed it leads to mould on the window seals, wall paper seems moist and develops mould spots. It has started to effect the clothes and bedding in the house. They are not wet, but seem to retain moisture. Things like the slats on the beds start to develop mould and upholstery has a musty smell to it. 

Don't get me wrong, I have scoured the internet for remedies. I am pretty sure of the causes. We have tried opening windows for more ventilation, drilling through the downstairs vents that have been closed up (house gets really cold in the winter through these), de-humidifiers, cheap water catchers, you name it we have probably tried it. We can't leave windows open as the house starts to get really cold and my wife has a neurological condition which cold can effect. 

A bit of background to how we are living (The cause of all the moisture)
There are 4 of us in the house. 3 adults and a 7 year old. We pretty much get showers everyday, (the 21 year old not so much). Washing machine is on pretty much every day with washing hung up on the landing (top of the stairs). Bathroom does not have a fan in so steam from showers has to go somewhere. 
Windows are double glazed and about 25/30 years old at a guess. They are not energy efficient but getting new ones is impossible. Cannot afford them. (Open to ideas on how to)
House was built around 1920 and is solid brick, no breeze block, old school.

I know this all boils down to ventilation and the fact the air in the house is different to that outside which causes the build up of moisture. Is there anyone I can search for that can come and do a free and honest evaluation on the house and see what the options are? Do I just need vents on the roof to let the heat escape? Every year I say I want to do something about it and then the summer comes and its fine. Then the winter comes and it always seems worse than last year. 

Thank you in advance.

Phil

This probably does not help much but may be of interest.
We also live in a solid wall 1920's built house . Mixture of older and newer double glazing.
4 people in the house- 3 showers a day on average.
Washing machine on twice a day. In Winter washing is partly hung on racks and partly dried on radiators.
No air vents . Some trickle vents on newer windows. No dehumidifiers.
In the main house, including two bathrooms - no problem with any condensation at all, apart for bathrooms a bit steamy after showers. Soon cured by opening window for 5 mins and/or extractor fan.
Minor problem in loft conversion on bathroom window, and one of the velux windows.

I can only put down this lack of condensation issues to . Keeping the house reasonably warm. There are very few days when there is nobody at home for more than a few hours.
The ceilings are quite high, the hallway is quite large, and doors to rooms are not normally closed. Plus one room has an open fire. So I am thinking there is a large volume of warm air, with some mild draught that is preventing build up of condensation.
The loft room is not kept so warm every day ( person who uses it is not always at home) It is more airtight and the door is often closed, and this is the only room with any issues at all.
Perhaps I am paying for no condensation with a high gas bill !

bigbadphil

the_lunatic_is_in_my_head said:

No mention of heating OP?

Warm air holds more moisture than cold, put the heating on and then run a dehumidifier, a decent one that will probably cost a few hundred pounds to buy, the running costs per hour, even at 90% relative humidity, should be less than whatever you pay for 1kWh of electricity and it doesn't need to be on all day, maybe a couple of hours a day rotating rooms through the week. At the moment the house is damp, once you even that out a bit it's a case of keeping on top of it and you shouldn't need to run the dehumidifier so much. 

Once you get the damp out the house the air will take less energy to heat which should save you in the long run. 

Those tablet things are useless for a large scale issue. 

I'm not sure about the idea of having vents in the walls, why heat the house and then have cold air coming in? I would have thought you're better off plugging any drafts and then opening the windows for 10-20 minutes a day.

Don't hang the washing on the landing if you can avoid it (tumble dryer or outside on the line), an extraction fan in the bathroom should be a relatively small cost.  

If you have mould use a mould spray to keep on top of it, bleach just wipes the mould away, the sprays you get in the shops have an extra ingredient to kill off the roots of the mould, doesn't have to be the expensive £5 a bottle stuff, one we use was £1.29 in a poundshop type place. Again dryer, warmer air and previous growth killed off will in the long run improve things.

You mention it getting worse in recent years, humidity has been bad at the end of summer for the last few years, it hasn't stopping raining this winter and instead of crisp dry days it's just constant wetness, it's sadly going to have a greater affect given the current conditions and activity in the house   

Heating has been on quite a bit this winter and is slowly being reduced due to the weather. Our heating seems to fluctuate as before we put it on the house is cold, then after an hour or so of it being on its like a furnace. Once off, you can feel the chill in the air. Saying it, i suspect that the ventilation in the house is probably not too bad. 

Looked at a few different dehumidifiers. I am drawn towards the LOGIK L20DH19 Dehumidifier. Reviews look good, airflow looks great compared to others I have read up about in Currys and the price looks affordable. 

rob7475

Ventilation is key to curing condensation. A PIV system will almost certainly cure any condensation problem. They cost very little to run. However, they are pulling in cooler air from outdoors so may have an effect on your heating costs.

A dehumidifier will cost more to run but is also more efficient as it will warm the air in the room.

We had a PIV system until last winter when I had to rip it out due to having our loft converted. I replaced it with a dehumidifier. The PIV system was much more effective at curing condensation. It's hard to tell what effect it had on our heating bills though as I changed our boiler last year and added weather compensation. My gas usage is now lower but as multiple things have changed, I can't say for certain whether the PIV system contributed to higher heating bills or not.

sammyjammy

bigbadphil said:

sammyjammy said:

Do you mean an electric dehumidifier or those ones you can buy in B&M type shops with the crystals that absorb moisture?  If the latter you need to invest in a proper electric dehumidifier, I have one in a terrace house built 1899 and its the best thing I ever did.  I never close my bathroom window (and always close bathroom door so that moisture doesn't creep from bathroom into the rest of the house, but do have an extractor fan wired into the light, that would also be a sensible lowish cost solution.

Yes, it was the cheap versions. What dehumidifier did you buy if you don't mind me asking?

Thank you for the reply

I got mine from Amazon and its no longer available, they are very cheap to run, mine runs around 14 hours a day every day during winter and no visible increase in my bills, I am very careful with energy use so would notice if it was costing me alot more.