Charge For Extra Bedroom UC

8dayweek

If you had a negative decision on an extra bedroom (under unable to share due the health) then requested a Mandatory Reconsideration on this you would have got an MRN which gives details of how to Appeal?

I’m presuming the new decision to award an extra bedroom (for a carer) is time limited to how far they can backdate because of the prior negative decision and associated MR, so in reality the further war they can backdate would be from the point you first said an extra bedroom was required for Carer? 

If the date you now given for needing a bedroom for a Carer was prior to the date you said you were unable to share, then it’s not going to go anywhere - because when you completed the extra bedroom task initially you’d have been asked do you need an extra bedroom for a carer (which you presumably said no to) followed by does your health mean you’re unable to share a bedroom (which you presumably said yes to, with reasons and a date). Is that’s perhaps what’s happened? 

ANDY1964

poppy12345 said:

ANDY1964 said:

poppy12345 said:

It feels like we are being drip fed information here. Based on everything you've said I don't think you can appeal the decision on the carer because that decision was made more than 13 months ago. 

With respect
No one is being drip fed.
If you kept up with thread you will establish why I was unable to appeal.
UC told me that I could not appeal for starters.

I have been keeping up with the thread and stand by what I said. 

As will I.

sheramber

There was conflicting information given when you stated you had been claiming UC for three years but then complained the allowance had not been back dated to 2017, which did not tally.

It was only later that we were told you moved to UC in 2017 and had originally claimed then but were refused.

if you gave such confusing information to DWP  they may be as confused as we were.

poppy12345

sheramber said:

There was conflicting information given when you stated you had been claiming UC for three years but then complained the allowance had not been back dated to 2017, which did not tally.

It was only later that we were told you moved to UC in 2017 and had originally claimed then but were refused.

if you gave such confusing information to DWP  they may be as confused as we were.

Indeed, not forgetting that when they first claimed for an extra bedroom it was because they couldn't share with their partner. Now they are claiming the extra bedroom for a carer, so two completely different things. 

ANDY1964

Denying a Claimant the right to appeal via a Tribunal.

Surely that is an offence in law.

If any, what rules or laws are being broken by UC?

peteuk

ANDY1964 said:

Denying a Claimant the right to appeal via a Tribunal.

Surely that is an offence in law.

If any, what rules or laws are being broken by UC?

None,  the link below states that even though they have said no right to appeal, if you believe this is wrong you have to apply to the tribunal to firstly overturn the right to appeal. ( Section 2 para 3). 

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/media/61ee6f858fa8f505953f503b/sscs1a-largeprint-eng.pdf

As you have to appeal within 1 month/ 13 months then this should have been done prior to the change of circumstances.  I personally would chalk this up as a lost cause because of the time and energy you spend chasing a potential lost cause could be spent elsewhere. 

Your decision to back date the extra room to Dec 23/24 did that need to go to MR or was that accepted with your CoC? - Ignore this line

So a decision on your CoC (need for a carer) was made and you asked for a MR to back date this to the start of the original claim (2017 when you changed from ESA to UC/ 32 months or 3 yrs depending on your answer - which was due to not being able to share a room with partner). NB this is where people feel your drip feeding info and that your dates don't add up. 

They made a decision is 2017/18 which said no to the extra room, hence you've been “paying bed room tax” (or in reality had your housing section of UC lowered due to having a spare room), which stated no right to appeal. 

Again these are two separate issues and need separating.  The MR/Appeal following the CoC will only look as far as the CoC, hence why they have said no to the backdate to 2017.  If it went to a MR and then they have again said no right to appeal then obviously you do, but this must be within 13 months.  You current MR will see no right to appeal because factually you made a CoC and they have agreed

There is a situation in which you can appeal outside of the 13 months however this is in exceptional circumstances. 

I get this is easy for me to say, Im not emotionally involved or feel that I have been wronged.

Out of interest how old is your son?


EDITED AFTER READING OP REPLIES 

ANDY1964

Thanks for reply, again it is appreciated.

The problem as I see it and I might be wrong but UC have also got to follow the correct protocol.

Advising a Claimant that he or she has no legal entitlement as to appeal a mandatory reconsideration on two separate occasions, as is now the case could be deemed an error in law.

Again I may be wrong but some would seem such advice as being very misleading including me.

It is worth pointing out that the latest mandatory reconsideration has been written.in a journal entry only.

From my experiences a link is sent whereby the mandatory reconsideration is detailed on headed paper.

Again with this document as in 2018 I cannot lodge an appeal without such.

It would strongly appear that on the balance of evidence UC are predominately motivated in keeping the subject of bedroom.tax away from any right that I may have to depend on a Tribunal and its judges to adjudge matters.

My son is 25.

peteuk

In accordance with the documentation provided they have every right to tell you that you can not appeal.   So again Im not sure what you’re arguing.  

You continue to intertwine the two situations which are completely different.  This thread is 5 pages long and you’re still putting your case to us on your believe you’ve been wronged.  Which you havent. 

So you have a three bed house, for yourself your son (25) and a carer.  Does your son claim UC/IS/PIP/AA?  If not then there should be a deduction for him.  Given that in 2017 he would have been 18, then depending on his circumstances then and now, he would be counted as non dependant and so there is a deduction in housing benefit/UC housing element.  

Prior to 2017 he would have been a dependant and so ESA may have taken this into account so three bed, you, wife in a room and son in a room.  At the point of claiming UC if your son was non dependant then it’s a three bed house for you and wife - deduction for one room.  Had this been mentioned at the start of the post then it might have been taken into account when people were advising you.  Hence the appearance of drip feeding info. 

ANDY1964

peteuk said:

In accordance with the documentation provided they have every right to tell you that you can not appeal.   So again Im not sure what you’re arguing.  

You continue to intertwine the two situations which are completely different.  This thread is 5 pages long and you’re still putting your case to us on your believe you’ve been wronged.  Which you havent. 

So you have a three bed house, for yourself your son (25) and a carer.  Does your son claim UC/IS/PIP/AA?  If not then there should be a deduction for him.  Given that in 2017 he would have been 18, then depending on his circumstances then and now, he would be counted as non dependant and so there is a deduction in housing benefit/UC housing element.  

Prior to 2017 he would have been a dependant and so ESA may have taken this into account so three bed, you, wife in a room and son in a room.  At the point of claiming UC if your son was non dependant then it’s a three bed house for you and wife - deduction for one room.  Had this been mentioned at the start of the post then it might have been taken into account when people were advising you.  Hence the appearance of drip feeding info. 

What documentation are you referring too?, for UC to refuse a Claimant the right to take a request to a tribunal to appeal a decision.

Everyone has to abide rules and procedures, this would include those employed by DWP.

However as I have explained, this was not the case, on two separate occasions when applying for exemption of the bedroom tax.

They have and on two occasions wrongly advised me that I could not appeal their decisions.

I find it odd that some on here cannot grasp the fact.

It is fairly simple tbh.

If you are wronged in a criminal court or a civil court for that matter, you have a right to appeal.

Is that different when it comes to a Tribunal being relied upon for the very same reason?

sheramber

I find it odd that some on here cannot grasp the fact.

It is fairly simple tbh.

People on here find it odd that you cannot accept the fact that you have not been wronged.
You have been advised that it is lawful for DWP to tell you that you cannot appeal if the circumstances warrant it. 

DWP decided they were, you do not agree.

Repeating it over and over will not change anything.

You have been given the link for information on complaining about the DWP.
Follow the instructions on that link rather than keep repeating the same thing on here, which will not change anything.