Building work & neighbours roof... Please be kind 😔

ThisIsWeird

funkyfifi said:

So I had to check my insurance, as everything was done in a big emotional hurry when we moved onto. Mum's house, and no...... I don't have legal cover..... 

Ok, that's a shame, but not the end of the world. Time, I suspect, to resort to some mantras - simple statements of fact and reason - that you can use when dealing with them. Stick with them, and don't be drawn into any arguments over details such as what may be wrong with the roof, how old the roof may be, the condition it is in, what anyone may have said about cowboy builders, or anything like that - that can become a minefield, and will only become relevant should this escalate (eg if they are daft enough to try and take legal action - if they do, then all the evidence you have will show them up badly). If you are dealing with irrational, unreasonable, and even dishonest folk, then trying to discuss 'detail' about what the previous or current state of the roof might be, will be fraught; you'll often get lines like "Are you saying we are making it up?!" "Are you saying our roof is rotten?!" "Are you saying we used a cowboy?!" :-). Nutty stuff, that is designed to put you on the back foot, and having to answer them. Ignore all that, and bring it back to the simple case of 'we agreed to put right any damage we might cause. We caused no damage. End of'. And a method of recording the exchanges, whether done verbally or in 'print' (message, email, letter, whatevs) would be useful. Especially if they do 'rant'.

Try not to be intimidated by them - they cannot 'do' anything to you other than rant. And if they do rant, it'll ultimately count against them. And you are also entitled to just say, "Do you realise you are raising your voice? (Wait for response). I am not going to discuss this when you are speaking in that manner", and walk away. That's one 'mantra'!

Others are, "We agreed we'd put right any damage caused by our works, so photos were taken, and we both signed this - yes?" (Try and put things in the form of Q's so they have to respond to your points). "Ok, both my builder and I have checked the roof, and we find no signs at all of any damage caused by our works." "The condition of the roof is unchanged from when we started our work". "We are therefore not liable for anything". 

Let him rant. And repeat any of these comments above as often as needed! Always calm and reasonably.

Then you may need, "This is getting us nowhere. If you truly believe that we damaged your roof, you need to show evidence of this. We believe we have good evidence to show the roof's condition did not change during our work."

And you may need to just walk away. 

If you see them, or what may appear to be another cowboy builder up on their roof, note down as best you can what they are doing - take photos if needed.

And, if you are struggling to understand what the neighbour is saying due to their level of English or a strong accent (or both), then there is absolutely nothing wrong in saying so, and asking them to repeat it - or to fetch someone else.

But stick to the mantras :-)

Don't let your dad get into 'discussions' or arguments over the roof's previous condition, either. This is ALL about whether you (your builder) caused any damage during your works. Keep it simple.

This is my suggestion, of course - you need to agree with it and be happy to carry it out.

ThisIsWeird

Oh, and add LP whoever you can.

Although they won't act on your behalf on retrospective cases, I think they may still be happy to give verbal advice - you will be talking directly to someone who should be a legal expert.

macman

Why didn't your 'good' builder ensure that you had served a PWN, and that a schedule of condition was drawn up, which would have saved you from any later spurious claim for damages?
This would also have protected him from any ensuing claim by you for damage caused to the neighbouring property, so very much in his interests.

ThisIsWeird

macman said:

Why didn't your 'good' builder ensure that you had served a PWN, and that a schedule of condition was drawn up, which would have saved you from any later spurious claim for damages?
This would also have protected him from any ensuing claim by you for damage caused to the neighbouring property, so very much in his interests.

Seems as tho' it could have been useful, but that bird has flown.

DougMLancs

I really sympathise with your situation @funkyfifi - my wife and I had to go through something very similar a few years ago and we know how stressful and exhausting it is! It turned out be all rant and no evidence on their part in our case- they were just trying it on with DIY pseudo legal claims. some great advice here though- I wish I had found this forum back then. 

FreeBear

funkyfifi said: So I had to check my insurance, as everything was done in a big emotional hurry when we moved onto. Mum's house, and no...... I don't have legal cover..... 

In a union ?

They often have a legal advice helpline. Whilst they probably wouldn't be able to represent you in the (unlikely) case of court action for free, they should be able to provide help & advice on your position.

funkyfifi

DougMLancs said:

I really sympathise with your situation @funkyfifi - my wife and I had to go through something very similar a few years ago and we know how stressful and exhausting it is! It turned out be all rant and no evidence on their part in our case- they were just trying it on with DIY pseudo legal claims. some great advice here though- I wish I had found this forum back then. 

Thank you so much.... I've just come out of work to a barrage of messages from her & I'm now parked up in the Co-op car park because I don't even want to go home. I didn't mention before, but I have Ptsd which is very much conflict based so this is literally tipping me over the edge. 
I'll give it 20 minutes or so and bite the bullet and see what's going on. Really appreciate your message and hope things are less stressful for you now xxxx

funkyfifi

FreeBear said:

funkyfifi said: So I had to check my insurance, as everything was done in a big emotional hurry when we moved onto. Mum's house, and no...... I don't have legal cover..... 

In a union ?

They often have a legal advice helpline. Whilst they probably wouldn't be able to represent you in the (unlikely) case of court action for free, they should be able to provide help & advice on your position.

I'm not sadly no...... 

ThisIsWeird

funkyfifi said:

DougMLancs said:

I really sympathise with your situation @funkyfifi - my wife and I had to go through something very similar a few years ago and we know how stressful and exhausting it is! It turned out be all rant and no evidence on their part in our case- they were just trying it on with DIY pseudo legal claims. some great advice here though- I wish I had found this forum back then. 

Thank you so much.... I've just come out of work to a barrage of messages from her & I'm now parked up in the Co-op car park because I don't even want to go home. I didn't mention before, but I have Ptsd which is very much conflict based so this is literally tipping me over the edge. 
I'll give it 20 minutes or so and bite the bullet and see what's going on. Really appreciate your message and hope things are less stressful for you now xxxx

What is the content of these messages? Are they 'reasonable', but just annoying by their quantity?

If unreasonable, then they may constitute harassment - that is their purpose, to emotionally force you into acting.

What form are they in - phone call, text, what? Either way, keep them - 'it may be used in evidence'...

Can I urge you to just respond with one of my 'matter of fact' comments; 'We agreed, now't happened, there is no case. If you disagree, you need to provide evidence.. ' 

If they keep on phoning, block their number or, if the content is 'harassing', call the local police (not 999, of course). The police will tell them to stop harranging you, and to sort it out legally, if they really believe that have a case. They either take action - which they will almost certainly lose, or they'll know the game is up. If they carry on contacting you, by message or verbally, you call the police again. They'll soon stop 

Mantra mantra mantra. 

funkyfifi

ThisIsWeird said:

funkyfifi said:

DougMLancs said:

I really sympathise with your situation @funkyfifi - my wife and I had to go through something very similar a few years ago and we know how stressful and exhausting it is! It turned out be all rant and no evidence on their part in our case- they were just trying it on with DIY pseudo legal claims. some great advice here though- I wish I had found this forum back then. 

Thank you so much.... I've just come out of work to a barrage of messages from her & I'm now parked up in the Co-op car park because I don't even want to go home. I didn't mention before, but I have Ptsd which is very much conflict based so this is literally tipping me over the edge. 
I'll give it 20 minutes or so and bite the bullet and see what's going on. Really appreciate your message and hope things are less stressful for you now xxxx

What is the content of these messages? Are they 'reasonable', but just annoying by their quantity?

If unreasonable, then they may constitute harassment - that is their purpose, to emotionally force you into acting.

What form are they in - phone call, text, what? Either way, keep them - 'it may be used in evidence'...

Can I urge you to just respond with one of my 'matter of fact' comments; 'We agreed, now't happened, there is no case. If you disagree, you need to provide evidence.. ' 

If they keep on phoning, block their number or, if the content is 'harassing', call the local police (not 999, of course). The police will tell them to stop harranging you, and to sort it out legally, if they really believe that have a case. They either take action - which they will almost certainly lose, or they'll know the game is up. If they carry on contacting you, by message or verbally, you call the police again. They'll soon stop 

Mantra mantra mantra. 

I want to say honestly, you've been an actual star with those words from your previous post.... Thank you so much..... I left the car park, went home. The Husband had stormed through my garage and been ranting at the builder & made a racist comment to his mixed race son who is his labourer. My anger about this, combined with your mantra words and the other support on my thread gave me the confidence to go to knock on her door with my Dad xxxx
It wasn't friendly by any means, but I told them straight away that if anyone raised their voice at me then the conversation stops immediately. Told her not to WhatsApp me any more, and to deal with Dad directly. And left having said basically that we have evidence to support the fact that the roof condition is unchanged.....and that if they have any ACTUAL evidence to the contrary then I will of course repair it as agreed. 
They kept asking over and over..... Are you repairing yes or no, tell us now & saying how rude the builder was to them, but we stayed firm and calm. 
I don't doubt that this isnt the last we'll hear about it all from them, but I definitely feel lots better about being in my house already....
Thank you honestly so much to all of you. I wouldn't have had the confidence to do today without your support