EV Discussion thread

Grumpy_chap

JKenH said:

Another option for you.

BYD launches electric passenger car in UK

https://www.just-auto.com/news/byd-launches-electric-passenger-car-in-uk/

From £36k with 260 mile range will be hard to make an entry into the market against TM3 SR with 300 mile range at £40k for a stock vehicle.

Martyn1981

Grumpy_chap said:

JKenH said:

Another option for you.

BYD launches electric passenger car in UK

https://www.just-auto.com/news/byd-launches-electric-passenger-car-in-uk/

From £36k with 260 mile range will be hard to make an entry into the market against TM3 SR with 300 mile range at £40k for a stock vehicle.

LOL, exact same thought I had.

Have to say things have gotten weird this year since the Tesla price cuts*. I really thought BYD was going to 'storm' Europe, but their prices just aren't that appealing (yet?), v's the competition.

I wonder if the issue is profitability, since BYD is thought to be one of, if not the only Chinese BEV manufacturer who is profitable. Not massively profitable, but a bit, at least before their recent price cuts. The rest are going for market share first as the World transitions to BEV's.

*A while back I said that it looked like Tesla had declared war on ICE manufacturers, and Nick suggested they may have also declared war on BEV competition, looks like Nick was right.

Petriix

Grumpy_chap said:

silverwhistle said:

@Grumpy_chap, the MG4 is NCAP 5, although some users get grumpy about some of the safety features NCAP requires and turn them off! If you have detailed questions forums are often more informed than dealers:

 https://www.mgevs.com/categories/mg-community-forum.1/

Thank you

We did actually go with the intent of seeing the MG4, and the Dealer verbally advised while we were there that had EURO NCAP rating of 5 star.

The MG4 looked like a fantastic car, but we felt the MG5 was a better fit for us (old fuddy-duddies that we are).  In fact, even though I do not like SUV-esque vehicles, we actually preferred the MG ZS, but the Dealer advised there were none available and the wait time would be 12 months or more so he could not provide an EV version for test drive or even take any orders if we did like it.

We drove the MG5 and really liked it - so much so that Mrs G-C would have just placed the order there and then.

The question on safety rating seems a reasonable one to ask. 
The Dealer should be able to respond easily and quickly.
Research online seems to indicate that the car is not tested or zero rated.
I find it hard to believe that a new car would be launched and get to second generation (there has recently been a facelift) and the manufacturer care so little about safety that they would not obtain a rating.  So, in the absence of any definitive answer, i have to conclude that the MG5 has a zero rating (if the manufacturer knew the car would score poorly, there'd be no point in getting that officially verified).
I'd actually go further and say that a vehicle should not be granted type approval if it has not been NCAP assessed and demonstrated to pass a certain threshold level.

Really quite a shame as, if this one factor had been resolved, I strongly suspect we would have started our road to EV ownership by now.

Still, TESLA prices are reducing again (apparently) so maybe there will be a silver-lining...

You're making some weird assumptions. Firstly the rules change frequently so a vehicle which previously scored 5 stars could now score zero; you're likely driving round in a more dangerous car with a false sense of security. Secondly, just because it's not been tested doesn't mean it would score zero.

The original MG5 didn't have any active safety features required to score above 3 stars but the LR and facelift models have the exact same tech as the MG4 and would score a similar safety rating.

I imagine MG didn't do the safety test for the same reason as they didn't bother getting the original MG5 roof rails correctly certified to carry any weight: nobody thought it worth the expense or effort. Why spend thousands on destroying some perfectly good cars if no one is making you?

Grumpy_chap

Petriix said:

 you're likely driving round in a more dangerous car with a false sense of security. 

I know that I am driving a more dangerous car - there is no false sense of security about it.
To say "well, the old car would score zero so I'll accept zero for the next car" is totally retrograde.
Would you also agree that the same logic could be applied to "the old car is an ICE, so the next car might just as well be also"?

Petriix said:

 just because it's not been tested doesn't mean it would score zero.

The original MG5 didn't have any active safety features required to score above 3 stars but the LR and facelift models have the exact same tech as the MG4 and would score a similar safety rating.

I imagine MG didn't do the safety test for the same reason as they didn't bother getting the original MG5 roof rails correctly certified to carry any weight: nobody thought it worth the expense or effort. Why spend thousands on destroying some perfectly good cars if no one is making you?

If a manufacturer was confident of a good score, why wouldn't they test the car and gain the kudos?  Safety sells in this day and age.  If MG can't afford the development cost of the safety rating, it makes one wonder what other short-cuts they have taken.

As a consumer, why should I put my life in the hands of a company that takes a blase approach to safety?

The MG4 has been tested and achieved a good score.  There is no logical reason why the MG5 would not also have been tested, especially as there has recently been a facelift - that would have been the logical time to get the job done.  Especially if, as you suggest, MG would have achieved a 5-star rating.

In fact, the failure to obtain a rating or to obtain a rating of zero stars, could well be detrimental to the EV conversion.  I can only name two cars aimed at mass-market that have the zero rating.  They are both EV's.  The fuel for the tabloid naysayers is there.
Surely, as an EVangelist, you can see how that would read...

JKenH

Running out of road? Car buyers are racing to snap up hybrids but they'll be banned from sale in 2030 - here's what you need to know

Toyota get a lot of stick for being behind the curve but they dominate the fastest growing sector of the UK private car market - hybrids.

https://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/cars/article-11844255/Hybrid-cars-need-know-run-road.html

JKenH

Is the Tesla Model Y a premium sector car or just a Ford Mondeo sold at a premium price?This review by Car magazine praises the power train and range of the MY but the rest of the car leaves the reviewers cold.

MUSK TRY HARDER

Tesla’s used to getting its own way. But with the EQB and iX1, has the German establishment passed Elon’s Model Y?

Alas, the Tesla’s ride quality is shocking; cart springs and concrete damping – right up there with a shopping trolley on corrugated iron, and the sound enters the cabin with a gusto that would impress even the Kodo drummers. Worse still, build quality is sufficiently suspect that the interior creaks and groans its way down the road like a galleon in a gale. The steering has a nasty stodgy quality top dead centre and then is instantly too quick and rather darty. 

It may go like a stabbed rat, but the Model Y also has all the charm of one. Quick, but not very pleasant. And if we’re judging these as premi-um products, that’s not ideal. 

Suggestion about Car April 2023 page 48
https://go.readly.com/magazines/537cb47901704d67d200002e/63fdfebf5f69dd0008b55283/48

1961Nick

Although I've not driven the model Y, I'm surprised by those comments based on my experience with the M3P. Compared to the 435d x-drive M-Sport, the Models 3's suspension is more compliant, the steering is more accurate & there's less roll & understeer. That's quite an achievement & more than I was expecting to be honest. 

Grumpy_chap

How different is the Performance model for suspension settings / handling compared to standard SR / LR versions?

I know a few people with TM3's and none commented on poor handling.

AIUI, the Performance version is same as LR version other than software allows higher peak power / acceleration.  Plus different wheels.  I may be wholly incorrect.

shinytop

JKenH said:

Is the Tesla Model Y a premium sector car or just a Ford Mondeo sold at a premium price?This review by Car magazine praises the power train and range of the MY but the rest of the car leaves the reviewers cold.

MUSK TRY HARDER

Tesla’s used to getting its own way. But with the EQB and iX1, has the German establishment passed Elon’s Model Y?

Alas, the Tesla’s ride quality is shocking; cart springs and concrete damping – right up there with a shopping trolley on corrugated iron, and the sound enters the cabin with a gusto that would impress even the Kodo drummers. Worse still, build quality is sufficiently suspect that the interior creaks and groans its way down the road like a galleon in a gale. The steering has a nasty stodgy quality top dead centre and then is instantly too quick and rather darty. 

It may go like a stabbed rat, but the Model Y also has all the charm of one. Quick, but not very pleasant. And if we’re judging these as premi-um products, that’s not ideal. 

Suggestion about Car April 2023 page 48
https://go.readly.com/magazines/537cb47901704d67d200002e/63fdfebf5f69dd0008b55283/48

That's an insult to Ford; Mondeos were very good cars!!

Does this count as the NVH discussed previously that only ICE cars were supposed to suffer from? 

Grumpy_chap

shinytop said:

That's an insult to Ford; Mondeos were very good cars!!

And one of the best riding best handling cars at that!

I've had several Mondeo's and, all things being equal, would buy another this time around.  Obviously, Ford stopped making them and there are very few late model used ones about.  PLUS, no electric options.

Now, If *someone* were to launch an EV Mondeo, that would be fantastic.  If it also came with access to the network of high speed public chargers, that would be world-beating.