County Court Claim - Defence + Counterclaim

theeagleman

Coupon-mad said:

You need all those transcripts with a skeleton. See NEWBIES thread.

No worries. It is not late. You file & serve that along with costs schedule if you've not done that yet).  There is no deadline on a skelly or costs.

The week before a hearing is ok.

- Are the transcripts (in full) appended to the skelly arguement document? or can argument be drawn from the approved judgement?

- Found VCS vs Ferguson transcript. Cannot find the Clay vs CEL (but got approved judgement). Any particular place to look for those?

- Costs i submitted with the WS (and it included the hearing fee already). I assume that is fine? or have to submit a seperate one?

Umkomaas

theeagleman said:

Coupon-mad said:

You need all those transcripts with a skeleton. See NEWBIES thread.

No worries. It is not late. You file & serve that along with costs schedule if you've not done that yet).  There is no deadline on a skelly or costs.

The week before a hearing is ok.

- Are the transcripts (in full) appended to the skelly arguement document? or can argument be drawn from the approved judgement?

- Found VCS vs Ferguson transcript. Cannot find the Clay vs CEL (but got approved judgement). Any particular place to look for those?

- Costs i submitted with the WS (and it included the hearing fee already). I assume that is fine? or have to submit a seperate one?

Try here:

https://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=&ved=2ahUKEwjxhfu1tOL4AhUmS0EAHUEmDxoQFnoECAUQAQ&url=https%3A%2F%2Fus.v-cdn.net%2F6031891%2Fuploads%2Feditor%2Fw9%2Fsuid1qfwcw8h.pdf&usg=AOvVaw0BQVbmDRz5t7FIIBdVM6vH

theeagleman

Umkomaas said:

Try here:

https://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=&ved=2ahUKEwjxhfu1tOL4AhUmS0EAHUEmDxoQFnoECAUQAQ&url=https%3A%2F%2Fus.v-cdn.net%2F6031891%2Fuploads%2Feditor%2Fw9%2Fsuid1qfwcw8h.pdf&usg=AOvVaw0BQVbmDRz5t7FIIBdVM6vH

Thank you for supply this!

However, i realise my sentence structure was all wrong. I do have the approveed jugdement, but was looking for the transcript itself.

But i think using the approved judgement (not the full transcript of each party speaking) is fine.

1505grandad

A heads-up  -  you will find that the documents will be headed "Judgment"  -  no middle "e" in this context.

Coupon-mad

Yes I think so, in that case.

Have you already appended your other authorities that supported your cc, like Ferguson v British Gas and the Vento Guidelines and any other such things that your WS relied on?

If not yet, then you must append them to the skelly. You can't just 'mention' the law and case law, you have to bring it all before the court.

theeagleman

1505grandad said:

A heads-up  -  you will find that the documents will be headed "Judgment"  -  no middle "e" in this context.

Thank you for this... never would have thought it.

theeagleman

Coupon-mad said:

Yes I think so, in that case.

Have you already appended your other authorities that supported your cc, like Ferguson v British Gas and the Vento Guidelines and any other such things that your WS relied on?

If not yet, then you must append them to the skelly. You can't just 'mention' the law and case law, you have to bring it all before the court.

Nope, have not appended or started the skelly. Just lined up a draft. Will do so in the next couple of days. Gathering all the documents first.

I mentioned the Vento and Ferguson vs British Gas in the WS, but also pointed to the relevant parts of the judgment within my WS which were applicable. Also added Harrison v Link Financial Ltd and mentioned the relevant parts.

However just scanned my WS and realised did not expand upon the Vidal-Hall v Google (just "mentioned" it as something i would rely on - no relevant parts included).

Coupon-mad

Mentioning them and quoting from authorities is not enough for a Judge.

You need to include all of them in full and seize thd chance to briefly explain the relevance of Vidal Hall in the skelly.

theeagleman

Here is the skelly argument (mainly 9 pages) with a very long appended evidence pack

https://www.dropbox.com/s/p8g61jkgjfbbk83/SKELETON ARGUMENT - REDACTED.pdf?dl=0

Coupon-mad said:

Sounds like a good basis for a counterclaim but to see how to word it (using relevant law and case law) see tge counterclaims on the threads by @ellaro9  and @Nosy (be aware Nosy had two threads and only one included a counterclaim).  Both succeeded.

Wanted to ask about the above cases, and whether they are public and can be used?

Coupon-mad

The usernames are links to their profiles and their threads.  That's why I gave them to you, to copy some wording and case law from.

You can't 'use' the cases as they don't set a precedent and there are no transcripts to show a Judge. They are just examples of counterclaims we've done before.

Counterclaims are hard work to argue the legal case for though. Not for the faint hearted and they don't always win. Best of luck!