Private PCN on street - advice needed for grounds of appeal

rp112

Hi 

I recently received a PCN in the post from civil enforcement, i parked on the street, in a similar position to where the white tesla is in the pictures attached. My PCN doesn't include a picture of my car, hence there isn't any evidence presented at present.

I visited a nearby restaurant in the evening and i assumed that the street wouldn't be part of the which is actually chained up after closing times. Also, this was after the store was closed and this side street (one way) has to be accessible to the public as we need to turn right on it

I've included pictures of the sign below. 

Wanted advice on grounds of appeal, i was thinking the below:

- Landover authority (i would assume the council owns the street and is responsible for the upkeep)
- Poor signage (not exactly legible from a distance, some signs have graffiti and i can't tell if it's in operation 24 hours a day)
- Site not defined.
- No photographic evidence of alleged offence clearly showing my car

Any help is much appreciated, 

Many thanks

Ditzy_Mitzy

Your first port of call is probably going to be finding out who owns the land.  VB & Sons may well own the building and rear yard - one assumes there is another car park at the back - but everything forward of the shop itself, pavement and pull-in, looks suspiciously like the highway to me.  I don't believe that private parking companies have any jurisdiction on the public highway.  

Coupon-mad

I'd suggest that's a private unadopted road. Think we've seen it before, where is it?

Is the PCN a POFA compliant one or not (NEWBIES thread tells you what to look for).

That graffiti-covered sign is great POPLA evidence!

rp112

So the VB&sons is located on Kenton Road, A4006.

Below is a map I found circulating on Facebook, and it appears the road is adopted by the council however, there was someone who posted a comment saying its outdated and that the land is now owed by VB&sons which complicate things.

@Coupon-mad i've chcked the thread and noted this
Some firms (e.g. Civil Enforcement, Highview, Smart Parking, CP Plus and some small PPCs) don't even bother with POFA 2012 wording so the keeper is not liable and you must you point that out to POPLA.

Note, my PCN doesn't have the POPLA code on it. I've included the T&Cs from my PCN and attached pdf here.

Le_Kirk

You will receive a POPLA code after you have appealed and when it is rejected by the PPC.

Coupon-mad

No NTK has a POPLA Code.

CEL usually now (but not always) do have the 9(2)f wording in their NTK; it is either there or it's not. On the back, usually, if the POFA 9(2)f 'warning' wording is there that's where CEL hide it.

Mouse007

The date on that Highways Adoption Status map is 2021, that's quite recent. I think you should try and obtain the land registry entry for perhaps both these (as close as I could get)

2 results found

• Land at the junction of Kenton Road and Honeypot lane

• part of 584 Garage, Kingsbury Circle, Kingsbury

Mouse007

rp112 said:

... there was someone who posted a comment saying its outdated and that the land is now owed by VB&sons which complicate things.

If Harrow Council had sold the strip of land to VB & Sons I would expect a decision to have been made to do so. No such decision is recorded here.

Mouse007

BINGO

https://consult.harrow.gov.uk/connect.ti/kentonroadparkingreview/consultationHome

How about this then? Why would Harrow Council be running a public consultation on parking on private land? They wouldn't. I say that is still adopted.

Mouse007

Move forward to the minutes July 2022 Traffic and Road Safety Advisory Panel here

https://moderngov.harrow.gov.uk/ieListDocuments.aspx?CId=260&MId=65392&Ver=4

Go down to 11. Parking Programme 2022-23

See middle of page 2 of Appendix B

Kenton Road – service road between 704-738, Kenton East

Following the informal consultation, the results showed support for the introduction of parking controls in the service road in the form of pay and display and shared use bays. The results were reported to the members and the PH who agreed for the scheme to proceed to legal notification (statutory consultation) which will be carried out following the decision on cashless parking. The proposed measures will prevent long term stagnant/commuter parking in the service road. Undertake surveys, statutory certification, and implementation.

And then 9 November 2022:

https://moderngov.harrow.gov.uk/ieListDocuments.aspx?CId=260&MId=65630&Ver=4

Go down to 8. Traffic Schemes and Parking Schemes Programme 2022/23 Update

Look at Appendix C, page 2.

You have been ticketed by Civil Enforcement on land belonging to Harrow Council. Tell them to get lost in French.

Boat_to_Bolivia

'Good grief' @Mouse007, fabulous effort