CityFibre and Broadband providers.

Oldman

I am getting totally and utterly lost in the mire of TLAs and FLAs being slapped around when discussing this new fibre connection. Examples are FTTP FTTC. Who knows or cares what the blue blazes these mean? So maybe someone on here can help please? I am 84, spent all my life in the computer connectivity world and am left stone cold trying to understand what and how I must do to use this new system. And who pays for it all.

First. My landline. Yes I know, that labels me as an oldie. But if all else fails, the landline does not need power from a socket to work, doesnt need constantly recharging, and works anywhere in the house without standing on a chair near a window.

So can I keep my landline, if not, what do I need to do, and who will pay for it, in words of small sylables, please.

Next. With Cityfibre, will I need to pay for the broadband provider AND Cityfibre, AND BT, to provide the connection to the exchange. Again simple words please.

If I have to change telephones, who will buy these new phones? Do I have to find, from my meager pension, an additional cost?

I know questions questions, but seriously, there is no simple word explanation to all this.

Thanks for reading

confused.com.elderly.dontgiveaflyingflip.

oldernonethewiser

You can keep a landline until they are replaced in which case you will get a digital line.

Cityfibre provide the fibre but not the broadband service so you pay the service provider not Cityfibre. 

Friend with Virgin for broadband was swapped over from old copper landline to new digital phone at no cost.

400ixl

Your traditional landline comes into your house over a copper cable which is supplied by OpenReach (part of the BT group but separate to BT). OpenReach essentially provide the infrastructure and allow many different providers to run services across the top (BT, Sky, Vodafone, Plusnet, EE etc).

Originally these copper cables ran all the way from the exchange to your street box and then onto your house. Internet over this end to end copper is known as ADSL. As you say, this allowed the phone to continue to work even when there was a local power cut.

Next came an upgrade where they replaced the copper between the exchange and the street box with fibre cables, keeping the copper cables to the house known as FTTC (Fibre to Cabinet). This allowed for faster internet speeds and also means the phone line is still able to operate in a local power cut. See later comment for this phone service ending)

There is now a service which replaces the copper completely, so it goes from the exchange to your house as a single fibre cable with no use of the copper anywhere, known as FTTP (Fibre to Property). This requires the phone line to run over the fibre and you have to connect your phone to the router in your house. The router is a powered device which means that if there is a power cut then the voice line will also be out (there are some routers which have battery backups in them but not many). These phone lines are digital and known as Digital Voice.

There is also another thing to take into consideration. Openreach are also shutting down the phone system exchanges for the old system by the end of 2025, moving all users to digital voice regardless of whether they are on FTTC or FTTP. So at that point regardless of which system you are on you will have to plug your phone into a router and it will not work during a power cut without a local battery backup.

Now onto CityFibre. They are essentially an alternative provider to Openreach, the difference being it is a closed ecosystem. Therefore you get all of your services from one of their providers (usually a much smaller choice but may be cheaper), that includes the infrastructure (cables into your house, router etc), your broadband and your phone number (digital voice). So again this will be a phone which plugs into your router and will not work in a power cut.

The other consideration is if you switch to CityFibre then you will not be on the OpenReach network any more, so you would have to pay a line termination fee when leaving and if you wanted to swap back in the future you would have to pay a new line fee. With engineers having to come and fit new cables etc. You also need to check whether Openreach will allow your number to be ported to CityFibre. They may not which would mean you get a new number.

So, you are either all in with Openreach and pay the provider (BT, Plusnet, EE, Vodafone, Sky etc) for all the services or you are paying a CityFibre provider for all services, you don't mix and match which at least makes that slightly simpler.

On the phone handset side, that is really dependent on the provider. Some will provide a handset, some wont. You may even get a convertor which allow you to plug your existing phone into the route.

Finally, sorry its so complex. Do check that any provider you choose does have a digital voice service if you want a phone line. As an example, Plusnet (part of the BT group) do not offer digital voice so you will not in the future be able to have broadband and a phone line with them in the future (when the old exchanges are switched off).

Hopefully that takes some of the confusion out of it for you.

In summary, your ability to use the old style phones plugged into your master socket will be going away by the end of 2025 latest regardless of you doing something or not. You will be switched to digital voice (if your supplier provides it) which will mean plugging the handset into the router. There are ways to convert your current phone, but probably easier to get a new one with the service. Secondly, it does not make any difference if you go with OpenReach or CityFibre, you get all services from either the supplier on OpenReach network (BT etc) or CityFibre. You will get more choice on OpenReach, but it may be that CityFibre is available for FTTP before openReach upgrades their exchange in your area.

Peter999_2

Hi Oldman,

You don't pay CityFibre anything - the ISP you choose will pay them.   CityFibre use their own network that is a rival for BT.

You can still keep your telephone number with some ISPs through CityFibre.   I know that Vodafone offer you to keep your phone number.   You just plug your normal BT phone into a connection on the router, I've used this for years using TalkTalk through Cityfibre and never had a problem.   You do NOT pay BT at all  -  you only pay your ISP.

You will need power for the router wherever it goes (but no doubt you must already have a powered router anyway).  The router then powers the phone like the BT socket would.    If your broadband goes down then the phone will stop working.

Rob5342

The internet signal has to be converted from a fibre to an electrical cable at some point. With FTTC that was done in a street cabinet, with FTTP it's done in a box in your house.

The phone signal used to come in to the house on it's own cable, soon you will have to plug the phone into your router instead.

If you want a home phone service then you will have to use an ISP that supports that. You'll pay the ISP for the service and they'll pay whoever they use for the interconnection. Whoever you go with you will need a battery backup if you want it to work in a power cut.

A lot of people don't bother with a home phone now and just use their mobiles. A lot of phones can now connect to your router and make calls using that connection if the mobile signal is bad in your area.

badmemory

I have a similar problem to the OP except that as far as I know standing on a chair doesn't work as I had to walk up the street just to send a text the other day.  I have 5 internal phones as we use them as intercoms & they need replacing as they are getting unreliable to charge.  As far as they seem to be saying we are supposed to be going before the end of the year although so far I have heard nothing.  How can I be sure that any new set of phones will even work after the changes?

Robin9

Friend with Virgin for broadband was swapped over from old copper landline to new digital phone at no cost.

I'm being quoted £150+ by one of the new kids on the block    if I want to keep a handset   I've told them to think again.

oldernonethewiser

Robin9 said:

Friend with Virgin for broadband was swapped over from old copper landline to new digital phone at no cost.

I'm being quoted £150+ by one of the new kids on the block    if I want to keep a handset   I've told them to think again.

My word!

That is pricey.

matelodave

badmemory said:

I have a similar problem to the OP except that as far as I know standing on a chair doesn't work as I had to walk up the street just to send a text the other day.  I have 5 internal phones as we use them as intercoms & they need replacing as they are getting unreliable to charge.  As far as they seem to be saying we are supposed to be going before the end of the year although so far I have heard nothing.  How can I be sure that any new set of phones will even work after the changes?

We've had digital voice for over three years (18 months with BT and 20 months with Vodafone). Our 27 year old pushbutton BT Duet 200 phone still works as do our ancient Panasonic DECT phones (including the answering machine and extensions). The only difference is that instead of being plugged into the BT socket on the wall they are now plugged into the back of the router.

Everything works exactly the same as it did except that the old pushbutton phone cant make calls when there's a power cut. The DECT phones never could either. If I was really bothered I'd get a battery back-up for the router

TBH there a lot of rubbish being spouted to wind up the public but in general what you've got will still work but it will need to be connected to the router or adapter rather than the phone socket on the wall. Any hard wired extensions or alarm systems will also need to be connected to the router or adapter. 

Some ISP's have decided not to offer phone services, but many do, BT, Vodafone, SKY, TalkTalk, Zen and will supply either the appropriate router or adapter. Not everyone will get fibre to their houses, in many cases the existing copper wires will still provide their phone or broadband service but the phone will need to be plugged into the router or adapter rather than direct into the phone socket on the wall. 

Cashmygiro

I have FTTC with Zen and I've already been moved over to digital voice. I never use a landline these days so technically I could just get rid of it but my number has been in the family for over 40 years so I wanted to keep it and I don't like the thought of BT recycling it and someone else local ending up with it.

The router Zen supply, which is a Fritz!Box is a beast of a machine, it also has a mobile App where you can phone and receive calls on your digital voice line via your mobile which is cool.

I can't get Openreach FTTP yet but when my street is activated I'll be upgrading to Zen FTTP. 

[Deleted User]

I wouldn't get too caught up on the underlying tech or even network providers. 

Go for whomever gives you the deal you want but be aware that landlines aren't really used in many home setups now and therefore you may have to pay extra for any basic landline type service. 

You can get lots mobile services that uses the mobile network or broadband (Wi-Fi calling) so your issue with coverage is essentially moot.