Land at rear of property on orginal deeds

Section62

jbeechey92 said:

What about the mention of a messuage ?? 

jbeechey92 said:

In the orginal lease and also deed ? 

As things stand there is no evidence it ever existed, or if it did that it was built on the land you now own (and/or one the allotment behind)

The reference in the deed is only to a "power to erect" on a piece of land - it doesn't mean that power was exercised.

AdrianC

jbeechey92 said:

In the orginal lease and also deed ? 

We can repeat until we're blue in the face, but it won't change the reality. That paperwork is not what you have bought.

jbeechey92

il just stay on there using it nobody’s doing anything about me being on it I only store a few things down there not much and nothing of value and I clear it back every so often, I see the allotment guy regular and he stops has a general chit chat nothing mentioned of the allotment so il just carry on as I am maybe one day in the future they might put the lots up for sale and il just purchase it then or if it goes on for years and years just try the adverse possession but might rock the boat abit then 😆 

lincroft1710

jbeechey92 said:

What about the mention of a messuage ?? 

This word probably appears on most old house deeds and means not just the dwelling but also outbuildings and land belonging to said dwelling. The use of the word does not help your case one iota.

tooldle

Why not speak with the ‘allotment man’ to see if you can legalise your use of the land? Yes it might cost you a few quid a year but, it does give you the protection of the site being in use. If the allotments were to be sold, i think it more likely the site as a whole would be offered, rather than individual plots. A few quid a year for an allotment versus a housing estate on your back fence; i know which i would prefer.

jbeechey92

By all accounts speaking to a neighbor you pay £50 one of fee as deposit and that’s all you have to pay just covers for an insurance policy like a public liability so I was told 

carefullycautious

And as for the Japanese Knotweed the worst thing you can do is keep chopping it back as it will spread quicker and any pieces scattered about will take root. It does need to be treated but by whom?

jbeechey92

Well I have heard you can poison it but it takes a few years of treatment to work 

bouicca21

Lincroft got there before me.  The use of the word messuage is a complete red herring.  There is absolutely nothing in that document to suggest that OP owns anything other than his house and garden. And nothing to suggest that the allotments have been acquired by adverse possession.  If OP really wants to exorcise the bee flapping about in his/her bonnet he/she should get him/herself down to the local archives to do a bit of research.  It wouldn’t particularly surprise me to find that the allotment gardens were created by an enclosure act. Admittedly 1897 is a bit late for that but creating allotment gardens for the poor was thought to be  an ace idea and the Crawshays might well have done so in an attempt to salvage their filthy rich consciences.

Section62

bouicca21 said:

If OP really wants to exorcise the bee flapping about in his/her bonnet he/she should get him/herself down to the local archives to do a bit of research.  It wouldn’t particularly surprise me to find that the allotment gardens were created by an enclosure act. Admittedly 1897 is a bit late for that but creating allotment gardens for the poor was thought to be  an ace idea and the Crawshays might well have done so in an attempt to salvage their filthy rich consciences.

The local colliery started production in 1886 and

"As with most coal mining areas in the South Wales Coalfield, a local community immediately sprang up around the colliery at [...]. 300 houses were built in typical South Wales Valleys terraced fashion by the mine owners in order to house workers and their families, with most built on the opposing (Western) side of the valley." [thanks Wikipedia]


I surmised that the OP's home was one of the cottages constructed for mineworkers - and looking at the old OS maps (and actually still apparent on the current ones) the majority of terraces of houses have a pattern of house/garden/track/allotments in a form of planned development.... not quite a garden city, but certainly a gardening village.

At a guess, the colliery developers likely felt that the availability of allotment land would be a low cost (to them) inducement for people to come and work at their mine, provide a source of affordable food, and give the miners something to do other than the things the working classes were inclined to do in less forward-thinking places.  Also quite remarkable how much space within the terraces was made available for churches and chapels.