Energy news in general

What_time_is_it

pochase said:

That is true, but are you able to support her in ignoring the fact, that she is unable to afford to stay in her home, for an extended time?

I think when you wrote your first post for her we were talking about 12.5p, now it is 14.17 because we don't know the split for the £3500 from yesterday, but it should be 15p to 16p, that is almost £10000 just for gas, up from £7500 a few days ago.

Thanks for your concern. And I really understand why you would say that. We really are not ignoring the facts and are explaining it to her regularly. She cannot conceive of the idea of moving house, and she really finds it hard to understand that her usage is extreme. However we approach it, it ends up with tears, frustration, anger, arguments, and ever increasing stress. It's a nightmare. We don't know what to do for the best. 

si_74

What_time_is_it said:

Whilst I agree generally about lowering usage, it's not always that simple.

My mother-in-law lives on her own and currently uses 60,000 kwhs of gas per year. She won't move house and the place is literally falling apart.
I can't sleep at night worrying about how we are going to cover this. If unit prices hit 20p for winter 2023/24, which doesn't seem that unlikely to be honest, then that'll be £12k just on gas usage over one year.

I had a similar situation with my mum, though her usage is nowhere near that level (about 19000 kwh). She thought she was ok as she was consistently just in credit which is no good with the winter still ahead of us and the upcoming prices. Finally I managed to get through to her though. Doing nothing at your mother in laws level of usage is probably not an option. I had to use some pretty frank conversations to finally get my mum to understand where this was headed but, to get a philosophical, I rationalised it in my mind by seeing it as the circle of life. She looked after me until I could look after myself, now it's payback time and just like she used to have to be strict with me sometimes, so do I with her now. I didn't like almost having to frighten her into doing something, but it was absolutely in her best interests.

lisyloo

Mstty said:

I don't subscribe to any more help this winter. I think energy customers need a big shock, reduce their energy usage and then some target help next year for winter if gas futures are still this high or higher.

I guess someone on dialysis can go to the hospital and disrupt their life.
Not sure how it works for those on oxygen machines
or my elderly dad who's just got over cancer from not having the heating on.

having said that he does get quite a lot of help being a disabled pensioner, but there will be people for whose circumstances that could be interpreted as pretty heartless.
You can't reduce your energy needs for essential health devices or in some case heating for the elderly or unhealthy.

If it gets really cold of there is a power cut I'll be bring my Dad to my house, but I guess not everyone will have that option.

lisyloo

What_time_is_it said:

Civil unrest is coming on an unprecedented scale.

Is there any evidence for this?
Are the elderly and those on dialysis and oxygen machines going to be pounding the streets?

What_time_is_it

si_74 said:

What_time_is_it said:

Whilst I agree generally about lowering usage, it's not always that simple.

My mother-in-law lives on her own and currently uses 60,000 kwhs of gas per year. She won't move house and the place is literally falling apart.
I can't sleep at night worrying about how we are going to cover this. If unit prices hit 20p for winter 2023/24, which doesn't seem that unlikely to be honest, then that'll be £12k just on gas usage over one year.

I had a similar situation with my mum, though her usage is nowhere near that level (about 19000 kwh). She thought she was ok as she was consistently just in credit which is no good with the winter still ahead of us and the upcoming prices. Finally I managed to get through to her though. Doing nothing at your mother in laws level of usage is probably not an option. I had to use some pretty frank conversations to finally get my mum to understand where this was headed but, to get a philosophical, I rationalised it in my mind by seeing it as the circle of life. She looked after me until I could look after myself, now it's payback time and just like she used to have to be strict with me sometimes, so do I with her now. I didn't like almost having to frighten her into doing something, but it was absolutely in her best interests.

I agree. I really do. But I honestly don't know where to start.
Moving home would be massively traumatic for her. Plus her house is so full of hoarded stuff (despite my best efforts over the years in throwing stuff out and selling things!) that it would be a seriously daunting task. 
So she stays where she is and where she is happy. But it's falling apart and costs a fortune - more than her income!
We are trying to replace the boiler, but things like insulation and double glazing are totally unaffordable too. 
I'm at my wits end.

Mstty

lisyloo said:

Mstty said:

I don't subscribe to any more help this winter. I think energy customers need a big shock, reduce their energy usage and then some target help next year for winter if gas futures are still this high or higher.

I guess someone on dialysis can go to the hospital and disrupt their life.
Not sure how it works for those on oxygen machines
or my elderly dad who's just got over cancer from not having the heating on.

having said that he does get quite a lot of help being a disabled pensioner, but there will be people for whose circumstances that could be interpreted as pretty heartless.
You can't reduce your energy needs for essential health devices or in some case heating for the elderly or unhealthy.

If it gets really cold of there is a power cut I'll be bring my Dad to my house, but I guess not everyone will have that option.

Oh please, we can all come up with a fringe issue and this is down to poorly targeted help which has been rightly in the press and media and does need attention.

I am sorry for anyone in your family that may be in these fringe situations but in most cases my point stands in my opinion. 

What_time_is_it

lisyloo said:

What_time_is_it said:

Civil unrest is coming on an unprecedented scale.

Is there any evidence for this?
Are the elderly and those on dialysis and oxygen machines going to be pounding the streets?

Hilarious.
Without action now millions of people (of all ages, working or not) will not be able to feed their families.
I know, side-splitting isn't it?

lisyloo

Mstty said:

lisyloo said:

Mstty said:

I don't subscribe to any more help this winter. I think energy customers need a big shock, reduce their energy usage and then some target help next year for winter if gas futures are still this high or higher.

I guess someone on dialysis can go to the hospital and disrupt their life.
Not sure how it works for those on oxygen machines
or my elderly dad who's just got over cancer from not having the heating on.

having said that he does get quite a lot of help being a disabled pensioner, but there will be people for whose circumstances that could be interpreted as pretty heartless.
You can't reduce your energy needs for essential health devices or in some case heating for the elderly or unhealthy.

If it gets really cold of there is a power cut I'll be bring my Dad to my house, but I guess not everyone will have that option.

Oh please, we can all come up with a fringe issue and this is down to poorly targeted help which has been rightly in the press and media and does need attention.

I am sorry for anyone in your family that may be in these fringe situations but in most cases my point stands in my opinion. 

ok, take you point.
I don't think being elderly or disabled are "fringe" issues.
There are plenty of other people who will find it hard to reduce their usage.
For example new mums with lots of washing.

But absolutely if you want people to conserve then you've certainly got a big stick here.

SJMALBA

It's far too simplistic to say that the shock will force people to reduce energy usage; to say the least, not everyone is sufficiently wealthy that their high energy use is flagrant waste because it is of little/no financial concern to them.

There are some, perhaps many, who are necessarily high energy users (some elderly, disabled etc.), who may already have reached the stage that there is nothing else they can do to reduce their energy usage, other than switching the heating off altogether, which is not merely uncomfortable, but potentially dangerous, even deadly!

Also, there are also some for whom 'normal' prices, before the extraordinary situation of recent times, were not cheap.

It's a very bad situation, for some (and increasing numbers of people?), just in respect of energy, let alone the much wider 'cost of living crisis'...

Spies

What_time_is_it said:

si_74 said:

What_time_is_it said:

Whilst I agree generally about lowering usage, it's not always that simple.

My mother-in-law lives on her own and currently uses 60,000 kwhs of gas per year. She won't move house and the place is literally falling apart.
I can't sleep at night worrying about how we are going to cover this. If unit prices hit 20p for winter 2023/24, which doesn't seem that unlikely to be honest, then that'll be £12k just on gas usage over one year.

I had a similar situation with my mum, though her usage is nowhere near that level (about 19000 kwh). She thought she was ok as she was consistently just in credit which is no good with the winter still ahead of us and the upcoming prices. Finally I managed to get through to her though. Doing nothing at your mother in laws level of usage is probably not an option. I had to use some pretty frank conversations to finally get my mum to understand where this was headed but, to get a philosophical, I rationalised it in my mind by seeing it as the circle of life. She looked after me until I could look after myself, now it's payback time and just like she used to have to be strict with me sometimes, so do I with her now. I didn't like almost having to frighten her into doing something, but it was absolutely in her best interests.

I agree. I really do. But I honestly don't know where to start.
Moving home would be massively traumatic for her. Plus her house is so full of hoarded stuff (despite my best efforts over the years in throwing stuff out and selling things!) that it would be a seriously daunting task. 
So she stays where she is and where she is happy. But it's falling apart and costs a fortune - more than her income!
We are trying to replace the boiler, but things like insulation and double glazing are totally unaffordable too. 
I'm at my wits end.

Are there no local council schemes for insulation?