Hierarchy of Road Users - 29th January 2022

mark1959

I took my car test 42 years ago and it must have been so much easier with far less traffic about. I didn't even have a roundabout on the route. What made drivers and riders behave themselves a lot more was a far more police presence. You didn't want to be pulled over by them [far easier also as less traffic about] as they could nearly always find something wrong with your car/'bike.  

daveyjp

No theory test or hazard perception when I took my test.

However back to the original point of the thread, the one to be aware of is the requirement to stop before turning into a side road if a pedestrian or cyclist is waiting to cross.  Very easy to rear end a car that does stop, or be rear ended if you are the one to stop.

Where this has the potential to cause real fun is roundabouts,  If someone is waiting to cross the exit you want to take are you expected to stop on the roundabout so the pedestrian can cross?

neilmcl

daveyjp said:

Where this has the potential to cause real fun is roundabouts,  If someone is waiting to cross the exit you want to take are you expected to stop on the roundabout so the pedestrian can cross?

There's a roundabout up the road from me in front of the entrance to a supermarket that has a non-controlled crossing point for pedestrians and I can see this could be very confusing, eg, a pedestrian is waiting to cross so any traffic approaching or exiting the roundabout on the same road the pedestrian is crossing wouldn't have to stop but cars that are turning left onto the road from the other entrance would.

Grey_Critic

I have read reports that *some* cyclists are claiming they are now in charge on the roads. It is to be hoped that it is all mouth and no trousers or we are going to see lots of bodies littering the road. Personally I try to give cyclists room but my real concern is that there is no rule that says **Cyclists should be clearly visible** Many are with Hi-Viz vests and proper lights both day and night but many are not. We already complain about the Electric Scooters that are being ridden illegally which from personal observation the Police ignore The cyclists for whom pavements and Red lights are just so much street furniture and are ignored - the Police ignore them now so how are they going to enforce this *New* Highway Code when they have failed to do so in the past? Perhaps I might suggest that these so called *new rules* are step one in bringing cyclists into line with other road users. I can see the headline now **Cyclists to be required to PAY Road Tax and Compulsory Insurance and be easily identifiable. Could create a whole new industry nicking and fining them. Would solve the Chancellors money problems - could then extend it to dogs.

By the way the whole left hand thing is a big joke for older drivers we were taught such things 50/60/70 years ago.

Remember Mirror - Signal - Manoeuvre - and Always look over your shoulder when moving off or opening the door.

marlot

Every driver should do some top-up training every few years.

It is mad that I can pass my test at 17, and never do another day of training in my life.

Car_54

Grey_Critic said:

I have read reports that *some* cyclists are claiming they are now in charge on the roads. It is to be hoped that it is all mouth and no trousers or we are going to see lots of bodies littering the road. Personally I try to give cyclists room but my real concern is that there is no rule that says **Cyclists should be clearly visible** Many are with Hi-Viz vests and proper lights both day and night but many are not. We already complain about the Electric Scooters that are being ridden illegally which from personal observation the Police ignore The cyclists for whom pavements and Red lights are just so much street furniture and are ignored - the Police ignore them now so how are they going to enforce this *New* Highway Code when they have failed to do so in the past? Perhaps I might suggest that these so called *new rules* are step one in bringing cyclists into line with other road users. I can see the headline now **Cyclists to be required to PAY Road Tax and Compulsory Insurance and be easily identifiable. Could create a whole new industry nicking and fining them. Would solve the Chancellors money problems - could then extend it to dogs.

By the way the whole left hand thing is a big joke for older drivers we were taught such things 50/60/70 years ago.

Remember Mirror - Signal - Manoeuvre - and Always look over your shoulder when moving off or opening the door.

It’s MIrrorSSS …

Grey_Critic

marlot said:

Every driver should do some top-up training every few years.

It is mad that I can pass my test at 17, and never do another day of training in my life.

Of course they should.

Anyone notice that all the calls for older drivers to be subject to *fitness to drive* calls are from those who *think* they are expert drivers.

prowla

1. Cyclists

2. White van drivers.

3. Everybody else.

MacPingu1986

Grey_Critic said:

I have read reports that *some* cyclists are claiming they are now in charge on the roads. It is to be hoped that it is all mouth and no trousers or we are going to see lots of bodies littering the road. Personally I try to give cyclists room but my real concern is that there is no rule that says **Cyclists should be clearly visible** Many are with Hi-Viz vests and proper lights both day and night but many are not. We already complain about the Electric Scooters that are being ridden illegally which from personal observation the Police ignore The cyclists for whom pavements and Red lights are just so much street furniture and are ignored - the Police ignore them now so how are they going to enforce this *New* Highway Code when they have failed to do so in the past? Perhaps I might suggest that these so called *new rules* are step one in bringing cyclists into line with other road users. I can see the headline now **Cyclists to be required to PAY Road Tax and Compulsory Insurance and be easily identifiable. Could create a whole new industry nicking and fining them. Would solve the Chancellors money problems - could then extend it to dogs.

By the way the whole left hand thing is a big joke for older drivers we were taught such things 50/60/70 years ago.

Remember Mirror - Signal - Manoeuvre - and Always look over your shoulder when moving off or opening the door.

We can have a nice sensible discussion about Highway Code changes without bringing all sorts of false stereotypes about "cyclists" to encourage aggression... But just to set out some useful background info...

1) - Hi Viz doesn't actually have any practical effect on visibility and accident reduction (actually studies show it increases your collision risk as cars are more likely to perform dangerous close/punishment passes on riders that look better equipped) - if people can't see someone on a bicycle its usually because they didn't look in the first place. Lights are already a legal requirement at night. 
2) - E scooters are already illegal outside of certain trials.
3) - Pavement cycling shouldn't happen but it's just not a material problem
4) - Cars run red lights at a rate not much lower than bicycles (around 10% against 15%) and do it far more dangerously when they do. "low level" traffic offences are a problem for all types of road users - no need to encourage hostility against people on bicycles by suggesting its a special cycling problem.
5) - "Road tax" hasn't existed since the late 1930s, - what's paid is a pollution based levy, with various vehicles already benefiting from exemptions etc... Roads are funded out of general taxation, so that mostly your Income tax, NI, Council tax & VAT. 
6) - Cycling isn't subject to compulsory insurance because the risk of harm is so low - similarly to how "pedestrian insurance" isn't compulsory. Ditto re license plates.

ArchLen

Car_54 said:

Hasn't the increased volume of traffic in itself made the test harder?
Can you give some examples of things that were once a fail but now a pass?

1) No, sitting in heavy traffic in city centres (where most test centres are located) on an already short test makes it easier than it was when people had to actually drive around their test route. Additionally cars are now much easier to drive due to the level of technological advancements made. 

2) Many things, for example going over the speed limit, sitting in the right hand lane on a dual carriageway, using the wrong gears, failing to use mirrors correctly and at appropriate times, moving off without lights on in the dark. The list goes on. This data is readily available from the DVSA via freedom of information requests, or speak to anyone inside the industry. I.e. a reputable instructor or examiner.