[rant] single journey fares are like a rip off that I start to think about getting a car

miklcct

I'm here ranting about how rip-off the public transport single journey fares here in the UK, so I'm considering if it will be worthwhile for me to buy a car as I'm now spending approximately about £100 per month in transport.

I currently use a bus monthly ticket at £61 per month, but in effect I normally spend about £80 per month in local travel, because there is no monthly integrated ticket which is valid across all modes of public transport in my place. There are two competing bus companies and a train line with 7 stations on it, and I only use one of them frequent enough to warrant a season ticket. However, as there are differences in the area served by the bus companies, I still need to use the service of another bus company for about 2 times per week, where a single is £3.8, a return is £4.3, and a day ticket is £4.1 (cheaper than a return). Also, I need to use the train for a few times per month, mostly for shopping (as a retail park is next to the train station one stop away), and thanks to the fare reform of SWR introducing the "evening out" fare, I now pay £1.95 for a return instead of £2.5 in the past with a railcard.

Then comes to long-distance travel. The train is only a good value if my destination is along the line between my home and London (there are only 2 train routes serving my home - a half-hourly express service to London and an hourly stopping service completing it, and a 2-hourly CrossCountry service to Birmingham and Manchester going through Reading). If there is any deviation from the main line, it will not be as fast as driving, because trains in this country are slow with the exception of the HS1 and a few upgraded lines at 200 km/h. At 140 - 160 km/h, the train only beats driving if it runs on a direct line. However, most of my long-distance travel are to places outside London. Because train fares in this country are an absolute rip-off (even after split ticketing and railcard discount) with only few exceptions such as those "via Barnham" fares, unless an advance ticket is available at the exact same time I intend to make the journey, once I add on the train fares, I am spending £100-£120 or even more per month in transport, and this now comes close to the tipping point of car ownership when I add in the convenience cost into it.

If I decide to own a car, then I will be sinful of driving it everywhere with the exception of direct train journeys (where it is faster than driving). In such case, my predicted car usage is about 14000 km per year, with about 7000 in local travel.

So I'd like to know:
1. How much do you spend on public transport, including long-distance trips in the UK, if you don't have a car?
2. How much spending on transport will you consider a car to replace public transport?

JJ_Egan

Work out what you can buy car wise .

Add on car tax   add on insurance  add on  expensive fuel  and not forgetting any repairs .

TheAble

7000 miles a year is probably at least £1000 in fuel now, and that's with a fuel efficient car driven carefully.

macman

JJ_Egan said:

Work out what you can buy car wise .

Add on car tax   add on insurance  add on  expensive fuel  and not forgetting any repairs .

Not forgetting depreciation: probably the biggest cost of all.

JJ_Egan

Run em into the ground tends to get rid of that .

But yes some single fares are expensive especially at short notice always have been even going back to BR days .

[Deleted User]

macman said:

JJ_Egan said:

Work out what you can buy car wise .

Add on car tax   add on insurance  add on  expensive fuel  and not forgetting any repairs .

Not forgetting depreciation: probably the biggest cost of all.

Depreciation isn't a cost at all. Full stop. No-one gets a bill for depreciation. You do not have to send the Depreciation Company a cheque. You buy something, it gets older, it's worth less as it's used. Aside from a few rare things like houses, that is how it all works. You don't buy a TV and say "oh it's going to cost me extra money because it was £500 new and in 5 years it's worth nothing so I'd better not buy it". It's worth less because you have used it for the purpose it was bought for and got value from that. Unless you buy cars with the intention of selling them later on or think it'll go up in value, the fact it's worth less than it was is how life works and is utterly irrelevant to most people.

coffeehound

Yes agreed single fares are over-priced.  I work nights so can only use a day return when working consecutive nights and have to get singles on the other days.  The only positive is that on the late trains, the guard doesn't always check tickets

theoretica

The HMRC mileage rate is 45p a mile - 8700 miles x .45 = £3915 a year as what they have set for not being out of pocket for business miles.  Looks on the high side for me of the cost of running a small cheap car.

Depending on your journeys and availability in your area you might find it worth looking at whether there is something like the city car club or occasional rentals - a car when you want it but not owned.

MovingForwards

1a. For my current job it would be about £140pm just to get to work, 90+ minutes plus walking between buses. Train and bus is about £240, 60 mins + walking.

1b. New job would be loads, upto 3h each way and a few trains / buses. By car it's 30 minutes door to door as I'm going in the opposite direction to rush hour traffic. It will cost £95.83pm and that covers insurance, servicing, petrol (free tax). I also get to use my car for going out, visiting, shopping.

2. Depends on the job, but I've driven to most of mine as rush hour public transport isn't one I relish, nor cope with due to health. I've had buses take 25 minutes then the route was altered and it would take upto 90 minutes, it was quicker to catch 2 different buses and saved 30 minutes.

TheAble

Deleted_User said:

macman said:

JJ_Egan said:

Work out what you can buy car wise .

Add on car tax   add on insurance  add on  expensive fuel  and not forgetting any repairs .

Not forgetting depreciation: probably the biggest cost of all.

Depreciation isn't a cost at all. Full stop. No-one gets a bill for depreciation. You do not have to send the Depreciation Company a cheque. You buy something, it gets older, it's worth less as it's used. Aside from a few rare things like houses, that is how it all works. You don't buy a TV and say "oh it's going to cost me extra money because it was £500 new and in 5 years it's worth nothing so I'd better not buy it". It's worth less because you have used it for the purpose it was bought for and got value from that. Unless you buy cars with the intention of selling them later on or think it'll go up in value, the fact it's worth less than it was is how life works and is utterly irrelevant to most people.

It is a real cost. If you buy a car for £5k and drive it for 5 years then scrap it, you now have no car so need to buy a new one. So your depreciation cost is £1k/year. If you hadn't bought the car in the first place you would still have £5k in your pocket. The cheque that you effectively DO have to send to the depreciation company is the money that you now have to lay out for another car because your old one expired. Just in the same way that you have to replace boilers, TVs with newer models, computers and the like. You may have got value from all these things, but the cost is definitely there.

MalMonroe

coffeehound said:

Yes agreed single fares are over-priced.  I work nights so can only use a day return when working consecutive nights and have to get singles on the other days.  The only positive is that on the late trains, the guard doesn't always check tickets

But on the late trains you don't know whether or not the guard is coming to check so you'd need a ticket. Right? Sorry but that kind of 'trick' is beneath me.