Energy price cap from July 2023 (merged)

superkoopauk

Mstty said:

wrf12345 said:

On standing charges, just to add, because both s/c's and unit rates are capped for the default tariff it is impossible for a company to offer a default tariff that has no standing charges and an increased unit rate even if it meets the monetary cap for the average user. This was down, apparently, to a previous minister rather than Ofgem but could be lifted by the new minister. Not being able to offer a default tariff with no standing charges makes it difficult to gain customer mass (and wrecked Ebico's business model). 

It is lucky for Octopus that they are so large and that many of older companies use their software, otherwise actually "threatening" the status quo would have seen them put out of business by changing the rules (see Ebico again).

As a first step to a customer focused industry, s/c's need to be removed from smart prepayment meters to reflect the huge savings that the industry make from the impossibility of running up a debt on them.

How do utilita offer a tariff with no standing charge then if it's illegal?

https://utilita.co.uk/energy

They use a two tier unit rate system which is effectively a standing charge is disguise (unless you are a very low user).  Think there are slightly different rules for these.

CSI_Yorkshire

superkoopauk said:

Mstty said:

wrf12345 said:

On standing charges, just to add, because both s/c's and unit rates are capped for the default tariff it is impossible for a company to offer a default tariff that has no standing charges and an increased unit rate even if it meets the monetary cap for the average user. This was down, apparently, to a previous minister rather than Ofgem but could be lifted by the new minister. Not being able to offer a default tariff with no standing charges makes it difficult to gain customer mass (and wrecked Ebico's business model). 

It is lucky for Octopus that they are so large and that many of older companies use their software, otherwise actually "threatening" the status quo would have seen them put out of business by changing the rules (see Ebico again).

As a first step to a customer focused industry, s/c's need to be removed from smart prepayment meters to reflect the huge savings that the industry make from the impossibility of running up a debt on them.

How do utilita offer a tariff with no standing charge then if it's illegal?

They use a two tier unit rate system which is effectively a standing charge is disguise (unless you are a very low user).  Think there are slightly different rules for these.

No different rules.  The rule is that your bill for any number of units must be under the line that goes through the nil cap and the 3100kWh cap.  Which the Utilita tariff is.

The other style of nil-SC tariff was that every unit was very slightly more expensive.  This type would be over the cap at high usage and is therefore not allowed.

strawb_shortcake

We do come under Midlands, which seemed very odd. But had I have stopped and thought about it, it makes perfect sense as I remember going to the MEB shop with my Mum to pay the electric bill years ago

MSE_James

Just a quick note to say our price cap calculator now also includes prepayment rates:

https://www.moneysavingexpert.com/utilities/what-are-the-price-cap-unit-rates-/#epgcalculator 

poppellerant

This isn't for me, but for somebody else.  Can somebody tell me what the prices might be for economy 7 customers?

Mstty

poppellerant said:

This isn't for me, but for somebody else.  Can somebody tell me what the prices might be for economy 7 customers?

Last price cap change I think they were published a couple of weeks before. So mid June? These are down to the suppliers not Ofgem so when they like essentially

Swipe

poppellerant said:

This isn't for me, but for somebody else.  Can somebody tell me what the prices might be for economy 7 customers?

I could be wrong but I'm not expecting any more than 2p reduction off current day rate and 0.5p off night rate. Anything extra is a bonus.

CSI_Yorkshire

Swipe said:

poppellerant said:

This isn't for me, but for somebody else.  Can somebody tell me what the prices might be for economy 7 customers?

I could be wrong but I'm not expecting any more than 2p reduction off current day rate and 0.5p off night rate. Anything extra is a bonus.

Many people expect a reduction in day rate and an increase in night rate - moving away from the extremely low off-peak pricing that was possibly a hallmark of the EPG/E7 interaction.

Swipe

CSI_Yorkshire said:

Swipe said:

poppellerant said:

This isn't for me, but for somebody else.  Can somebody tell me what the prices might be for economy 7 customers?

I could be wrong but I'm not expecting any more than 2p reduction off current day rate and 0.5p off night rate. Anything extra is a bonus.

Many people expect a reduction in day rate and an increase in night rate - moving away from the extremely low off-peak pricing that was possibly a hallmark of the EPG/E7 interaction.

I don't consider 16p night rate to be extremely low when some other regions are getting as low as 8p

TheElectricCow

poppellerant said:

This isn't for me, but for somebody else.  Can somebody tell me what the prices might be for economy 7 customers?

Nobody really knows at the moment until suppliers are ready to start publishing their individual rates.

While reasonably accurate predictions can be made for capped single rate tariffs, suppliers do have some room to vary E7 day/night rates as long as the figures don’t exceed the capped rates, so the prices for each different supplier will be different. There may also be more regional variations too e.g. under the current prices EDF offers extremely cheap night rates in one specific region (with a very high day rate) but there’s no guarantee they’ll continue with that come July.