How much was my house worth in 1991??

darich

Lincroft

I've tweaked the letter and it now reads as below

I am in receipt of a letter from the Appeals Panel stating that my appeal has been thrown out as invalid since it was made outwith the 6month time limit. This is disappointing since I have waited several months only to find that the inconsistency I pointed out, and indeed, proved, has not been corrected.
I am aware though, that I can appeal at any time if there is an error or mistake in the valuation roll. I refer you to the case of the Borders Council and the entire street in Galashiels being rebanded after fifteen years. I also know that many householders all over the UK have had their council tax banding adjusted after many years.

You have indicated that two properties were sold in my street in 1991 which places my property in Band E. One of them is identical to mine and sold for £60k and the other slightly smaller sold for £58k. This is not disputed. However, if these two properties are to be used as a guide, then I would be grateful if you could answer the following questions for me:

• Why were the seven properties I submitted as evidence all banded D while mine was banded E despite all properties being identical and within a 175m radius?
• Given that the seven properties I submitted as evidence are all banded D, what evidence was used to band them?
• Why was the evidence used to band the seven properties I submitted, not used to band my property?

I believe the above questions prove there to be an error in the valuation roll and that my property has been banded incorrectly.

I appreciate that my appeal was outwith the 6month time limit as you have pointed out but
I would also take this opportunity to point out once again that it is the assessor’s legal duty to maintain the accuracy and integrity of the valuation roll and correct any errors or mistakes regardless of any time limit. The evidence I have provided several times shows an inconsistency in the valuation roll. The only identical property sold in 1991 has been used to band my property but none of the others. Surely it must be applied to all identical properties in the locality? Assuming this is the case, either my property is correct and the seven I have submitted as evidence are incorrect, or the seven properties are all correct and my property incorrect.

I therefore formally request that my property be re-assessed as soon as possible by someone who does not know me. I know around five members of staff in the Assessor’s department and feel my appeal would be treated more impartially if it was handled by someone unknown to me.

Should i mention that I'll write to my councillor or MP if the outcome is not satisfactory?
Do you think it's ok to request someone else deal with my appeal or is that likely to get people's backs up and get me nowhere?

Look forward to your response....again!
thanks
David

vivatifosi

In addition to Lincroft's comments above, I would also highlight the fact that if the MP believes the government body is acting incorrectly, they have a right to take it to the Parliamentary Ombudsman, which we as individuals do not. I know that this would be the case in England, but am not sure that it is the same in Scotland, however there must be a similar system to ensure fairness.

Furthermore, you may find the following case from the Information Commissioner, which ruled on what information the VOA should be willing to give out, of relevance as it may help with specific wording of your issues:

http://www.ico.gov.uk/upload/documents/decisionnotices/2006/decision_notice_fs50090387.pdf

darich

vivatifosi wrote: »

In addition to Lincroft's comments above, I would also highlight the fact that if the MP believes the government body is acting incorrectly, they have a right to take it to the Parliamentary Ombudsman, which we as individuals do not. I know that this would be the case in England, but am not sure that it is the same in Scotland, however there must be a similar system to ensure fairness.

Furthermore, you may find the following case from the Information Commissioner, which ruled on what information the VOA should be willing to give out, of relevance as it may help with specific wording of your issues:

http://www.ico.gov.uk/upload/documents/decisionnotices/2006/decision_notice_fs50090387.pdf

vivatifosi

thanks for your input…..

Interesting to note that the VOA (and I’ll assume the Scottish assessor’s will be similar) don’t have to reveal prices. I do know though, that through my investigation there is only 1 house identical to mine that sold in 1991 – all the rest were a few years before or after, but at prices indicating a band D. That one sale indicates a band E.
I’ve not disputed that.
But as you can see from my letter I’m concerned that there is an inconsistency in the valuation roll.
How can that one sale be used to band my property but the others are banded D?
Where was the evidence for those band D houses?
Why wasn’t that evidence used for my house?
And I’ve measured the area using my office mapping system – every property referred to, can be circled on a map within a radius of 175m so they’re hardly too far away to take into account.

The link you sent, could indicate that the assessor is not obliged to release any prices pre2000 that would prove him to be right. It seems he can merely state “I am right”.
In a letter I received the assessor claims to be under no obligation to prove any particular banding. But to me, he can’t answer the questions in my (yet to be posted) letter without eliminating that discrepancy by making all the houses the same band either by dropping me to a D or pushing all the others to an E. But having spent several hours on the register of Scotland website I know all the prices of the identical bungalows in my area – even the one he’s using as evidence for my banding.

I am concerned that me knowing the divisional assessor could be working against me but I can’t make any accusation without proof.

I also find it quite interesting that in most of the correspondence I have, the assessor seems to be fighting me on the 6month rule rather than simply prove where he got his bandings from. That may be procedure but I’m also wondering if it means he knows that there is a mistake in the valuation roll but is reluctant to admit it (because he knows me) so is fighting me on the strength of the 6month rule.

I’d like to hear lincroft’s opinion on the letter as it stands before I think about sending it.

lincroft1710

darich wrote: »

Lincroft

I've tweaked the letter and it now reads as below

I am in receipt of a letter from the Appeals Panel stating that my appeal has been thrown out as invalid since it was made outwith the 6month time limit. This is disappointing since I have waited several months only to find that the inconsistency I pointed out, and indeed, proved, has not been corrected.
I am aware though, that I can appeal at any time if there is an error or mistake in the valuation roll.
that if the assessor believes there is an error or mistake in the valuation roll he has a duty to correct that error.

I refer you to the case of the Borders Council and the entire street in Galashiels being rebanded after fifteen years. I also know that many householders all over the UK have had their council tax banding adjusted after many years.

You have indicated that two properties were sold in my street in 1991 which places my property in Band E. One of them is identical to mine and sold for £60k and the other slightly smaller sold for £58k. This is not disputed. However, if these two properties are to be used as a guide, then I would be grateful if you could answer the following questions for me:

• Why were the seven properties I submitted as evidence all banded D while mine was banded E despite all properties being identical and within a 175m radius?
• Given that the seven properties I submitted as evidence are all banded D, what evidence was used to band them?
• Why was the evidence used to band the seven properties I submitted, not used to band my property?

I believe the above questions prove there to be an error in the valuation roll and that my property has been banded incorrectly.

I appreciate that my appeal was outwith the 6month time limit as you have pointed out but
I would also take this opportunity to point out once again that it is the assessor’s legal duty to maintain the accuracy and integrity of the valuation roll and correct any errors or mistakes regardless of any time limit. The evidence I have provided several times shows an inconsistency in the valuation roll. The only identical property sold in 1991 has been used to band my property but none of the others. Surely it must be applied to all identical properties in the locality? Assuming this is the case, either my property is correct and the seven I have submitted as evidence are incorrect, or the seven properties are all correct and my property incorrect.

I therefore formally request that my property be re-assessed as soon as possible by someone who does not know me. I know around five members of staff in the Assessor’s department and feel my appeal would be treated more impartially if it was handled by someone unknown to me.

If I do not receive a satisfactory reply to this letter I shall of course ask my MP to investigate on my behalf.

Should i mention that I'll write to my councillor or MP if the outcome is not satisfactory?
Do you think it's ok to request someone else deal with my appeal or is that likely to get people's backs up and get me nowhere?

Look forward to your response....again!
thanks
David

I've amended where I think necessary. Also "outside" may be better than "outwith". Good idea to ask for someone unknown to you to deal with the matter - they can't complain as you are making sure investigation is unbiased. The only downside is that the Ds are increased to E.

darich

Lincroft

I've made one minor change from your amended version - I've changed "MP" to "councillor".

I'll get it sent off in the next day or so and post an update here.
As for the downside - the other houses being banded E - it's only a downside because I'm not getting a refund! I don't know any of the property owners who are banded D.

Thanks again

David

lincroft1710

David - Councillors have no real clout and the ones I had dealings with didn't understand system even when it's explained to them and could easily be fobbed off. Don't waste your time - MPs get results and have resources. MP's letter gets first class attention, councillor's treated as normal letter from taxpayer.

darich

Lincroft

I had a chat with my gf last night who also agreed with you - MSP is the way to go.
I also changed the bit where there can be a change at any time if the assessor feels there is a mistake. I think that gives him a get out by claiming there is no mistake. So i reworded it as "I am aware though,an error or mistake in the valuation roll can be corrected at any time."
Obviously it would have to be agreed with the assessor so i thought that giving him an escape route wasn't ideal.

my gf suggested arranging a meeting with the MSP who has an office in a nearby town so I'll send my letter off and take it from there.

fingers crossed and thanks again.
David

lincroft1710

David

Good luck and like you I shall await outcome with interest. Like the idea of a meeting with MSP

darich

Lincroft.
Letter posted today first class....so i'll wait and see what happens.


I am in receipt of a letter from the Appeals Panel stating that my appeal has been thrown out as invalid since it was made outside the 6month time limit. This is disappointing since I have waited several months only to find that the inconsistency I pointed out, and indeed, proved, has not been corrected. I am aware though, an error or mistake in the valuation roll can be corrected at any time.
I refer you to the case of the Borders Council and the entire street in Galashiels being rebanded after fifteen years. I also know that many householders all over Scotland and the UK have had their council tax banding adjusted after many years.

You have indicated that two properties were sold in my street in 1991 which places my property in Band E. One of them is identical to mine and sold for £60k and the other slightly smaller sold for £58k. This is not disputed. However, if these two properties are to be used as a guide, then I would be grateful if you could answer the following questions for me:

• Why were the seven properties I submitted as evidence all banded D while mine was banded E despite all properties being identical and within a 175m radius?
• Given that the seven properties I submitted as evidence are all banded D, what evidence was used to band them?
• Why was the evidence used to band the seven properties I submitted, not used to band my property?

I believe the above questions prove there to be an error in the valuation roll and that my property has been banded incorrectly.

I appreciate that my appeal was outside the 6month time limit as you have indicated but
I would also take this opportunity to point out once again that it is the assessor’s legal duty to maintain the accuracy and integrity of the valuation roll and correct any errors or mistakes regardless of any time limit. The evidence I have provided several times shows an inconsistency in the valuation roll. The only identical property sold in 1991 has been used to band my property but none of the others. Surely it must be applied to all identical properties in the locality? Assuming this is the case, either my property is correct and the seven I have submitted as evidence are incorrect, or the seven properties are all correct and my property incorrect.

I therefore formally request that my property be re-assessed as soon as possible by someone who does not know me. I know approximately five members of staff in the Assessor’s department and feel my appeal would be treated more impartially if it was handled by someone unknown to me.

If I do not receive a satisfactory reply to this letter I shall of course ask my Councillor or MSP to investigate on my behalf.


I'll definitely post an update

thanks

darich

No updates yet...well not real updates anyway.

I received no response to my letter that i sent on 2nd October. I followed it up with another one reminding them I'd recevied no response on 14th November giving them 7days to reply.

Again, nothing.

So I've written to my msp detailing that there are 5 houses identical to mine within and all within 175m of each other. Those 5 are all D while me and one other is E. Clearly an anomoly that needs to be rectified.

That was sent about a week ago so I've now to wait for my msp to respond with the results of her questions to the assessor.

Updates will be posted here when i get them!!

many thanks for all the tips and advice!