Smart Meters : E-On sneaky new “end of meter life” tactic

[Deleted User]

EssexHebridean said:

I'm faintly horrified at the idea that anyone could even consider encouraging  putting someone described as "elderly and confused" into a situation where a warrant of entry is gained for the replacement of a meter...

The supplier cannot reasonably know the personal situation of each of its customers. Whether or not the consumer is young or old, the supplier is legally obliged to fit a certified and working meter. No supplier is going to knock on the door with a Warrant of Entry until it has exhausted all the communication avenues open to it. FWiW, the lady in question does seem to have an advocate that she trusts.

Even if the supplier agreed to fit a standard meter then, for gas, it still has an obligation to carry out a post installation safety check of appliances etc.

Money_Mad

Why don’t they want a smart meter? I don’t understand why people kick up such a fuss about them

[Deleted User]

GingerTim said:

In the current scenario the meter is outside the property, so the energy company can do what they want.

The property is hers - they can't do what they want to other people's property. Or at least - I'd be surprised if they can.

I accept they have a right to fit any kind of meter they choose if you want to be able to buy energy from them. But if you don't want their energy I doubt they have a legal right to install their equipment on your property without their permission. They can of course remove or disable the old one...at their own expence.

I'm not arguing the above IS the case, but I would think it is. I sure as hell would kick up a fuss if someone modified my property without my consent. 

Headscratcher14

EssexHebridean said:

...... why is she so reluctant? Have you tried to set her mind at rest, and explained all the potential benefits (including the possibility of reduced bills via TOU tariffs, as time goes on?)

We have discussed this, and she still does not want one, after reading the problems reported by people who have had them fitted and the fact that they are still not mandatory according to MSE and Ofgem.

Deleted_User said:

Keeping in mind what the poster above has said - she's safe until they get that warrant of entry. She can safely bin the letters and leave them to do the leg work. That should put her to the end of their list? I suspect there are a LOT more people refusing these meters than they're letting on. 

Thanks - I'll pass this on.

FreeBear said:

Headscratcher14 said: I’ve been asked by an elderly and confused contact of mine to look into the meaning of a letter she received recently from E-On, headed “Your electric meter has reached the end of its life – we need to replace it with a new one.  (It’s free!)”.  There is no indication in the letter as to how they have decided it is at the end of its life.

All meters are calibrated and certified for installation in to a home or business. The certification lasts for (I believe) 25 years. After this time, the energy supplier is obliged to either get the meter checked and certified again or replace it with a new one. As they won't want to mess around getting the old meter removed, checked, and then reinstalled, you get a new one.

It is the BEIS and OFGEM that mandate that the meters need to be replaced. The customer has no say in the matter.

I don't think she would have a problem with them coming and checking the meter and re-certified it but, as you suspect, they may not want to do that.   I can't see her allowing them to come unless they put in writing that they would either re-certify it or supply a non-smart meter.

As far as "the customer has no say in the matter", surely that goes against the OFGEM saying that they do, and can refuse to have a smart meter?

Dolor said:

 

Some suppliers will agree to fit a traditional meter if they still have stock; however, ….


Read more at: https://www.smartme.co.uk/customer-rights.html © SmartMe.co.uk

Thanks - I may suggest that she contacts them an asks for a traditional meter (although I doubt she'd have any luck as they are all under pressure to fit smart ones.   I'll not be passing on details from this site you quote, as I've no idea who is behind it, despite looking at it.  I suspect its very pro-smart meters and hardly an independant reference point.

[Deleted User]

I'm not arguing the above IS the case, but I would think it is. I sure as hell would kick up a fuss if someone modified my property without my consent. 

Energy suppliers don’t need the homeowner’s approval to make changes to the metering equipment that they own. Opening two meter box doors to remove and fit two meters is hardly a modification to a property which requires the homeowner’s formal consent. 

I will concede that fitting an isolation switch between the electric smart meter and the consumer box is a debatable point; however, as it makes it easier for the homeowner to replace such things as the consumer box without pulling the main fuse why would anybody want to say no.

EssexHebridean

Dolor said:

EssexHebridean said:

I'm faintly horrified at the idea that anyone could even consider encouraging  putting someone described as "elderly and confused" into a situation where a warrant of entry is gained for the replacement of a meter...

The supplier cannot reasonably know the personal situation of each of its customers. Whether or not the consumer is young or old, the supplier is legally obliged to fit a certified and working meter. No supplier is going to knock on the door with a Warrant of Entry until it has exhausted all the communication avenues open to it. FWiW, the lady in question does seem to have an advocate that she trusts.

Even if the supplier agreed to fit a standard meter then, for gas, it still has an obligation to carry out a post installation safety check of appliances etc.

Yes  I completely appreciate that, however it was more the fact that there seems to be a determination from one poster here in particular to encourage that advocate in the direction of holding out for the warrant of entry that concerned me. Even the process leading to that would be incredibly distressing to someone in the OP's friend's position. There are some red flags flying around here today! 

Actually @Headscratcher14 - one point that occurs to me - have you checked if the lady concerned is on the priority services register? She should be by the sound of it, but if nobody has previously thought to check, as Dolor rightly says, the energy company won't have put that in place. 

GingerTim said:

In the current scenario the meter is outside the property, so the energy company can do what they want.

Possibly depends on exactly where it is. If it is mounted on a wall directly onto the street, then yes, this would likely be the case. If it's in a garden area though it wouldn't be that clear cut as they would still have to "access the property"? 

EssexHebridean

Dolor said:

I'm not arguing the above IS the case, but I would think it is. I sure as hell would kick up a fuss if someone modified my property without my consent. 

Energy suppliers don’t need the homeowner’s approval to make changes to the metering equipment that they own. Opening two meter box doors to remove and fit two meters is hardly a modification to a property which requires the homeowner’s formal consent. 

I will concede that fitting an isolation switch between the electric smart meter and the consumer box is a debatable point; however, as it makes it easier for the homeowner to replace such things as the consumer box without pulling the main fuse why would anybody want to say no.

Of course it does stand that they DO need access to the property to do the gas meter do they not? I understood that there was an obligation there to ensure that all gas appliances were safe prior to the job being completed? 

Astria

Deleted_User said:

GingerTim said:

In the current scenario the meter is outside the property, so the energy company can do what they want.

The property is hers - they can't do what they want to other people's property. Or at least - I'd be surprised if they can.

I accept they have a right to fit any kind of meter they choose if you want to be able to buy energy from them. But if you don't want their energy I doubt they have a legal right to install their equipment on your property without their permission. They can of course remove or disable the old one...at their own expence.

I'm not arguing the above IS the case, but I would think it is. I sure as hell would kick up a fuss if someone modified my property without my consent. 

They have a legal right of entry for access to their equipment as long as they have given you plenty of notice, which includes visits to your property to request access if you don't respond to them via other means. If you reject the installation of a new meter then you can have the pipe capped instead (which may incur a charge), but you can't keep the old meter forever. This only applies where you own the property. You have far less rights if you rent - if the meter is outside your entrance door you might not even have a choice in the matter.

FreeBear

Headscratcher14 said:

FreeBear said:

Headscratcher14 said: I’ve been asked by an elderly and confused contact of mine to look into the meaning of a letter she received recently from E-On, headed “Your electric meter has reached the end of its life – we need to replace it with a new one.  (It’s free!)”.  There is no indication in the letter as to how they have decided it is at the end of its life.

All meters are calibrated and certified for installation in to a home or business. The certification lasts for (I believe) 25 years. After this time, the energy supplier is obliged to either get the meter checked and certified again or replace it with a new one. As they won't want to mess around getting the old meter removed, checked, and then reinstalled, you get a new one.

It is the BEIS and OFGEM that mandate that the meters need to be replaced. The customer has no say in the matter.

I don't think she would have a problem with them coming and checking the meter and re-certified it but, as you suspect, they may not want to do that.   I can't see her allowing them to come unless they put in writing that they would either re-certify it or supply a non-smart meter.

The energy supplier would not be able to calibrate and certify a meter on site. It would need removing and sent off somewhere with the appropriate (and very expensive) equipment. While this is happening, your friend would be without electricity for weeks/months.

EssexHebridean

FreeBear said:

Headscratcher14 said:

FreeBear said:

Headscratcher14 said: I’ve been asked by an elderly and confused contact of mine to look into the meaning of a letter she received recently from E-On, headed “Your electric meter has reached the end of its life – we need to replace it with a new one.  (It’s free!)”.  There is no indication in the letter as to how they have decided it is at the end of its life.

All meters are calibrated and certified for installation in to a home or business. The certification lasts for (I believe) 25 years. After this time, the energy supplier is obliged to either get the meter checked and certified again or replace it with a new one. As they won't want to mess around getting the old meter removed, checked, and then reinstalled, you get a new one.

It is the BEIS and OFGEM that mandate that the meters need to be replaced. The customer has no say in the matter.

I don't think she would have a problem with them coming and checking the meter and re-certified it but, as you suspect, they may not want to do that.   I can't see her allowing them to come unless they put in writing that they would either re-certify it or supply a non-smart meter.

The energy supplier would not be able to calibrate and certify a meter on site. It would need removing and sent off somewhere with the appropriate (and very expensive) equipment. While this is happening, your friend would be without electricity for weeks/months.

No - they'd fit a temporary meter.....a smart meter of course, but probably in a "dumb" state. They absolutely wouldn't leave someone without energy like this. I'd suggest that there might subsequently be a very good chance that the original meter would prove unfit to recertify and bring back, though...