300% increase in bill not 54% with SSE

TheAble

You can't really buy a hot tub on the one hand and then claim "energy poverty" on the next. Correct was to not buy the hot tub.

Coffeekup

TheAble said:

You can't really buy a hot tub on the one hand and then claim "energy poverty" on the next. Correct was to not buy the hot tub.

I don't think anyone was claiming "energy poverty", but thanks fir sparking up an old thread.
Circumstances are different now if you managed to read the thread they used to use a hot tub now they don't turn it on because it's too expensive.

jimjames

TheAble said:

You can't really buy a hot tub on the one hand and then claim "energy poverty" on the next. Correct was to not buy the hot tub.

On the plus side when we're trying to get energy usage down making people aware of the cost of using certain items seems like a benefit to me. All the time energy was cheap people were happy to waste it, maybe now there will be a bit more attention paid to how much things cost to run.

agentcain

jimjames said:

TheAble said:

You can't really buy a hot tub on the one hand and then claim "energy poverty" on the next. Correct was to not buy the hot tub.

On the plus side when we're trying to get energy usage down making people aware of the cost of using certain items seems like a benefit to me. All the time energy was cheap people were happy to waste it, maybe now there will be a bit more attention paid to how much things cost to run.

Can't really say that for indoor appliances in the UK. The weather is cold and damp. Any usage is ultimately heat that heats up the house. No energy is really wasted. 

Section62

agentcain said:

jimjames said:

TheAble said:

You can't really buy a hot tub on the one hand and then claim "energy poverty" on the next. Correct was to not buy the hot tub.

On the plus side when we're trying to get energy usage down making people aware of the cost of using certain items seems like a benefit to me. All the time energy was cheap people were happy to waste it, maybe now there will be a bit more attention paid to how much things cost to run.

Can't really say that for indoor appliances in the UK. The weather is cold and damp. Any usage is ultimately heat that heats up the house. No energy is really wasted. 

Light and sound don't make any significant contribution to heating homes, which during the Summer is rarely needed anyway.

Running even LED lamps when not required is wasted energy, if heating is needed then use a heater designed to produce heat in the most efficient way possible.  Heat produced as a byproduct of other uses (e.g. actually watching TV) is different.

Astria

agentcain said:

jimjames said:

TheAble said:

You can't really buy a hot tub on the one hand and then claim "energy poverty" on the next. Correct was to not buy the hot tub.

On the plus side when we're trying to get energy usage down making people aware of the cost of using certain items seems like a benefit to me. All the time energy was cheap people were happy to waste it, maybe now there will be a bit more attention paid to how much things cost to run.

Can't really say that for indoor appliances in the UK. The weather is cold and damp. Any usage is ultimately heat that heats up the house. No energy is really wasted. 

If I leave a lamp on during the day, the light from the lamp is wasted energy that could be put to better use. It does produce heat as a by-product, but you could produce that heat (if needed) much more cheaply.

Petriix

Section62 said:

agentcain said:

jimjames said:

TheAble said:

You can't really buy a hot tub on the one hand and then claim "energy poverty" on the next. Correct was to not buy the hot tub.

On the plus side when we're trying to get energy usage down making people aware of the cost of using certain items seems like a benefit to me. All the time energy was cheap people were happy to waste it, maybe now there will be a bit more attention paid to how much things cost to run.

Can't really say that for indoor appliances in the UK. The weather is cold and damp. Any usage is ultimately heat that heats up the house. No energy is really wasted. 

Light and sound don't make any significant contribution to heating homes, which during the Summer is rarely needed anyway.

Running even LED lamps when not required is wasted energy, if heating is needed then use a heater designed to produce heat in the most efficient way possible.  Heat produced as a byproduct of other uses (e.g. actually watching TV) is different.

Creating light and sound doesn't really require significant amounts of energy (aside from that which is wasted as heat by the various components involved).

Waste heat does contribute to reducing the necessity of space heating in winter and lighting is required less in the summer months. So, while it's not advisable to leave the lights on, there is a small solace that any heat produced by lighting the house in winter will slightly reduce your heating bill.

jimjames

agentcain said:

jimjames said:

TheAble said:

You can't really buy a hot tub on the one hand and then claim "energy poverty" on the next. Correct was to not buy the hot tub.

On the plus side when we're trying to get energy usage down making people aware of the cost of using certain items seems like a benefit to me. All the time energy was cheap people were happy to waste it, maybe now there will be a bit more attention paid to how much things cost to run.

Can't really say that for indoor appliances in the UK. The weather is cold and damp. Any usage is ultimately heat that heats up the house. No energy is really wasted. 

But if it heats up the house when not needed then it is wasted both from a financial and environmental perspective. Things such as heating an empty house if lights on or heating a hot tub continuously so it's available to use when you want. As I say there are some positives from making people pay more attention to what they use.

Section62

Petriix said:

Section62 said:

agentcain said:

jimjames said:

TheAble said:

You can't really buy a hot tub on the one hand and then claim "energy poverty" on the next. Correct was to not buy the hot tub.

On the plus side when we're trying to get energy usage down making people aware of the cost of using certain items seems like a benefit to me. All the time energy was cheap people were happy to waste it, maybe now there will be a bit more attention paid to how much things cost to run.

Can't really say that for indoor appliances in the UK. The weather is cold and damp. Any usage is ultimately heat that heats up the house. No energy is really wasted. 

Light and sound don't make any significant contribution to heating homes, which during the Summer is rarely needed anyway.

Running even LED lamps when not required is wasted energy, if heating is needed then use a heater designed to produce heat in the most efficient way possible.  Heat produced as a byproduct of other uses (e.g. actually watching TV) is different.

Creating light and sound doesn't really require significant amounts of energy (aside from that which is wasted as heat by the various components involved).

It depends what you define as "significant". In the context of unaffordable energy bills, one person's "significant" can be another person's inconsequential.  A TV left on producing sound and light (in addition to heat) is wasteful, and not an efficient means of space heating.

However, the point I was making was about the inaccuracy of the comment "Any usage is ultimately heat that heats up the house".  Light, sound (and EMF) are not making significant contribution to heating homes.

In the context of the point jimjames made about increasing awareness of running costs it is misleading to imply that it doesn't matter because "Any usage is ultimately heat that heats up the house. No energy is really wasted." - this is the kind of flawed logic that people often use to internally justify not bothering to switch off, and then wonder why their bills are so high. (people generally, not any of the contributors to this thread)

agentcain

Not inaccurate at all

At the end of the day, everything that consumes energy within an enclosed space will generate heat in that space. It may be more expensive heat, but heat nonetheless. If heat is welcome, then by definition it's not wasted energy. If we're talking about warmer months or climates, then sure it's unwanted, but as mentioned lighting is used less, people get out more, using devices less etc. 

No justification needed for leaving things on. We just need to be realistic about what the situation is and where the real problem is.