Electric cars

Ibrahim5

If you have a few cars then having one with a restricted range is OK. I would be tempted if you could pick up an EV with 20 mile range for £200. IE it's not very good but it's cheap.

Martyn1981

Money_Grabber13579 said:

Martyn1981 said:

Herzlos said:

Just because you can't comprehend it doesn't mean it's not useful. 

Most of us would be fine with a 20 mile EV most of the time. If I had one it'd almost certainly accumulate more than my ICE.

Not all cigarette lighters have a permanent live feed to allow a trickle charger. 

Personally I think owning a car for someone who uses it infrequently enough that flat batteries is a regular thing is madness, but for those that insist,electric is going to be the better option.

Yeah, there has to come a point where taxi's (for example) are cheaper, than the cost of owning a car. Of course, got to be a PEV taxi. 

What’s a PEV taxi? Everyone seems to use different acronyms now which doesn’t help to know what anyone is then talking about. The most common ones seem to be BEV (battery electric vehicle), ICE (internal combustion engine), PHEV (petrol hybrid electric vehicle) but no idea what PEV is. Plug-in electric vehicle? Petrol engined vehicle?

Hi, yep you are spot on, plug-in electric vehicles.

I don't think there are different acronyms being used, I certainly haven't seen any, although 'electrified' is often used by companies trying to hide the fact the cars don't have a plug.

The standard terms (from least to most 'electric') are:

ICEV - Internal combustion engine vehicle.

MHEV - Mild hybrid electric vehicle. Just a small 48V batt / power assist to help with pull off, when ICE's are most inefficient (1st gear). Can't power the car alone. I'd expect all petrol and diesel cars to become MHEV's in a few years to meet EU rules and regs.

HEV - Hybrid electric vehicle. Small(ish) battery and electric motor, that often allows for electric only mode, if driven gently, for a mile or so.

PHEV - Plugin Hybrid electric vehicle. Larger battery and motor, able to power the car, if charged up, for longer distances, perhaps 10-50 miles depending on model. Also an ICE for higher power demand, and when the batt is low.

BEV - Battery electric vehicle. No ICE whatsoever, powered by battery and electric motor(s).

Plus

PEV - Plug in electric vehicle. Cars with a plug, encompasses PHEV's and BEV's. Vehicles that can at least theoretically, drive on leccy only.

Here's the most recent SMMT data on UK registrations for May 2022, showing the various terms in use:

Herzlos

Ibrahim5 said:

If you have a few cars then having one with a restricted range is OK. I would be tempted if you could pick up an EV with 20 mile range for £200. IE it's not very good but it's cheap.

Of course you would, but many people in the real world understand its value. I'd probably pay £2-3k for one.

I'd rarely recommend a 20 mile range EV as an only car. But then we're also talking about the first generation Leafs with the smallest most degraded batteries for the lowest price. Most people buying an EV will have over 100 miles range. 

GunJack

Herzlos said: But then I'm paying over £300/month before fuel so 

Maybe that's where you're going wrong then

Herzlos

GunJack said:

Herzlos said: But then I'm paying over £300/month before fuel so 

Maybe that's where you're going wrong then

Possibly, but that's really not much for a car in the scheme of things. It's a 1 year old 7 seater that cost £20k. Way more than I've ever paid for a car before but the monthly payments aren't that much worse; that was a 4 year old hatchback that cost £8k and probably ran to about £200/month before fuel.

sevenhills

We had a meeting with our bosses last week, they said electric VW crafter type vehicle would be £250k fully fitted, around double the price of a diesel.
So my local authority bosses are not buying electric. They seem to have a few small electric vans, to show they are buying some, but most of their vehicles seem to still be diesel.
I have noticed Amazon and PDP have some electric vans.

Herzlos

sevenhills said:

We had a meeting with our bosses last week, they said electric VW crafter type vehicle would be £250k fully fitted, around double the price of a diesel.
So my local authority bosses are not buying electric. They seem to have a few small electric vans, to show they are buying some, but most of their vehicles seem to still be diesel.
I have noticed Amazon and PDP have some electric vans.

Why the huge price difference? I get the VW crafter EV will have a serious price premium, but that's a lot of money for fitting. I can't imagine you'd be doing anything that'd involve moving batteries around.

Considering an electric Vivaro is about £40k, that's a lot of money for fitting it out.
I don't see a price on an e-Crafter as it seems to still be a concept thing.

Ditzy_Mitzy

Grumpy_chap said:

If the OP is changing their car in any case, it is a different calculation to if the OP would only change for going EV.

One big advantage I can see for an EV in such very low use would be that, AIUI, the EV will always be ready to use.  My Mum does a  very low mileage in her ICE and I am always being called round to assist as she has a flat 12V battery again so the car won't start.  This is not good for the battery and not convenient for Mum.

If I am correct that an EV would cope with the "idle" periods better than an ICE, then this is a good opportunity

To be honest, it sounds rather like there's a problem with the car or battery.  My none too intelligent car fired up straight away after being left idle for months during the coronavirus period; it has a new-ish battery and a healthy electrical system.  Your mother's car might have a parasitic drain of some sort, or perhaps just a weak battery.  

Is she doing lots of short journeys?  A car needs to run for five or ten minutes to top-up the battery charge lost whilst starting.  

Grumpy_chap

Ditzy_Mitzy said:

To be honest, it sounds rather like there's a problem with the car or battery.  My none too intelligent car fired up straight away after being left idle for months during the coronavirus period; it has a new-ish battery and a healthy electrical system.  Your mother's car might have a parasitic drain of some sort, or perhaps just a weak battery.  

Is she doing lots of short journeys?  A car needs to run for five or ten minutes to top-up the battery charge lost whilst starting.  

I think it is worse than that.

The car will sit idle, then used to do a trip to the community centre and back - less than a mile each way so not enough to replenish the starting charge through the running time.  Then back to sit idle for a few weeks more.

I also think that modern cars have parasitic drain inbuilt - alarm system, keyless entry monitoring for a key-fob, etc.

sevenhills

Herzlos said:

Why the huge price difference? I get the VW crafter EV will have a serious price premium, but that's a lot of money for fitting. I can't imagine you'd be doing anything that'd involve moving batteries around.

Considering an electric Vivaro is about £40k, that's a lot of money for fitting it out.
I don't see a price on an e-Crafter as it seems to still be a concept thing.

I know fitting them out is expensive, I am guessing £50k+ 
It would be a massive change to go electric, our workshop is struggling at the moment, buying 50 electric Crafters would put a spanner in the works.
It will take years of planning, no one is willing to make that decision