Bank transfer for non delivery of items (scam). Am I covered by APP?

GTR_King

wow that seems odd, 

I bet they have loads of music on Apple Music/Spotify, 

Hopefully you will get your stuff, keep trying 

I wonder what DJ it is as would probably heard most of their songs if not then i must be missing out 

eskbanker

Oliroy said:

eskbanker said:

Oliroy said:

Are there other options that I could consider? 

If they're a well-known artist active on social media then you might be able to shame them into action via these platforms, or at least threaten to do so?  You'd need to be fairly careful about exactly how you did so, and perhaps warn them first ("I've repeatedly been trying to contact you via private messages but may need to do so more publicly if you fail to answer again"), but as above your bank isn't responsible and neither is anyone else....

I have sent them numerous messages to their direct mobile number, but it appears they've blocked me, and also to their social media direct messages, but all of these are still showing as "unread", despite them being online numerous times.

I now understand now that my bank is not liable for this, and this was what I as unsure of, and also how best to proceed with this situation.

My point was that texts and private messages aren't publicly visible, whereas if you post on their Facebook page, for example, it'll be visible to all and might embarrass them into action....

Oliroy

eskbanker said:

Oliroy said:

eskbanker said:

Oliroy said:

Are there other options that I could consider? 

If they're a well-known artist active on social media then you might be able to shame them into action via these platforms, or at least threaten to do so?  You'd need to be fairly careful about exactly how you did so, and perhaps warn them first ("I've repeatedly been trying to contact you via private messages but may need to do so more publicly if you fail to answer again"), but as above your bank isn't responsible and neither is anyone else....

I have sent them numerous messages to their direct mobile number, but it appears they've blocked me, and also to their social media direct messages, but all of these are still showing as "unread", despite them being online numerous times.

I now understand now that my bank is not liable for this, and this was what I as unsure of, and also how best to proceed with this situation.

My point was that texts and private messages aren't publicly visible, whereas if you post on their Facebook page, for example, it'll be visible to all and might embarrass them into action....

It is an idea, however I’d need to proceed with some caution as it would also have a knock on effect to the record label and manager, who still sell remixes and re-issue tracks on vinyl and digital downloads of this artist. 

The manager is totally distraught for what has happened, and seems to be doing all he can to push things along. The only explanation he can give me is that this person is in a very bad place at the moment, is having a tough time of things of late, that they’re not into ripping people off, and that despite the three months since funds were sent they will eventually deliver. 

It’s just a pity that I had to involve the manager, as that could have been avoided if this person had sent me a message to explain their current situation, and to request some time. 

This lack of contact from them,  and also apparent blocking of contact from myself only gives rise to suspicion and why I had to report the matter to the bank, and I am now giving consideration to the other options mentioned in this thread.

born_again

Oliroy said:

It is an idea, however I’d need to proceed with some caution as it would also have a knock on effect to the record label and manager, who still sell remixes and re-issue tracks on vinyl and digital downloads of this artist. 

The manager is totally distraught for what has happened, and seems to be doing all he can to push things along. The only explanation he can give me is that this person is in a very bad place at the moment, is having a tough time of things of late, that they’re not into ripping people off, and that despite the three months since funds were sent they will eventually deliver. 

It’s just a pity that I had to involve the manager, as that could have been avoided if this person had sent me a message to explain their current situation, and to request some time. 

This lack of contact from them,  and also apparent blocking of contact from myself only gives rise to suspicion and why I had to report the matter to the bank, and I am now giving consideration to the other options mentioned in this thread.

If the items are still being advertised. Then forget about upsetting anyone. Sounds like you might not be the only one & the manager is just saying the right words.

Who owns the items? Individual or business?
Is this a ltd co, that might be listed on companies house?

Police would be worth a shout as well.

Not all banks signed up to app scams voluntary code

http://appcrmsteeringgroup.uk/wp-content/uploads/2019/05/CRM-code-LSB-final-280519.pdf


Exceptions P 12
(i) the payee was the person the Customer was expecting to pay;
(ii) the payment was for genuine goods or services; and/or
(iii) the person or business with whom they transacted was legitimate.  

Oliroy

The items still being advertised are not the exact ones that I agreed to purchase. Within the description of the items there was a footnote to contact them direct in regards to other items which would also become available for sale at a later time. To contact him first to avoid disappointment. The initial advert post caused quite a stir, and a fair amount of interest within the comments sections, with even other recording artists leaving positive comments, and thumbs up and heart emojis etc 

I asked them if items “XYZ” were also going to be available for sale? Yes they have those items and they'll be put to one side for me etc Money sent then all contact from myself blocked or ignored. 

The items are owned by this individual (but to be honest I now have doubts the items promised even actually exist) 

And a search on the Gov.uk website does not show the name given on the business bank account I sent funds to as being listed. 

When the initial report was made to my bank, details were also passed to Action Fraud, however I've heard nothing back from them. From what I understand they have so many cases that most do not get investigated. 

I had a look over the APP PDF, but it was pointed out earlier on in this thread that this is not an APP scam. 

I'm still confused as to if this is a civil matter and attempt to get my money back by taking this person to court, or a criminal matter? A previous poster advised this is not a scam, but a breach of contract. 

And six weeks on, I'm still waiting on my bank to confirm if any of the funds will be recoverable. Why is that taking so long? 

The manager keeps saying all will be ok, wait some more, he's doing all he can etc, but there comes a time when a person can no longer be expected to wait and action needs to be taken. The exact action is what I'm still confused with. 

soulsaver

CAB?.....
If something you ordered hasn't arrived - Citizens Advice

Oliroy

Thank you for the link. However I bought from an individual who received payment to his business bank account. It's like Brian May on FaceBook saying he's selling one of his guitars, that's a private sale,  but payment gets sent to his business bank account of "Brian May studios" etc

It seems that the link would not be applicable in this instance? 

Daliah

Oliroy said:

It seems that the link would not be applicable in this instance? 

Not sure why you say that, there is very useful information to be gleaned. In any case, the link leads you to Money Claim Online, which has already been suggested. Why are you not proceeding with that?

Oliroy

Apologies, there is some info given in the link which would help. I'll call the CAB helpline to see what they can advise.

Oliroy

Have spoken to CAB, and they said it is a slightly grey area as it's a private sale, with payment made to a business bank account. However both private sales or business sales are all covered under breach of contract terms. A letter to this person outlining the details of the sale and funds,  and giving them a reasonable time frame to respond is the first course of action. Whatever the indications are, it is not a confirmed scam until this person has had a chance to respond.

If there is no reply to the letter, then I need to contact CAB for details of the next stage.

Many thanks for the link.