Claiming PIP with a good job

leeloolee

I've recently(ish) realised I'm probably eligible to claim PIP, but feel as if there's an ethical dilemma with doing so, given that I earn a fairly decent, but not spectacular, salary (56K basic in London, plus a small bonus of another few grand) and recently bought a flat.

The issue I have is that my mental and physical illnesses impact my life to the extent that work is pretty much often the *only* thing I can manage. I'm unable to hold down a relationship, with the financial impact that entails (i.e. having to pay all my living costs alone). I'm often so burnt out from work (I have diagnosed ADHD and autism) that I don't have the energy to do things like shop, meal plan, cook or wash up. My strategies to get around this, such as having bought a dishwasher and resorting to takeaways a couple of times a week, are really expensive. I have fatigue from physical illnesses that often means being forced to take expensive taxis and Ubers rather than walking/public transport, and my ADHD means I'm unable to drive. I'm so used to my illnesses and disabilities costing me loads of money that I've just accepted it as normal, but a friend has told me that no, it's really not OK to be working full time in a skilled role, making a decent salary, and be unable to enjoy life because all my disposable income goes on stuff I need to survive. 

Given all the stories of 'benefit fraud investigations' and the like, I'm basically terrified that I'll be accused of fraud, especially given that I have a good job. Is this a thing or am I worrying needlessly? My health has been so poor over the past year that I've been having multiple medical appointments a week at times, various hospital referrals, and I'm under the care of a psychiatrist for my ADHD and the anxiety and depression arising from it. I outwardly appear like a successful person, but my personal life is a complete mess, and I spend so much energy on basic survival. Having an extra few hundred pounds a month would make the world of difference to me, and would mean I could do things like have proper physiotherapy and psychotherapy, without having to give up every single possible luxury in life. I just have this constant worry that someone will be waiting outside my flat to catch me doing something like getting a taxi to the airport for the odd holiday, or going to my gym (I go to a luxury one because my autism means I can't handle crowded spaces) and I'll end up on the front of the Daily Mail.

Spoonie_Turtle

There is no ethical or moral dilemma, if you meet the PIP descriptors then you can claim.  It is based on help you need, even if you don't get that help.

There's a long read here https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/personal-independence-payment-assessment-guide-for-assessment-providers/pip-assessment-guide-part-2-the-assessment-criteria

Less detailed advice but a decent overview https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/benefits/sick-or-disabled-people-and-carers/pip/help-with-your-claim/how-decisions-are-made/
https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/benefits/sick-or-disabled-people-and-carers/pip/help-with-your-claim/fill-in-form-pip/

Decent guide here as well https://www.disabilityrightsuk.org/resources/personal-independence-payment#Download

You do have to tailor your answers to exactly what the activities assess, and explain how and why your different symptoms/issues affect the activities.  Write as if the assessor has zero knowledge of your conditions - because realistically, they probably either know nothing, or what they think they know is likely to be a very superficial and/or inaccurate view and don't know or understand the nuances of just how much of an impact they can have.

There is also this https://www.socialsecurity.gov.scot/guidance-resources/guidance/decision-making-guide
It is for the Scottish Disability Payment but it is assessed in exactly the same way as PIP with the same descriptors, gives more detailed examples, and might be easier for reference when thinking about what you would need to include/explain for each activity.

If you're needing to use taxis/Uber instead of public transport because of your physical disability, there is Access to Work which can help towards travelling to and from work.

Edit: also this, it's geared towards mental illness but a lot of the principles apply to the cognitive effects (e.g. executive dysfunction) of autism and ADHD.
https://www.mentalhealthandmoneyadvice.org/en/welfare-benefits/pip-mental-health-guide/help-with-your-pip-claim/how-to-fill-in-the-pip-form/

elsien

It’s not means tested. Which means that the government decided that it is absolutely fine for someone to claim it if they need it regardless of income.

 There is no element of fraud or ethical dilemma in there at all.
Go ahead and make a claim, with a clear conscience. 

And when you qualify it is completely up to you what and how you spend it on. 

sarahlply

I agree with everyone, if you need help then is worth trying, it’s not about the job you do.
plus it can open doors to allow your employer to support you better such as more flexible working or time for essential appointments, I found it opened doors for me in civil service and also the employer apply for help with equipment, criteria might be stricter now for grants but worth researching as could potentially help in so many ways.

leeloolee

sarahlply said:

I agree with everyone, if you need help then is worth trying, it’s not about the job you do.
plus it can open doors to allow your employer to support you better such as more flexible working or time for essential appointments, I found it opened doors for me in civil service and also the employer apply for help with equipment, criteria might be stricter now for grants but worth researching as could potentially help in so many ways.

I'm actually a civil servant, and I have a number of adjustments in place to help me hold down the job, for example, flexible working hours, special seating arrangements, and time off for appointments. Prior to this (I was only diagnosed a few years ago), I could not hold down a job for longer than a few months because I'd have meltdowns having to travel during rush hour or sit in a busy office. I've lived most of my life in poverty because I had no idea I was entitled to any help. I just accepted that I would have to earn minimum wage forever despite a first class degree and a Master's. I thought I was just failing at life and I couldn't understand why everything seemed so hard. 

The replies have helped me feel much better...now just the challenge of trying to convince the assessor that I really do have these disabilities! I'm sure my high level of education and good job will count against me, as will being well spoken and articulate, but I really do have significant challenges. It sounds like most of them are very ignorant about autism and ADHD in particular, so it might be a hard road ahead. 

sarahlply

leeloolee said:

sarahlply said:

I agree with everyone, if you need help then is worth trying, it’s not about the job you do.
plus it can open doors to allow your employer to support you better such as more flexible working or time for essential appointments, I found it opened doors for me in civil service and also the employer apply for help with equipment, criteria might be stricter now for grants but worth researching as could potentially help in so many ways.

I'm actually a civil servant, and I have a number of adjustments in place to help me hold down the job, for example, flexible working hours, special seating arrangements, and time off for appointments. Prior to this (I was only diagnosed a few years ago), I could not hold down a job for longer than a few months because I'd have meltdowns having to travel during rush hour or sit in a busy office. I've lived most of my life in poverty because I had no idea I was entitled to any help. I just accepted that I would have to earn minimum wage forever despite a first class degree and a Master's. I thought I was just failing at life and I couldn't understand why everything seemed so hard. 

The replies have helped me feel much better...now just the challenge of trying to convince the assessor that I really do have these disabilities! I'm sure my high level of education and good job will count against me, as will being well spoken and articulate, but I really do have significant challenges. It sounds like most of them are very ignorant about autism and ADHD in particular, so it might be a hard road ahead. 

You deserve help just as much as anyone, I wasn’t allowed my adjustments until pip went through, had help them from access to work.
given what your struggling with I would get a specialist charity involved or at least check if they have guides online on evidence to provide. I had a number of professional colleagues who I worked with on good incomes getting help with pip, mainly so as to get access to adaptations or to get help with an adapted car.
have you had an assessment at work for equipment or adjustments? If so get copies for your application, request copies of your medical records before you even ring pip as they can take a while to come back, I found physiotherapy and occupational therapy reports helped a lot and specialist assessments that mentioned my struggles as I have ptsd from domestic abuse so like you have meltdown or flashbacks at times.
please take care and happy to answer questions or try at least and remember keep copies of everything you send them and if you have a phone or i person assessment then ask them to record it well ahead of time so you have cover if no one is supporting you at the assessment (I did both for mine as they missed my request to record so I had a witness ready).

sarahlply

Also access to work scheme used to help with partial funding of taxi transport, their assessment for help used to be faster and you could be granted help for some of your taxi fare and then be able to claim a agreed number of trips a week, your manager had to sign off you had attended work that day, definitely check if you can still apply.

elsien

This may help.
https://www.mentalhealthandmoneyadvice.org/en/welfare-benefits/pip-mental-health-guide/

Muttleythefrog

Agree with all above advice. PIP is a gesture of the state to the idea that in day to day basic life disabled people can incur extra expenses to put themselves on equalised footing with non disabled. And actually there's no need to give examples by me... you've done that yourself in your post... you incur extra costs. So morally you absolutely are entitled to claim as while those costs won't be as such assessed they flag up some of your life features are actually what a non means tested disability benefit is for. It then comes down to the technical.... qualifying for PIP... look at the activities and descriptors... do some reading up and see if you should qualify. If you think you can... it can be a long slog but it may well be worth it. 

Your job is only relevant in the sense it could provide evidence as to your disablements or lack thereof. For example if your job happened to be as a tour guide then you might have difficulty to convince an assessor or the DWP Decision Maker that you struggle with planning and executing an outdoor trip...silly example but you get my drift.

Fraud? Only really a risk if you lie about your problems or fail to report them relevantly changing after an award. A much bigger concern is getting an award that is correct which is a much bigger scandal genuine claimants face - many have to pursue an entitlement through reconsiderations and appeal. The real fraud in regard to PIP lies with DWP DMs and assessors who are taking money to do a job they often do not do (properly).

leeloolee

sarahlply said:

leeloolee said:

sarahlply said:

I agree with everyone, if you need help then is worth trying, it’s not about the job you do.
plus it can open doors to allow your employer to support you better such as more flexible working or time for essential appointments, I found it opened doors for me in civil service and also the employer apply for help with equipment, criteria might be stricter now for grants but worth researching as could potentially help in so many ways.

I'm actually a civil servant, and I have a number of adjustments in place to help me hold down the job, for example, flexible working hours, special seating arrangements, and time off for appointments. Prior to this (I was only diagnosed a few years ago), I could not hold down a job for longer than a few months because I'd have meltdowns having to travel during rush hour or sit in a busy office. I've lived most of my life in poverty because I had no idea I was entitled to any help. I just accepted that I would have to earn minimum wage forever despite a first class degree and a Master's. I thought I was just failing at life and I couldn't understand why everything seemed so hard. 

The replies have helped me feel much better...now just the challenge of trying to convince the assessor that I really do have these disabilities! I'm sure my high level of education and good job will count against me, as will being well spoken and articulate, but I really do have significant challenges. It sounds like most of them are very ignorant about autism and ADHD in particular, so it might be a hard road ahead. 

You deserve help just as much as anyone, I wasn’t allowed my adjustments until pip went through, had help them from access to work.
given what your struggling with I would get a specialist charity involved or at least check if they have guides online on evidence to provide. I had a number of professional colleagues who I worked with on good incomes getting help with pip, mainly so as to get access to adaptations or to get help with an adapted car.
have you had an assessment at work for equipment or adjustments? If so get copies for your application, request copies of your medical records before you even ring pip as they can take a while to come back, I found physiotherapy and occupational therapy reports helped a lot and specialist assessments that mentioned my struggles as I have ptsd from domestic abuse so like you have meltdown or flashbacks at times.
please take care and happy to answer questions or try at least and remember keep copies of everything you send them and if you have a phone or i person assessment then ask them to record it well ahead of time so you have cover if no one is supporting you at the assessment (I did both for mine as they missed my request to record so I had a witness ready).

Yes, I have a number of adjustments through work which were done through occupational health. Alongside the autism and ADHD, I also have physical issues, so I have a special chair, and my desk is set up in a quiet area of the office because I can't deal with noise and chaos. I really would benefit from a physio/personal trainer, but I can't afford one. I am a member of a gym with a pool, as swimming helps with the physical issues, but it's so expensive. PIP wouldn't cover all the things I need relating to my disabilities, but it would really help. 

I will look into getting a charity involved, as I think I'm really going to struggle with the interview. I have a lot of trouble understanding why people are asking certain questions, and I often answer very literally. Even in my ADHD assessment, I ended up having it recorded that I was a smoker because I said I'd literally tried smoking once as a teenager...I didn't realise most neurotypical people would have just answered no. 

I actually didn't realise you could do phone interviews - one of the reasons I've put this off is I thought they came round to your house, and I have severe anxiety around Covid, particularly after catching it and being left with Long Covid symptoms. I haven't had anyone except my parents round in over three years. 

leeloolee

Muttleythefrog said:

Agree with all above advice. PIP is a gesture of the state to the idea that in day to day basic life disabled people can incur extra expenses to put themselves on equalised footing with non disabled. And actually there's no need to give examples by me... you've done that yourself in your post... you incur extra costs. So morally you absolutely are entitled to claim as while those costs won't be as such assessed they flag up some of your life features are actually what a non means tested disability benefit is for. It then comes down to the technical.... qualifying for PIP... look at the activities and descriptors... do some reading up and see if you should qualify. If you think you can... it can be a long slog but it may well be worth it. 

Your job is only relevant in the sense it could provide evidence as to your disablements or lack thereof. For example if your job happened to be as a tour guide then you might have difficulty to convince an assessor or the DWP Decision Maker that you struggle with planning and executing an outdoor trip...silly example but you get my drift.

Fraud? Only really a risk if you lie about your problems or fail to report them relevantly changing after an award. A much bigger concern is getting an award that is correct which is a much bigger scandal genuine claimants face - many have to pursue an entitlement through reconsiderations and appeal. The real fraud in regard to PIP lies with DWP DMs and assessors who are taking money to do a job they often do not do (properly).

Also, I find the whole fraud idea really nerve racking... how do they investigate whether your circumstances have changed? I can't see how mine ever will, given that autism and ADHD aren't ever going to go away, and seem to get harder and harder to deal with the older I get.