Completion Delay - Won't pay costs

saajan_12

NNLisbon said:

saajan_12 said:

TheJP said:

Ok so i think a lot of people are missing the links here;

The OP exchanged contracts on their own property sale in December, they hadn't yet exchanged contracts on the property they are buying.

Come completion day of the house they are selling (already exchanged) the buyer missed the 12pm deadline, removals come close to the end of their shift would have headed back to base. The funds arrived at 5.10pm and completion is complete.

The OP's solicitor advised not exchanging contracts on their onward purchase as they then would breach that contract if completion was due on the same day.

All in all the delay has screwed everyone over apart from the buyer of OPs property.

I do think you should be compensated but depends how clear cut the contracts are regarding the timings.

Not clear this is the case either, as OP hasn't stated what happened with their purchase and later said the 'exchange' was a typo and meant 'complete'. 

OP, please clarify the date you: 
1) date you exchanged on sale
2) date you exchanged on purchase
3) date you completed on sale
4) date you completed on purchase
5) what would have happened if the buyer transferred on time 
6) breakdown of the £1200 damages (eg hotel? removals? costs passed down from your vendor? 
7) Did the buyer know you were in a chain (may not be if you hadn't exchanged on the purchase)?

The issue here isn't really whether the OP completed ie handed over their house. The point is by the buyer's delay, the OP didn't have the money in time so may not have been able to move into another house. So we have to consider whether they had a reasonable expectation of moving into another house that day and if the buyer's delay prevented that.. 

Hi,

I thought it was quite a straightforward question, hence why detail was light (I was trying not to exhaust people with too much info), my apologies if I've caused any confusion and thanks for all the responses. 

Some clarification.
 
1) date you exchanged on sale - 17/11/21
2) date you exchanged on purchase - 17/11/21
3) date you completed on sale - 18/01/22
4) date you completed on purchase - 18/01/22
5) what would have happened if the buyer transferred on time. Completion the day before, as contracts dictated. 
6) breakdown of the £1200 damages (eg hotel? removals? costs passed down from your vendor? £1100 to the removal company (including waiting fees, travel back to the depot, overnight storage and the team to return the following day and complete the move, £130 for hotel. My buyer did pay the £208 interest charge, but not the other costs. Thankfully, my vendor was incredibly decent and did not insist that interest was to be paid. They had no onward chain themselves as were selling a second property. 
7) Did the buyer know you were in a chain (may not be if you hadn't exchanged on the purchase)? Yes, they knew there was a chain

Just to try and answer some of the other questions. Money was finally received from my buyer at 5:10pm but still needed to be paid on to my vendor's solicitor in order for me to secure the property I was moving into. I was advised that there was no guarantee funds would definitely be received by vendor solicitor's closing (5:30pm) and I would be left vulnerable if I completed on my sale, but then couldn't complete on my onward purchase until the following day. This eventuality would also have had further ramifications and required me to pay the early repayment charge to my mortgage company. 

I am personally struggling with the commentary that my buyer isn't culpable. It was clear in our contracts that there was a 12pm completion deadline and at 11:50am they still had not made a significant payment to their solicitors. I kept my end of the bargain and vacated the house as agreed, which meant I had to remove all furniture and load it onto a van to move.

If the advice is that it's a pointless to try and pursue it then I understand, but I'm struggling to see how I've got to shoulder costs that I just shouldn't have needed to pay.

Right, so both contracts HAD been exchanged and the only reason there aren't costs from OP's vendor is they were moving to an empty property and didn't have much costs beyond 1 day's interest. 

Note the time of 12pm isn't a gospel time in itself, eg if the buyer transferred at 1pm with actual damage to you, then there would be £0 claimable. The point here is it was so late (5:10pm) that you couldn't transfer to your vendor, have their solicitor receive and confirm completion that day. I wouldn't get into the stuff about mortgages, ERCs, completion on one transaction but not the other etc - its not the completion on your sale that's particularly relevant, but rather your purchase given the time was too short. 

You have 2 hurdles: 
1) whether the judge agrees 5:10pm doesn't leave enough time to transfer that day -> I think that's a reasonable argument and you have the advice from your solicitor, but not a guarantee
2) actually recovering the money from buyer -> they own a property, so worst case you could place a charge on that, so you will get it eventually, may not get cash immediately though

I wouldn't necessarily throw good money after bad on a litigation solicitor which may double the amount and debatable whether you'd recover the extra - you can just write a letter before action and then file a small claim for the £1200. 

NNLisbon

saajan_12 said:

NNLisbon said:

saajan_12 said:

TheJP said:

Ok so i think a lot of people are missing the links here;

The OP exchanged contracts on their own property sale in December, they hadn't yet exchanged contracts on the property they are buying.

Come completion day of the house they are selling (already exchanged) the buyer missed the 12pm deadline, removals come close to the end of their shift would have headed back to base. The funds arrived at 5.10pm and completion is complete.

The OP's solicitor advised not exchanging contracts on their onward purchase as they then would breach that contract if completion was due on the same day.

All in all the delay has screwed everyone over apart from the buyer of OPs property.

I do think you should be compensated but depends how clear cut the contracts are regarding the timings.

Not clear this is the case either, as OP hasn't stated what happened with their purchase and later said the 'exchange' was a typo and meant 'complete'. 

OP, please clarify the date you: 
1) date you exchanged on sale
2) date you exchanged on purchase
3) date you completed on sale
4) date you completed on purchase
5) what would have happened if the buyer transferred on time 
6) breakdown of the £1200 damages (eg hotel? removals? costs passed down from your vendor? 
7) Did the buyer know you were in a chain (may not be if you hadn't exchanged on the purchase)?

The issue here isn't really whether the OP completed ie handed over their house. The point is by the buyer's delay, the OP didn't have the money in time so may not have been able to move into another house. So we have to consider whether they had a reasonable expectation of moving into another house that day and if the buyer's delay prevented that.. 

Hi,

I thought it was quite a straightforward question, hence why detail was light (I was trying not to exhaust people with too much info), my apologies if I've caused any confusion and thanks for all the responses. 

Some clarification.
 
1) date you exchanged on sale - 17/11/21
2) date you exchanged on purchase - 17/11/21
3) date you completed on sale - 18/01/22
4) date you completed on purchase - 18/01/22
5) what would have happened if the buyer transferred on time. Completion the day before, as contracts dictated. 
6) breakdown of the £1200 damages (eg hotel? removals? costs passed down from your vendor? £1100 to the removal company (including waiting fees, travel back to the depot, overnight storage and the team to return the following day and complete the move, £130 for hotel. My buyer did pay the £208 interest charge, but not the other costs. Thankfully, my vendor was incredibly decent and did not insist that interest was to be paid. They had no onward chain themselves as were selling a second property. 
7) Did the buyer know you were in a chain (may not be if you hadn't exchanged on the purchase)? Yes, they knew there was a chain

Just to try and answer some of the other questions. Money was finally received from my buyer at 5:10pm but still needed to be paid on to my vendor's solicitor in order for me to secure the property I was moving into. I was advised that there was no guarantee funds would definitely be received by vendor solicitor's closing (5:30pm) and I would be left vulnerable if I completed on my sale, but then couldn't complete on my onward purchase until the following day. This eventuality would also have had further ramifications and required me to pay the early repayment charge to my mortgage company. 

I am personally struggling with the commentary that my buyer isn't culpable. It was clear in our contracts that there was a 12pm completion deadline and at 11:50am they still had not made a significant payment to their solicitors. I kept my end of the bargain and vacated the house as agreed, which meant I had to remove all furniture and load it onto a van to move.

If the advice is that it's a pointless to try and pursue it then I understand, but I'm struggling to see how I've got to shoulder costs that I just shouldn't have needed to pay.

Right, so both contracts HAD been exchanged and the only reason there aren't costs from OP's vendor is they were moving to an empty property and didn't have much costs beyond 1 day's interest. 

Note the time of 12pm isn't a gospel time in itself, eg if the buyer transferred at 1pm with actual damage to you, then there would be £0 claimable. The point here is it was so late (5:10pm) that you couldn't transfer to your vendor, have their solicitor receive and confirm completion that day. I wouldn't get into the stuff about mortgages, ERCs, completion on one transaction but not the other etc - its not the completion on your sale that's particularly relevant, but rather your purchase given the time was too short. 

You have 2 hurdles: 
1) whether the judge agrees 5:10pm doesn't leave enough time to transfer that day -> I think that's a reasonable argument and you have the advice from your solicitor, but not a guarantee
2) actually recovering the money from buyer -> they own a property, so worst case you could place a charge on that, so you will get it eventually, may not get cash immediately though

I wouldn't necessarily throw good money after bad on a litigation solicitor which may double the amount and debatable whether you'd recover the extra - you can just write a letter before action and then file a small claim for the £1200. 

Thank you very much for taking the time to write such a considered reply. Much appreciated. 

Scotbot

Another thing that has not been established is who was responsible for the late transfer of funds. Unless it was a cash buyer the money would go fron the buyers lender to the buyers solicitor and then to your solicitor. The buyer would not be the one transferring the money. The fault lies with either their lender or solicitor.

tooldle

In terms of the removal fees, I'd suggest these could be contested on grounds that you appear not to have mitigated the risk. Waiting fees are often chargeable with the cheapest of quotations, insurance to cover such fees is often offered and some remover services will not offer a 'lift and drop' same day service, due to the likelihood of the scenario you describe occurring. It could be said you chose the most risky option (cheapest) in circumstances that themselves were not without risk. It is horrible to be in this situation but the potential for such a scenario to occur could be foreseen.
If this were me, I would also be considering how my refusal to complete (despite the time of day) impacts any claim against the purchaser. I've been in a similar situation myself where my sale completed around midday and yet my purchase did not complete until just before 5pm. In our case the mortgage funds were sent but not received. Our vendor was happy to proceed despite the knock on delay to their own purchase.
Whatever you decide, I hope it goes well for you. Enjoy your new home and this will soon be a distant memory.

Tiglet2

Scotbot said:

Another thing that has not been established is who was responsible for the late transfer of funds. Unless it was a cash buyer the money would go fron the buyers lender to the buyers solicitor and then to your solicitor. The buyer would not be the one transferring the money. The fault lies with either their lender or solicitor.

Not all of the monies are coming from the lender though.  A solicitor would still not be able to transfer funds for completion if, for example, the mortgage monies were in but the purchaser hadn't paid the remainder of the fees (if not coming from the sale proceeds).

NNLisbon

Tiglet2 said:

Scotbot said:

Another thing that has not been established is who was responsible for the late transfer of funds. Unless it was a cash buyer the money would go fron the buyers lender to the buyers solicitor and then to your solicitor. The buyer would not be the one transferring the money. The fault lies with either their lender or solicitor.

Not all of the monies are coming from the lender though.  A solicitor would still not be able to transfer funds for completion if, for example, the mortgage monies were in but the purchaser hadn't paid the remainder of the fees (if not coming from the sale proceeds).

This was the issue. Buyer hadn't paid their own monies to their solicitor and this caused all the delays. 

TheJP

Scotbot said:

Another thing that has not been established is who was responsible for the late transfer of funds. Unless it was a cash buyer the money would go fron the buyers lender to the buyers solicitor and then to your solicitor. The buyer would not be the one transferring the money. The fault lies with either their lender or solicitor.

For the OP this is irrelevant, the contract is between them and the buyer. Not the lender. Our buyers were late by 1.5 hours and we just scrapped by with completion, this for me is a breach as it meant completion for the onward sale was not feasible. 

OP i would ask your solicitor to send a note with a figure that gives them an opportunity to settle but clearly states if not paid you will sue on terms of breach of contract.