I feel like my son is spiralling out of control

Nearlydebtfree

Hi

I am not sure whether I am seeking advice or just some support and someone to tell me I am not the worst mother in the world?

In a nutshell myself and my husband separated 10 years ago, I brought up our two children and he saw them a few days a month. I have always been so close to my son who is 19 until the last 12 months when he has just become grumpy, rude, verbally abusive and just secretive. In July this year, me and my ex discovered he had managed to accumulate £20k+ of debt in 12 months. He is on an apprenticeship and earns a decent salary but he had been spending money and lying to both me and my ex about where it was coming from, basically playing us off against the other. 

We found out about the debt and tried to speak to him about it and he reacted very, very badly and since then I have been on a roller coaster with him. He told us he was organising a DMP but 4 letters from debt collectors today has shown that to be a lie. He has opened and ignored a parking ticket meaning he now owes them double, I kept asking him to sort it out and he literally ignores the messages. He even has a conviction now for not paying a train fare because he opened the letters and just ignored them. My mind boggles. I have tried to offer him support, emotionally and practically, offered to help him with budgeting and his Dad even paid some of the debt off (mainly a payday loan) but he really doesn't seem to care. We care more than he does. The one thing I have stood by is that I cannot pay off his debts for him as I am not doing him any favours. 

I am at the stage with him  now, sadly, when I just feel I cannot live with him like this anymore. He lies to me constantly and is now verbally abusive and speaks to me like I am something he trod in. I agreed that, to try and help him get back on his feet I would let him live here rent free - he is so ungrateful and just replied that he shouldn't have to pay anyway! I don't want us to become estranged from each other but I also feel like after 12 months of being patient with him and offering him support, I am at the end of my tether and I feel he has to face up to his problems and I need to let the creditors deal with his debt instead of me worrying about it?

I have since remarried and my husband has also said that he feels that we have been more than patient and that he is very disrespectful. It is a horrible environment to live in and it is making me ill. Am I a terrible mother if I ask him to leave because of his behaviour? I just dread him coming home! 

I suppose I know what I need to do, but I don't know how to do it and if there is anything else I can do to help him. I worry about him and him doing stupid things, and so I suppose I worry that if I give him an ultimatum and he does anything silly I will be to blame. 

He has such a bright future ahead of him, all I want to do is help him resolve these problems now so that he can just live his life and enjoy it but he is ruining my life at the moment! I dread the post coming even though it's not for me and I just need a break from it all!

Any helpful advice would be very much appreciated. 

Hubo68

This is such a difficult situation and I can only imagine how worried you must be. I think living apart from your son is the only way he may begin overt time to respect you again and possibly listen to your advice. Giving him an ultimatum feels like a negative way of achieving this. Is there any other way of enabling him to move into his own accommodation?  A radical but not necessarily permanent solution may be for you to move out and sub-let the other rooms. You could be selective and let the rooms to suitable role models of a similar age to your son.

Nearlydebtfree

Hubo68 said:

This is such a difficult situation and I can only imagine how worried you must be. I think living apart from your son is the only way he may begin overt time to respect you again and possibly listen to your advice. Giving him an ultimatum feels like a negative way of achieving this. Is there any other way of enabling him to move into his own accommodation?  A radical but not necessarily permanent solution may be for you to move out and sub-let the other rooms. You could be selective and let the rooms to suitable role models of a similar age to your son.

Hi - I am going to suggest he finds his own accommodation but I cannot afford to finance it for him and in the circumstances I don't think it would be right for me to either? He could afford it himself, but it will mean he has to go out less - but it may be a wake up call. It's absolutely not an option for me and my husband to move out of our home as we have nowhere else to go and I feel like that would show my son he has won and driven us out of our own home! 

Emmia

Hubo68 said:

This is such a difficult situation and I can only imagine how worried you must be. I think living apart from your son is the only way he may begin overt time to respect you again and possibly listen to your advice. Giving him an ultimatum feels like a negative way of achieving this. Is there any other way of enabling him to move into his own accommodation?  A radical but not necessarily permanent solution may be for you to move out and sub-let the other rooms. You could be selective and let the rooms to suitable role models of a similar age to your son.

Why should the OP move out of her house, leaving her son with the run of the place, and where might lodgers guaranteed to be "suitable role models" be located (and frankly if he's abusive, who would want to share a home with the son)? If the OP wasn't living there any more the people living there would also be her tenants (not lodgers) with all that entails... 

I think the OP unfortunately needs to tell her son that he needs to leave, and find somewhere else to live - could he move in with his father instead? 

bluelad1927

The idea of the OP moving out is absurd

Do not tolerate any further abuse. If he continues tell him to leave the house until he can come back and treat you respectfully.

I see this as two scenarios.
Either he absolutely doesn't care about the financial situation he has got himself in and has zero respect for you. If this is the case in my house he would have to go

or 

He is more likely to be embarrassed, ashamed and even scared of what he has done. Firstly rules would apply regarding the verbal abuse. This will hopefully help bring calm in the house and he is more likely to accept help and support with his finances

Nearlydebtfree

bluelad1927 said:

The idea of the OP moving out is absurd

Do not tolerate any further abuse. If he continues tell him to leave the house until he can come back and treat you respectfully.

I see this as two scenarios.
Either he absolutely doesn't care about the financial situation he has got himself in and has zero respect for you. If this is the case in my house he would have to go

or 

He is more likely to be embarrassed, ashamed and even scared of what he has done. Firstly rules would apply regarding the verbal abuse. This will hopefully help bring calm in the house and he is more likely to accept help and support with his finances

Sadly I feel like it is the first scenario. When I first found out about the debt I sat with him really calmly and tried to work through it with him, said it wasn’t the end of the world and offered to help him sort it out. He refused to speak to me and since then has just lied and lied. I genuinely don’t think he is bothered. I know recently he tried to get another payday loan despite everything. On Thursday night he told me I was a “!!!!!! disgrace of a mother” because he hasn’t been to the dentist since he was 15 🤷🏻‍♀️ This is what I am dealing with.

I cannot believe I have tolerated this much and that I am still so worried for him. I cannot understand why he doesn’t want to sort it out and accept help and he sees me as nagging, but this can be easily sorted with a DMP and he can move on. My husband is finding it v v hard watching from the sidelines as he has said he would never have spoken to his Mum like this. I do feel like I’m enabling his behaviour by making excuses for him. I suppose I am scared of asking him to leave incase we never speak again 😪

theoretica

Is your other child younger or older?  Do they need to be protected through this?

Could he move in with Dad, perhaps with a contract about adult behaviour?

Nearlydebtfree

theoretica said:

Is your other child younger or older?  Do they need to be protected through this?

Could he move in with Dad, perhaps with a contract about adult behaviour?

My daughter is older and has left home. She is delightful compared to him! I want to talk to his Dad about him having him as I don’t want him homeless. It would inconvenience him as he would have to travel further for work but I think my head needs a break from him and the post! 

gwynlas

Are there any indicators that here might be a mental health or drug issue behind your sons behaviour? Whilst he might be able to hold it together to attend work how does he function socially?

Nearlydebtfree

gwynlas said:

Are there any indicators that here might be a mental health or drug issue behind your sons behaviour? Whilst he might be able to hold it together to attend work how does he function socially?

Drugs wise - whilst I can’t rule out if he is occasionally taking drugs, I don’t think he has a habit. He was actually with a girl for over a year who was massively anti drugs due to family history. I have spoken to her and she is emphatic that the debt is nothing to do with drugs, but she thinks he has spent on a ridiculous lifestyle he can’t actually afford. Mental health - he split with his girlfriend a few months ago, he was head over heels with her but their separation was also his fault. I have tried to be sympathetic and understanding, but heart ache or not doesn’t excuse his current behaviour I don’t think?

I have suggested he has some counselling as he had a difficult relationship with his Dad when he was younger after our separation and I think it would help him to talk about it, however he is not a talker (like his Dad) and just says he doesn’t need to talk to anyone. 

At work they cannot speak more highly of him, socially he is always busy and has a wide circle of friends - and I suspect he is flash with his cash - at home he is awful?

gwynlas

In that case I think that you would be justified in giving him notice to quit unless his behaviour improves. I know that it is difficult coming up to Christmas which can be an emotional time anyway so your choice whether you leave it until later. Do  try to engage the support of your ex husband and daughter by letting them know what you intend to do and why. You should talk to him calmly and express your own wish for a settled home life without his abuse and if he does not respond appropriately engage tough love and ask him to leave. Do not let this get into an argument with your new partner or your son might start apportioning blame on them. You can pack his bags whilst he is at work if necessary and if he's got sufficient friends and colleagues someone will take him in.