Disabled, Parked on public road, ticketed by private firm!

fisherjim

Sad__Sam said:

I Thought the signage was clear.  The Private land was the parking bays.

In the black part at the bottom, white writing "Vehicles are left on this car park".

Doesn't mention the access road?  The car park spaces are numbered.

I agree with CM your assumptions make perfect sense (though PPC's rarely make sense) and if the signage does not mention DYL's or any variation to their official meaning you could argue (with a judge the PPC won't listen) that you considered it within the normal rules to park there.

Sad__Sam

Slight update.

My account has been passed to the debt management team!  
The initial £100, cost reduced to £60 has now escalated to £170, the additional £70 for debt collection costs!
Even though they haven't established who was the driver, or who they would be suing!

Now I must pay £170 to avoid further costs.
VCS refuse to show proof they even have the legal right, permission to ticket in that location.

I guess I must weight as they may issue proceeding against me, and seek to claim costs.

At what point when requested should they show they have the legal right to issue tickets?
It could be a massive con.

I'm sure others have been there.

fisherjim

Sad__Sam said:

Slight update.

My account has been passed to the debt management team!  
The initial £100, cost reduced to £60 has now escalated to £170, the additional £70 for debt collection costs!
Even though they haven't established who was the driver, or who they would be suing!

Now I must pay £170 to avoid further costs.
VCS refuse to show proof they even have the legal right, permission to ticket in that location.

I guess I must weight as they may issue proceeding against me, and seek to claim costs.

At what point when requested should they show they have the legal right to issue tickets?
It could be a massive con.

I'm sure others have been there.

All quite normal this is what they do that extra £70 isn't valid if taken to court as the debt recovery idiots failed to collect.

They will have to show their contract to a judge if it goes to court though.

What do you mean they haven't established the driver what exactly did you say when you appealed, in any case you told them in the first post on here:

I parked on Double yellow lines, on the public road, with my badge displayed.

The muppets trawl through these forums for evidence.

D_P_Dance

The initial £100, cost reduced to £60 has now escalated to £170, 

They have added what appears to be an extra unlawful amount for debt collection. This amounts to double recover and some Judges have dismissed an entire claim because of this. Read this and complain to your MP.

Excel v Wilkinson

At the Bradford County Court, District Judge Claire Jackson (now HHJ Jackson, a Specialist Civil Circuit Judge) decided to hear a 'test case' a few months ago, where £60 had been added to a parking charge despite Judges up and down the country repeatedly disallowing that sum and warning parking firms not to waste court time with such spurious claims.   That case was Excel v Wilkinson: G4QZ465V, heard in July 2020 and leave to appeal was refused and that route was not pursued.  The Judge concluded that such claims are proceedings with 'an improper collateral purpose'.   This Judge - and others who have since copied her words and struck dozens of cases out in late 2020 and into 2021 - went into significant detail and concluded that parking operators (such as this Claimant) are seeking to circumvent CPR 27.14 as well as breaching the Consumer Rights Act 2015.   DJ Hickinbottom has recently struck more cases out in that court area, stating: ''I find that striking out this claim is the only appropriate manner in which the disapproval of the court can be shown''.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/16qovzulab1szem/G4QZ465V%20Excel%20v%20Wilkinson.pdf?dl=0

However, a VCS appealed this so it may not apply in all cases, read this

https://www.dropbox.com/s/ntksx9g7177ahyg/VCS v Percy v1 Amendments (2).pdf?dl=0Also read this

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/6279348/witness-statements-2-transcripts-re-parking-firms-false-costs-recorder-cohen-qc-judgment-2021/p1

Coupon-mad

My account has been passed to the debt management team!  

No it hasn't, and you don't have an account with them.  Nor do they have a separate 'team'.

D_P_Dance

If this was indeed a public road, complain to the Trading Standards   and your MP.  

fisherjim

D_P_Dance said:

If this was indeed a public road, complain to the Trading Standards   and your MP.  

It turns out this is a private road DPD

Sad__Sam

Hi all.
I have today received a Court claim form, dated March 11th, with 14 days to reply.

Claim is for £170 + £35 court fee + £50 legal representation, = £255 total.

I have asked VCS for:

·       I request a true copy of the VCS/landowner agreement.

·       A copy of the KADOE agreement with DVLA

·       Copies of the relevant site signs.

·       A map showing the layout of the car park plus the positions of all signs.

·       All unaltered photos you took of my car and the site in relation to this matter.

·       A plan of the carpark & your positioning of my car as per your alleged contravention.

Their reply was “We will only answer pertinent points at this stage”.  I feel it is rather pertinent that you ascertain their authority to ticket vehicles, and were if any agreement covers.

From the vast experience of those on this site, could you please advice what I should include in a defence and/or counter claim for stress, time, illegal use of data.

 

Many thanks

Fruitcake

VCS are not obliged to provide you with a copy of the landowner agreement until the WS/exhibits stage.

The KADOE agreement is a standard template, and an example copy is available online. The agreement is between the claimant and the DVLA so they are not obliged to send you a copy they and the DVLA have signed. 
The claimant is a member of the IPC AoS therefore they have a KADOE agreement in place.

You will get images of the signs they intend to rely on at WS/exhibit stage. You should get your own images of signs as they are now, and see if GSV has any historic images that might be useful.

A site map should be provided at WS/exhibits stage as part of the landowner agreement.
The same applies for a map showing the alleged position of your car.

All you are entitled to at this stage is copies of your personal data that they hold about you.


You should wait two days before doing your AoS. You should follow the guide to court written by bargepole that you will find in the second post of the NEWBIES.

There is a new defence template for you to use in the sticky Announcements.

KeithP

Sad__Sam said:

Hi all.
I have today received a Court claim form, dated March 11th, with 14 days to reply.

With a Claim Issue Date of 11th March, you have until Wednesday 30th March to file an Acknowledgment of Service. Do not file an Acknowledgment of Service before 16th March, but otherwise there is nothing to be gained by delaying it. 

To file an Acknowledgment of Service, follow the guidance in the Dropbox file linked from the second post in the NEWBIES thread.

Having filed an Acknowledgment of Service in a timely manner, you have until 4pm on Wednesday 13th April 2022 to file your Defence.

That's over four weeks away. Plenty of time to produce a Defence, but please don't leave it to the last minute.

To create a Defence, and then file a Defence by email, look again at the second post on the NEWBIES thread - immediately following where you found the Acknowledgment of Service instructions.

Don't miss the deadline for filing an Acknowledgment of Service, nor that for filing a Defence.

Do not try and file a Defence via the MoneyClaimOnline website. Once an Acknowledgment of Service has been filed, the MCOL website should be treated as 'read only'.