British Gas explanation of how the EBSS scheme will work

Ultrasonic

Sea_Shell said:

Ultrasonic said:

Sea_Shell said:

Surely this credit should be in addition to your payments on your energy account to help you pay for the increased cost of the energy...not simply refunded??

So you still pay £100, they pay £66, so you have £166 credited to your account against billed usage of....[insert massive figure here]

DDs are likely to a least need to stay unaltered if not increased even further!!

 

No I think what's happening makes sense. Note that for those on the SVT the direct debit amount will be increasing significantly soon, so the reduction will then help with this.

Will most (all) suppliers INSIST on a DD increase from 1st October (SVT) though...or will some let people carry on as they were, until such time as their debit balances need attention?

Will some suppliers merely "suggest" an increase?

I would expect this to be handled the same as whenever an energy company review predicts a large DD increase? As in not something a customer can just choose to completely reject.

Jyana

Ultrasonic said:

Jyana said:

facade said:

Billxx said:

So six monthly payments totalling £400.  Is the scheme implemented the same way by all providers?

Yes, it is prescribed. see https://www.gov.uk/government/news/energy-bills-support-scheme-explainer

they have to either

reduce your DD by £66 a month in October and November, then £67 for December to March

or

They can take the full amount, and pay the £66 or £67 as a refund following collection of the debit (presumably this allows them to earn some interest)

It doesn't look like they can keep some of it back as credit if you are a low use DD customer though in the way BG say.....

That's the bit that has me puzzled. Going by the British Gas email that some people have had today, it looks like some of the £400 will be going to the energy accounts for low users, but not for anyone whose monthly payment is over £67.

Correct, as per government rules. I think the logic is that the £400 must be used for energy bills.

Maybe this is what BG mean when they are saying they have refunded my last bill because of these monthly payments? The £400 is going to over pay my contract by a quite a large amount, and if I can't get that refunded, I could still get the last bill's amount refunded instead, hmmm.

ETA: I was kind of hoping to get some of it back to pay the massive oil bill coming up this winter and beyond. That's where I am really struggling at the moment unfortunately.

Ultrasonic

pochase said:

Nice additional point here is that the money is only returned when the direct debit is received. So our friends from Don't pay will pay at least £400 into their energy accounts.

They'd only be able to pay just £400 if BG allows them to set their DDs to £66/£67, which I'm going to guess they won't. I wonder if you may have hit on the reason why BG aren't simply reducing DD amounts!

Section62

Ultrasonic said:

I wonder if you may have hit on the reason why BG aren't simply reducing DD amounts!

In the consultation document some suppliers pointed out that reviewing people's DD's (in theory downward) for the next six months could result in the DD's actually increasing (because of higher winter usage).

Others said that the work involved in reviewing all the DD's and reducing them by £66/£67 (and subseqently increasing them again) would be an admin burden and lead to increased costs (to be passed on to consumers later)

Hence the government giving the option of keeping the DD's the same and providing a refund after the DD had been collected.

I'd guess BG are in the group of being logistically difficult (/impossible) to make their billing system handle the DD changes correctly without a lot of labour/cost to do stuff manually.

Sea_Shell

Ultrasonic said:

Jyana said:

facade said:

Billxx said:

So six monthly payments totalling £400.  Is the scheme implemented the same way by all providers?

Yes, it is prescribed. see https://www.gov.uk/government/news/energy-bills-support-scheme-explainer

they have to either

reduce your DD by £66 a month in October and November, then £67 for December to March

or

They can take the full amount, and pay the £66 or £67 as a refund following collection of the debit (presumably this allows them to earn some interest)

It doesn't look like they can keep some of it back as credit if you are a low use DD customer though in the way BG say.....

That's the bit that has me puzzled. Going by the British Gas email that some people have had today, it looks like some of the £400 will be going to the energy accounts for low users, but not for anyone whose monthly payment is over £67.

Correct, as per government rules. I think the logic is that the £400 must be used for energy bills.

"Must"?   I'm not sure they can dictate that if they are refunding directly to people's Bank accounts 😉

Time will tell I suppose.🤔

Ultrasonic

Sea_Shell said:

Ultrasonic said:

Jyana said:

facade said:

Billxx said:

So six monthly payments totalling £400.  Is the scheme implemented the same way by all providers?

Yes, it is prescribed. see https://www.gov.uk/government/news/energy-bills-support-scheme-explainer

they have to either

reduce your DD by £66 a month in October and November, then £67 for December to March

or

They can take the full amount, and pay the £66 or £67 as a refund following collection of the debit (presumably this allows them to earn some interest)

It doesn't look like they can keep some of it back as credit if you are a low use DD customer though in the way BG say.....

That's the bit that has me puzzled. Going by the British Gas email that some people have had today, it looks like some of the £400 will be going to the energy accounts for low users, but not for anyone whose monthly payment is over £67.

Correct, as per government rules. I think the logic is that the £400 must be used for energy bills.

"Must"?   I'm not sure they can dictate that if they are refunding directly to people's Bank accounts 😉

Time will tell I suppose.🤔

I was referring to why those with DDs less than £66 where having the difference credited to their ENERGY accounts. For the overwhelming majority who have DDs higher than £66 it automatically comes off energy bills.

Edit: I thought you were referring to the same in your post I quoted?

Sea_Shell

Ultrasonic said:

Sea_Shell said:

Ultrasonic said:

Jyana said:

facade said:

Billxx said:

So six monthly payments totalling £400.  Is the scheme implemented the same way by all providers?

Yes, it is prescribed. see https://www.gov.uk/government/news/energy-bills-support-scheme-explainer

they have to either

reduce your DD by £66 a month in October and November, then £67 for December to March

or

They can take the full amount, and pay the £66 or £67 as a refund following collection of the debit (presumably this allows them to earn some interest)

It doesn't look like they can keep some of it back as credit if you are a low use DD customer though in the way BG say.....

That's the bit that has me puzzled. Going by the British Gas email that some people have had today, it looks like some of the £400 will be going to the energy accounts for low users, but not for anyone whose monthly payment is over £67.

Correct, as per government rules. I think the logic is that the £400 must be used for energy bills.

"Must"?   I'm not sure they can dictate that if they are refunding directly to people's Bank accounts 😉

Time will tell I suppose.🤔

I was referring to why those with DDs less than £66 where having the difference credited to their ENERGY accounts. For the overwhelming majority who have DDs higher than £66 it automatically comes off energy bills.

I'm sorry, I'm still not quite getting it.   It must be the heat 😉

Eg.  Your energy account balance is £x, you make a DD payment of £y, but get £66 refunded directly to your bank.

So you've only actually paid £y-£66 off of your energy balance of £x.

You still owe that £66.   It's come off your payment but not your bill.

The only way it would come off your bill (balance), is if you paid it back in?!?🤔   


I think I need a lie down 🤣


  

Section62

Sea_Shell said:

Ultrasonic said:

Jyana said:

Correct, as per government rules. I think the logic is that the £400 must be used for energy bills.

"Must"?   I'm not sure they can dictate that if they are refunding directly to people's Bank accounts 😉

Time will tell I suppose.🤔

I get what you are saying, but as things stand the direct refunds into people's bank accounts will only be their own money that was recently DD'd from them.

The refund follows the DD.

The £400 stays in the energy account (nominally).

eon next touched on this yesterday when they were saying that requests for refunds of residual amounts would go through several hoops a full assessement -

The money is being set aside by the government to help with winter bills and the upcoming price cap, therefore the money should go towards paying for energy.

In line with our credit refund policy we would need a meter reading so we can bill you up to date and understand your true balance.

https://www.eonnext.com/energy-bill-support-scheme

Ultrasonic

Sea_Shell said:

I'm sorry, I'm still not quite getting it.   It must be the heat 😉

Eg.  Your energy account balance is £x, you make a DD payment of £y, but get £66 refunded directly to your bank.

So you've only actually paid £y-£66 off of your energy balance of £x.  

The last part is where you're going wrong. You get the refund but your energy account balance in totally unaffected by the refund. If someone has a set DD amount of £100 then this is the amount credited to their energy account, even if they only actually pay £34, or they pay £100 and get a £66 rebate back to their bank account. 

Edit: think of the rebate coming from the energy company itself rather than your own energy account.

Sea_Shell

So is the credit and subsequent refund NOT going to show as separate lines on your energy bill???

So if you pay £100 DD, the whole £100 is credited to your account, but the refund ISN'T part of your account balance, and is completely separate from it?