Living in ULEZ with a non compliant car

jimjames

f.castle said:

Where does he think people will get the money from, to buy another?

Considering you can get a £500 car that is compliant I don't think you'll need to find any extra money.

NBLondon

Car_54 said:

Several more than two choices - walk, cycle, electric car, public transport ...

None of which work too well for a self-employed builder...   My neighbour is selling his 55 plate Vauxhall Vivaro - I'm not expecting a used Leaf to appear in its place  

Herzlos

NBLondon said:

Car_54 said:

Several more than two choices - walk, cycle, electric car, public transport ...

None of which work too well for a self-employed builder...   My neighbour is selling his 55 plate Vauxhall Vivaro - I'm not expecting a used Leaf to appear in its place  

I thought commercial vehicles were somehow exempt, but even then he'd presumably need to go forward to a 65 plate Vivaro to get a EURO-VI?

The electric Vivaro is pretty nice, but far from cheap since there aren't many used ones yet and they'd be a 2020 plate at oldest, vs £5k for a 2016 Vivaro.

(I'm kind of impressed that he's still able to use a 17 year old van for work)

Goudy

Nope, even commercial vehicles are included, not unless it's much older and classed as an historic or a showman's vehicle.

There are very few exemptions for the ULEZ.
Unlike the congestion charge even blue badge holders will have to pay it after a "grace period".

It's a rather odd arrangement when you come to think of this and the congestion charge for that matter.
Why is your car not as polluting if you pay £12.50 or doesn't congest as much if you pay £15?
Even more strange, if the ULEZ works and no one pays the charge anymore as we're all clean and scooting about on electric scooters, how does the scheme fund itself, let alone make TFL cash?

What do you think will happen to the ULEZ cameras when petrols and diesels stop being sold, older cars die out and we're (nearly) all clean?
Can't see them scrapping the expensive infrastructure and saying goodbye to all the income, which is why this latest ULEZ consultaion includes a future road pricing element as well.

I believe the congestion charge will drop the 100% zero emissions discount first and charge everyone, then the outlaying ULEZ slowly gets turned into a larger congestion charge for the whole of greater London.

MacPingu1986

Goudy - it's not that paying the charge suddenly makes a vehicle less polluting, but what it does do is incentive either replacing the vehicle, or using it less in the ULEZ zone - just like any other sort of "polluter pays" charge does - if it's not the polluter that pays - then *everybody* pays.

The number of non-compliant vehicles in the zone was already relatively low to begin with. The costs of air pollution and associated health effects are pretty significant and in my view likely (although I don't have any hard stats for this admittedly), that the reduction in these costs from cleaner air exceed the gradual drop in revenue from the scheme as vehicles are replaced.

But you're right in that this is pretty much baby steps and if we really want to get a handle on air quality and pollution in London then more needs to be done.

Herzlos

If you completely banned the non compliant vehicles from the LEZ it'd cause outrage, so the only other option is to disincentivize* it. 
You can make the trip in anyway and pay the fee, or you can make alternative arrangements. People paying the fee will cover the cost of the scheme, but if everyone stops doing so then it really won't cost much to administer.

NBLondon

Herzlos said:

(I'm kind of impressed that he's still able to use a 17 year old van for work)

He's not touting for work direct to customers - he's contracted by others.  He could probably get by with a smaller van that is just new enough to be compliant but I don't know if he has the capital to hand.  He "banks" with William Hill so that may be the problem or the solution depending on his luck this month.

Herzlos

NBLondon said:

Herzlos said:

(I'm kind of impressed that he's still able to use a 17 year old van for work)

He's not touting for work direct to customers - he's contracted by others.  He could probably get by with a smaller van that is just new enough to be compliant but I don't know if he has the capital to hand.  He "banks" with William Hill so that may be the problem or the solution depending on his luck this month.

It's unfortunate but with any of these things someone is going to land on the wrong side of it. 

That said, the cut off point is at about the average age for a scrapped UK vehicle for diesel, and older for petrol, so I'm not sure how many people are actually affected. 

I'd expect a 2005 builders van to be on it's last legs as it is. But there will probably be someone happy to pay over the odds for it to half convert it into a camper.

Petriix

f.castle said:

Hello,

Sadiq Khan plans to expand the ULEZ. I have a diesel from 2014 which is non compliant.
I live in the expansion zone.
will I be charged daily for simply having my car on the driveway?
or will I only be charged on the days I drive the car?

Where does he think people will get the money from, to buy another?

thanks,

As you own a driveway, you'll likely save money in the medium term by switching to an EV.

Aretnap

jimjames said:

f.castle said:

Where does he think people will get the money from, to buy another?

Considering you can get a £500 car that is compliant I don't think you'll need to find any extra money.

Especially given that you have an eight year old diesel to sell, which will still have quite a lot of value...