Cancellation of Direct Debit by NHS Business Services

BarefootinHastings

badmemory said:

My advice would be in future to pay it annually & not by DD even then.  If you time it right you can get 14 lots of 28 days in instead of only 13.  Then not renew for 27 days.

I suspect that what they have done is instead of not taking month 11 & 12 they have actually cancelled it.

Indeed. I know they cancelled it, because they admitted that when I phoned the PPC people up. They said they cancelled the direct debit from their end. 

Surely a company can't just cancel a direct debit and then make some half-hearted attempt to contact you and that be ok? 

The Direct Debit Guarantee says otherwise, so surely the NHS Business services are equally bound by those terms? They can't just make a "mistake" and then not be held accountable for that?

In a twist of irony, they have not responded within the time frame of their own Complaints Policy to my formal complaint (3 business days to acknowledge) and the automated email I got back said that they are taking longer to respond due to "high demand".  So how come it's ok for them to miss acknowledgement of a formal complaint and yet I miss one phone call due to me working (heaven forbid!) and then this all kicks off because of THEIR action... 

Are the Terms and Conditions legally binding? If it is not in the T&C's what is the legality of anything else that NHS BSA say? Can they just "make it up"?

Surely, if a company makes a mistake, then they are accountable for that? 

Alderbank

MalMonroe said:

diinozzo said:

The Nationwide is not a Bank.

That comment is not helpful in any way.

Oh the irony!

born_again

BarefootinHastings said:

badmemory said:

My advice would be in future to pay it annually & not by DD even then.  If you time it right you can get 14 lots of 28 days in instead of only 13.  Then not renew for 27 days.

I suspect that what they have done is instead of not taking month 11 & 12 they have actually cancelled it.

Indeed. I know they cancelled it, because they admitted that when I phoned the PPC people up. They said they cancelled the direct debit from their end. 

Surely a company can't just cancel a direct debit and then make some half-hearted attempt to contact you and that be ok? 

The Direct Debit Guarantee says otherwise, so surely the NHS Business services are equally bound by those terms? They can't just make a "mistake" and then not be held accountable for that?

In a twist of irony, they have not responded within the time frame of their own Complaints Policy to my formal complaint (3 business days to acknowledge) and the automated email I got back said that they are taking longer to respond due to "high demand".  So how come it's ok for them to miss acknowledgement of a formal complaint and yet I miss one phone call due to me working (heaven forbid!) and then this all kicks off because of THEIR action... 

Are the Terms and Conditions legally binding? If it is not in the T&C's what is the legality of anything else that NHS BSA say? Can they just "make it up"?

Surely, if a company makes a mistake, then they are accountable for that? 

DD guarantee only covers payments taken in error, or wrong amounts without notification. It does not cover a error cancelling a DD.
So that is a non starter as a complaint route.

In terms of contact, do they have your correct details? 
Many companies will only try once by each method. 

But did you not notice the DD was not being taken?

BarefootinHastings

In terms of contact, do they have your correct details? 

Many companies will only try once by each method. 

But did you not notice the DD was not being taken?

They have my details insofar as they have sent me letters in the past. I have not given them my email address prior to this and my only phone is my mobile. And as I say, calling someone once during the working day on their mobile is usually pretty useless as I am fully aware of trying to get hold of people in my own work. Especially if no one leaves a message... 

As I say, the direct debit on my bank was showing as an active outgoing in that it was in the list of standing orders and direct debits being paid out. Thus I assumed it was still being taken. I did not check every month that it was going out, if a direct debit is being taken out then I assume it continues to go out until I cancel it.

I would not notice as it's only £10 (roughly) per month, so not large enough that there would be a noticeable hole / gain in my finances. 

born_again

BarefootinHastings said:

In terms of contact, do they have your correct details? 

Many companies will only try once by each method. 

But did you not notice the DD was not being taken?

They have my details insofar as they have sent me letters in the past. I have not given them my email address prior to this and my only phone is my mobile. And as I say, calling someone once during the working day on their mobile is usually pretty useless as I am fully aware of trying to get hold of people in my own work. Especially if no one leaves a message... 

As I say, the direct debit on my bank was showing as an active outgoing in that it was in the list of standing orders and direct debits being paid out. Thus I assumed it was still being taken. I did not check every month that it was going out, if a direct debit is being taken out then I assume it continues to go out until I cancel it.

I would not notice as it's only £10 (roughly) per month, so not large enough that there would be a noticeable hole / gain in my finances. 

A DD will continue till either party cancels it.
But you do need to check that the funds are taken. A DD can be active & no funds taken. 

Noticing no amount taken on the required date would have allowed you to contact them straight away. 
So you really need to check your bank account to make sure ALL payments are correct. 👍

BarefootinHastings

born_again said:

A DD will continue till either party cancels it.
But you do need to check that the funds are taken. A DD can be active & no funds taken. 

Noticing no amount taken on the required date would have allowed you to contact them straight away. 
So you really need to check your bank account to make sure ALL payments are correct. 👍

Surely a company can't just cancel a direct debit though. Otherwise what's the point in the direct debit?

Surely they have to notify you and not just a "one call but we missed you" attempt. 

Yes, noticing that the Direct debit was not being taken would have allowed me to contact them, but then I have no reason to assume it would be cancelled and that the direct debit would stop being taken. 

Who does that responsibility lay with? If I were to cancel the direct debit, I am supposed to notify the company. Why not the other way around? If I were to cancel the direct debit, call them but not get through, could I say "I tried but couldn't get through" and that be ok? 

Are you saying this is a lost cause?

BarefootinHastings

A DD will continue till either party cancels it.
But you do need to check that the funds are taken. A DD can be active & no funds taken. 

Noticing no amount taken on the required date would have allowed you to contact them straight away. 
So you really need to check your bank account to make sure ALL payments are correct. 👍

Could that also not then be ripe for a "scam"? 

1) You take out a direct debit with a company, one that says it automatically renews

2) Then they cancel it with some iffy "we tried contact you" as a get out clause

3) You don't notice because it's a small amount of money per month and you have no reason to suspect they would cancel it behind your back

4) You then only notice when they start sending penalty notices

Is that not a bit underhand?

born_again

I don't know it works from their end or how the NHS pre-payment system works.

All I can say is how the DD system works. 

This is one reason to check your bank statements & any regular payments going out. MSE advice, as you do not then end up paying for things your are not using & also pick up on errors like this. 
Amount does not come into it.

Jumblebumble

badmemory said:

My advice would be in future to pay it annually & not by DD even then.  If you time it right you can get 14 lots of 28 days in instead of only 13.  Then not renew for 27 days.

I suspect that what they have done is instead of not taking month 11 & 12 they have actually cancelled it.

It usede to be the case that 3 monthy and then renewing when you needed new doses  was even better 
Cant be bothered to calculate to see if this is still the case

eskbanker

BarefootinHastings said:

born_again said:

A DD will continue till either party cancels it.
But you do need to check that the funds are taken. A DD can be active & no funds taken. 

Noticing no amount taken on the required date would have allowed you to contact them straight away. 
So you really need to check your bank account to make sure ALL payments are correct. 👍

Surely a company can't just cancel a direct debit though. Otherwise what's the point in the direct debit?

Surely they have to notify you and not just a "one call but we missed you" attempt. 

Yes, noticing that the Direct debit was not being taken would have allowed me to contact them, but then I have no reason to assume it would be cancelled and that the direct debit would stop being taken. 

Who does that responsibility lay with? If I were to cancel the direct debit, I am supposed to notify the company. Why not the other way around? If I were to cancel the direct debit, call them but not get through, could I say "I tried but couldn't get through" and that be ok? 

Are you saying this is a lost cause?

It's unclear to me exactly what you mean by 'cancelling the direct debit' in this thread - the DD process works by having a mandate set up at the bank, and then the authorised company taking payments against that.  Are you saying that the mandate itself has been cancelled (I thought it still showed at your bank) or simply that the company has stopped taking payments against it?