help with internal door hinge that keeps working loose - NOW FALLEN OFF ITS HINGES! -now fixed

theoretica

The pin down the centre of the knuckle of the two hinges need to be on exactly a straight line - so they act as the two ends of one long hinge.  It sounds to me as though they may not have been.  I hope your handyman sorts it out!

Norman_Castle

The wood behind the top hinge has split along the grain. This often happens if doors are opened too wide forcing them against the architrave. If the frame is split fixings would keep coming loose.

Is the wood behind the bottom hinge a previous repair? There seems to be a gap along the bottom. The frame should continue to the floor.

If the door needs to be fully opened parliament hinges would prevent this happening again.

Ectophile

I have known door frames to be hollow.  So you use longer screws thinking that it will make things stronger, but you're really only screwing into fresh air.

silvercar

Norman_Castle said:

The wood behind the top hinge has split along the grain. This often happens if doors are opened too wide forcing them against the architrave. If the frame is split fixings would keep coming loose.

Is the wood behind the bottom hinge a previous repair? There seems to be a gap along the bottom. The frame should continue to the floor.

If the door needs to be fully opened parliament hinges would prevent this happening again.

The door is never opened more than about 120 degrees due to furniture positions.

The frame is the original 1935 door frame as far as we know. So I’d imagine solid wood. Don’t know why there is a gap along the bottom, it’s like that in a lot of rooms. Solid floors, original floor boards ……

Section62

silvercar said:

Time to call in a handyman I think!

With the amount of damage it will be quite difficult to refit the door so it is secure - a handyman might be tempted to just try longer/larger screws or some kind of bodge, unless you ask for something else.

If aesthetics are key and time/money less so, I would rebate a section of the frame out and glue in a new block of wood so each hinge can be refitted to fresh solid wood.  Done carefully you would end up with an 'invisible' repair which would be as strong as the original frame.

If time/money is more important and not aesthretics, I'd consider moving the hinges up/down the door/frame so they are into more solid wood on the frame.  This will look horrible, but it would eliminate the risk of the door falling off again (which could be extremely dangerous).

The third way might be to repair the existing two hinges as best as possible, and add a third hinge in the middle to give the door more support and reduce the chances of it suddenly falling off again.

silvercar

Section62 said:

silvercar said:

Time to call in a handyman I think!

With the amount of damage it will be quite difficult to refit the door so it is secure - a handyman might be tempted to just try longer/larger screws or some kind of bodge, unless you ask for something else.

If aesthetics are key and time/money less so, I would rebate a section of the frame out and glue in a new block of wood so each hinge can be refitted to fresh solid wood.  Done carefully you would end up with an 'invisible' repair which would be as strong as the original frame.

If time/money is more important and not aesthretics, I'd consider moving the hinges up/down the door/frame so they are into more solid wood on the frame.  This will look horrible, but it would eliminate the risk of the door falling off again (which could be extremely dangerous).

The third way might be to repair the existing two hinges as best as possible, and add a third hinge in the middle to give the door more support and reduce the chances of it suddenly falling off again.

I was worried about this. I’ve been very satisfied with previous work he has done for me, of the few handymen I have used over the years he is the best (and most expensive). I’ll report back.

silvercar

Norman_Castle said:

The wood behind the top hinge has split along the grain. This often happens if doors are opened too wide forcing them against the architrave. If the frame is split fixings would keep coming loose.

Is the wood behind the bottom hinge a previous repair? There seems to be a gap along the bottom. The frame should continue to the floor.

If the door needs to be fully opened parliament hinges would prevent this happening again.

Thinking about this more, the room at one point had a carpet, I’m guessing that someone cut a bit of the architrave out to fit the carpet under neatly. I can see that this may be putting a strain of the weight of the door on the architrave. Maybe I should fill this in with something? More matchsticks?

Section62

silvercar said:

Section62 said:

silvercar said:

Time to call in a handyman I think!

With the amount of damage it will be quite difficult to refit the door so it is secure - a handyman might be tempted to just try longer/larger screws or some kind of bodge, unless you ask for something else.

If aesthetics are key and time/money less so, I would rebate a section of the frame out and glue in a new block of wood so each hinge can be refitted to fresh solid wood.  Done carefully you would end up with an 'invisible' repair which would be as strong as the original frame.

If time/money is more important and not aesthretics, I'd consider moving the hinges up/down the door/frame so they are into more solid wood on the frame.  This will look horrible, but it would eliminate the risk of the door falling off again (which could be extremely dangerous).

The third way might be to repair the existing two hinges as best as possible, and add a third hinge in the middle to give the door more support and reduce the chances of it suddenly falling off again.

I was worried about this. I’ve been very satisfied with previous work he has done for me, of the few handymen I have used over the years he is the best (and most expensive). I’ll report back.

I was suggesting you give the handyperson a steer on how you want the repair done - if you just ask them to put the door back on they might assume you want it done 'cheaply' (relatively) or quickly, and as a result do a bodge.

I.e. the recurring theme on this forum of people leaving key decisions to the trader, and then being disappointed by the outcome.  Communicate what you feel is the priority (cost/quality) so there's no misunderstanding.

Edit:  I also agree with travis-powers that the hinge has been fitted incorrectly which is partly why the fixing has failed.  If that was the work of the same handyman then you might want to find someone else.  Packing the hinge out as they did is not a good sign.

Bendy_House

silvercar said:

Norman_Castle said:

The wood behind the top hinge has split along the grain. This often happens if doors are opened too wide forcing them against the architrave. If the frame is split fixings would keep coming loose.

Is the wood behind the bottom hinge a previous repair? There seems to be a gap along the bottom. The frame should continue to the floor.

If the door needs to be fully opened parliament hinges would prevent this happening again.

The door is never opened more than about 120 degrees due to furniture positions.

The frame is the original 1935 door frame as far as we know. So I’d imagine solid wood. Don’t know why there is a gap along the bottom, it’s like that in a lot of rooms. Solid floors, original floor boards ……

That should be a nice solid frame, then.

The two hinge cuts are a bit of a mess, but all these are rescueable. A joiner or good handypeep will glue in a timber fillet so fill the rebate and start again, but this might not be essential.

The existing holes in the timber are clearly far too large, and also seem to include plastic plugs?

Sorry - I didn't see your earlier Q re PVAing. In these situations, I DO coat the screw thread as well, using normal 'timber' PVA and, whilst it helps to bond the screw to the timber, the screw can still be unscrewed afterwards when required- the PVA-bond to the metal isn't that strong. What it mainly does is to fill the 'cut' surface of the timber as the screw ir driven in - if the matchsticks (or whatevs) is cracking and splitting as the screw goes it, it's restrengthened by the PVA being forced in as well. And it bonds reasonably to the metal.

Silver, what weight is this door? Is it a normal 'hollow' internal door - can you lift it with reasonable ease? And just how much do you wish to DIY this? (As a certified cowboy, I have a few get-outs...)

silvercar

The door is heavy, I can’t lift it without help. It’s one of these https://www.todd-doors.co.uk/iseo-k4500-oak-door solid core with oak veneer. 

It’s beyond my diy skills now, particularly as it crashed so spectacularly- it sounded like there were fireworks exploding in the house! I don’t want to risk that falling on anyone.