Stressful Completion - Seller Refused to Move Out!

Ath_Wat

user1977 said:

aoleks said:

At that point, having strangers in their house is not enough to call the police? 

No. Besides, what are you expecting the police to do about it? Help carry their stuff into a removal van?

I imagine he'd be expecting the police to order them to leave and really not care where they go or what they do.  Whether they have the legal right to do this is another question, but the OP 's concern is not facilitating their move but getting them out; their property can wait.  The OP really shouldn't care if they end up sleeping in a  bus stop (which they won't, as they have another house).

Ath_Wat

Section62 said:

LunaCatty said:

Yep that's what we have basically done via the solicitor, they have until tomorrow afternoon to be out (so 48 hours from when they should have been) or solicitors will jump in legally and they will find a whole lot of costs racking up. They seem to be very money orientated so I'm just hoping the thought of costs is enough to motivate them out of there.  

Take the fact the EA didn't dismiss out of hand the idea you had some kind of private agreement as a sign that a court may do the same... and of course a private agreement has subsequently been made, which does complicate things.

Estate agents are generally (although not always) more stupid than judges and more likely to believe nonsensical things.

LunaCatty

Ath_Wat said:

I'll just point out that the OPs right to enter the premises is a distinct thing from getting the previous residents to leave the premises. It is quite possible that the OP has a perfect right to enter and change the locks but no right to order the previous occupants to leave (leaving aside the fact that the OP has agreed for them to stay until today).  Saying they can break down the door to get in themselves does not necessarily imply they can order the sellers out.  Obviously rather than breaking down the door its best to knock on it and walk in when they open it and then call a locksmith.
Having the OP in there however and having no keys to get in and out is going to concentrate their minds wonderfully.

We are actually just about to drive past to check they have removals van packing things up. We did drive past yesterday and look through the window and the only things left in the house were large furniture so we think things are progressing. I'm waiting for solicitor to phone us back but our plan at present is very similar to this, just waiting to confirm the situation.

LunaCatty

Section62 said:

Take the fact the EA didn't dismiss out of hand the idea you had some kind of private agreement as a sign that a court may do the same... and of course a private agreement has subsequently been made, which does complicate things.

No, the agent was more confused and didn't believe her but phoned my to check if we did. It was at that point solicitor and agent explained to her she was in breach and so forth. I regret now agreeing that they could remain until today as I don't trust they will move as promised, but wanted to avoid legal action and any bad taste with neighbours there (they have lived there a long time, we'll be relative newcomers and small villages can be snippy/gossipy at times - I realise this shouldn't be a worry, but it is as if willing to try this on I bet they would happily manipluate the neighbours before leaving too).

Section62

Ath_Wat said:

user1977 said:

aoleks said:

At that point, having strangers in their house is not enough to call the police? 

No. Besides, what are you expecting the police to do about it? Help carry their stuff into a removal van?

I imagine he'd be expecting the police to order them to leave and really not care where they go or what they do.  Whether they have the legal right to do this is another question, but the OP 's concern is not facilitating their move but getting them out; their property can wait.  The OP really shouldn't care if they end up sleeping in a  bus stop (which they won't, as they have another house).

Do you think a beat bobby will throw an elderly couple out of their home and onto the street on the basis of someone else's claim that they now own the house?

If so, what's to stop criminals getting the police to help them steal elderly people's homes?  Think about it.

Ath_Wat said:

Section62 said:

Take the fact the EA didn't dismiss out of hand the idea you had some kind of private agreement as a sign that a court may do the same... and of course a private agreement has subsequently been made, which does complicate things.

Estate agents are generally (although not always) more stupid than judges and more likely to believe nonsensical things.

...and yet the OP has now entered into a private agreement for the couple to stay on for 48 hours - which you appear to think is "nonsensical thing".  Stuff like this happens all the time.

Courts know it happens, intentionally or otherwise.  They will listen to both sides, no matter how nonsensical you think it is.

user1977

Ath_Wat said:

user1977 said:

aoleks said:

At that point, having strangers in their house is not enough to call the police? 

No. Besides, what are you expecting the police to do about it? Help carry their stuff into a removal van?

I imagine he'd be expecting the police to order them to leave and really not care where they go or what they do.  Whether they have the legal right to do this is another question

They don't, and it would be an utter waste of the police's time. What crime is being committed?

Section62

LunaCatty said:

Section62 said:

Take the fact the EA didn't dismiss out of hand the idea you had some kind of private agreement as a sign that a court may do the same... and of course a private agreement has subsequently been made, which does complicate things.

No, the agent was more confused and didn't believe her but phoned my to check if we did.

Yes, that was my point - the EA didn't dismiss the idea out of hand, because it is plausible you agreed someting with the vendors.  They needed to check to make sure you hadn't.

LunaCatty

Solicitors have been in communication and it is confirmed keys will be handed over this afternoon. There is also a large van at the property. I won't believe it until in hand, but it does seem the thought of costs against them has got them out.

GDB2222

LunaCatty said:

Ath_Wat said:

I'll just point out that the OPs right to enter the premises is a distinct thing from getting the previous residents to leave the premises. It is quite possible that the OP has a perfect right to enter and change the locks but no right to order the previous occupants to leave (leaving aside the fact that the OP has agreed for them to stay until today).  Saying they can break down the door to get in themselves does not necessarily imply they can order the sellers out.  Obviously rather than breaking down the door its best to knock on it and walk in when they open it and then call a locksmith.
Having the OP in there however and having no keys to get in and out is going to concentrate their minds wonderfully.

We are actually just about to drive past to check they have removals van packing things up. We did drive past yesterday and look through the window and the only things left in the house were large furniture so we think things are progressing. I'm waiting for solicitor to phone us back but our plan at present is very similar to this, just waiting to confirm the situation.

Very wise to wait and see.

If you wish to force entry and change the locks, I strongly recommend that you ask your solicitor for advice first. Most of the advice on this thread has been from well meaning people who are telling you what they think the law ought to be. 

It would be incredibly unwise to try to force entry whilst your vendors are in the house. The occupants have the right to resist entry, and if the police are called you might well be arrested. 

If you force entry whilst the vendors are out, you can’t just throw their furniture out, anyway, and you saddle yourself with a duty to care for it. So, that doesn’t work either, really. 

Very frustrating for you, but hopefully you will have a vacant house shortly. 

lookstraightahead

LunaCatty said:

Solicitors have been in communication and it is confirmed keys will be handed over this afternoon. There is also a large van at the property. I won't believe it until in hand, but it does seem the thought of costs against them has got them out.

I've been reading this in absolute horror op, how utterly selfish of the vendors and how they do a disservice to older vendors (or any vendors to be honest). You deserve a medal for your patience and once you have the keys I would be not engaging with them again. I hope they've forgotten to redirect their post ☹️