Garage conversion - am I deluded??

Doozergirl

Jeepers, I've got no idea what you're talking about 😬

Habitable room? Or Annexe? 

Jeepers_Creepers

Doozergirl said:

Jeepers, I've got no idea what you're talking about 😬

Habitable room? Or Annexe? 

No idea!

I'm just saying that for MFd to spend any more money on this, over what is already a very nice spec that'll be toasty and comfy and highly useable, would, I think, be silly of them. Unnecessary, at least.

And should anyone in the future wish to make it their permanent, say, bedroom, then it'll lack for nothing detectable over a 'fully conforming' habitable space.

Ie, more than doubling the insulation thickness will make no perceptible difference, except to their immediate pocket and internal space.

How much more would it cost for MFd to go 'full BC spec' for a habitable building for this garage? If more than a few £k, then I personally wouldn't bother.

That's all I'm sayin' :-)

Doozergirl

You don't know what the building regs spec is (or planning) for a habitable room? How can you advise on whether they should be trying to meet it or not?   

Jeepers_Creepers

Doozergirl said:

You don't know what the building regs spec is (or planning) for a habitable room? How can you advise on whether they should be trying to meet it or not?   

Because, they don't need to meet it.

They don't want a 'habitable' room.

But they will still have one - in every sense. Whatever they need of that room after they have this work carried out, they will have. It'll be as comfy and cosy as any other room in their house. It will look and feel and act and behave and be like any other room in their house. Other than it having 'fully habitable' status. Which they neither want nor need.

Section62

MFdreamer said:

Just popping by with an update for those who were interested…..

Applied for pre-planning advice and the council confirmed in writing that I can convert the garage as planned with no planning permission required. They have advised I might need building control sign off but the builders who have quoted confirmed they will liaise directly with them regarding this.

Good news about the planning - but make sure what you are building is what you discussed with the planners. As Doozergirl has pointed out, project drift can change the requirements for planning and BC and put you on the wrong side of the law.

Also (the BiB) - be really careful about relying on builders to fulfill your legal responsibilities.  They have already upsold you on the project specifications, and quite likely because they know how to modify the project to increase their profit margin.  The are not going to tell you about complications which put their additional profit at risk, and some builders are quite willing to tell bare faced lies when it comes to legal requirements.

MFdreamer said:

I’ve told the builders to proceed with the plans for a toilet/sink only (no shower) as I think people are right and the shower just wouldn’t ever get used. The drainage is not going to be overly complex they said. They explained it to me but I can’t really remember what they said.

And following on from the previous point - if you aren't really sure what they are telling you then there is a much higher risk of you being 'led' into making changes to your home which are unlawful and/or dangerous.

There are professionals who can help you to avoid the traps that dodgy builders (and random folks on the internet) will happily let you walk into, knowing full well that is is you (and not them) who is 100% responsible to pick up the pieces at the end of the day.

Architects and building control officers are your friends in this type of situation.

Rosa_Damascena

OP - I would still consider the upgrade if you think there is a market for rent-a-room / Air BnB etc.

University fees are expensive (not that I advocate anything other than student loans for this purpose) and my personal view is that your kids will prefer a tidy deposit on their own homes over a den, if given the option.

Section62

Jeepers_Creepers said:

Oh, and make sure the spec includes a smoke alarm or S62 will be on my case again. :-)

Sure, if someone was determined to ignore the requirements of building regs and/or skimp on the build now because they don't see the point of future-proofing what they are spending a lot of money on, then I'd definitely prioritise smoke alarm(s) (preferably linked to those in the main property) over something relatively minor like making sure a door and or window has a trickle vent.

Safety first.

Doozergirl

Jeepers_Creepers said:

Doozergirl said:

You don't know what the building regs spec is (or planning) for a habitable room? How can you advise on whether they should be trying to meet it or not?   

Because, they don't need to meet it.

They don't want a 'habitable' room.

But they will still have one - in every sense. Whatever they need of that room after they have this work carried out, they will have. It'll be as comfy and cosy as any other room in their house. It will look and feel and act and behave and be like any other room in their house. Other than it having 'fully habitable' status. Which they neither want nor need.

There is no 'fully habitable' status.  You are out of your depth here.  You had no idea from the beginning where building control or planning planning permission step in, nor what the standards are or how to meet them. 

If a room isn't habitable, it is uninhabitable.  The qualification for habitable as far as building regs go is a room that people sit in for a period of time.   That is exactly what the OP wants.  

Building control is a minimum standard and you don't know what that is, so why advocate not meeting it?  Especially if you don't know what it entails? 

Building regulations for a garage conversion will be a good standard of insulation to floor, walls and ceiling, to meet a particular uValue for each, bearing in mind that when you pay a builder, the major cost is the labour, which is likely to be the same regardless of depth of insulation.    It is also proven that insulation is the most effective way of keeping heating bills down and it has a quick pay back time.  

Bearing in mind the huge proportion of surface area to volume of a garage, it has the propensity to be absolutely bl**dy freezing in there.  

The doors should have trickle vents for ventilation and the glass be toughened so that people don't fall through glass and incur significant injury.  They should have a decent lintel over them so that the roof doesn't collapse.  

The floor should have a damp proof membrane.  

The electrics should be certified by a qualified electrician.  

Which bit of this do you fundamentally disagree with?  

Jeepers_Creepers

Ok, Doozer. Fair do's.

What I was advocating - what I would have done for myself - is a compromise.

Sounds as tho' MFd is going to get BCO oversight of this conversion, and a reasonable quote for the work - so that's the best of all worlds.

Section62

Jeepers_Creepers said:

What I was advocating - what I would have done for myself - is a compromise.

The thing is it isn't a necessary compromise, and also isn't a sensible one.

The cost difference between making the shell of the building compromised, or making it habitable with BC approval, is not that great.

If the budget is stretched then compromise on the fit out by all means - delete the shower/toilet or Peruvian marble floors - they can be added at a later date if you still want them.

But upgrading the shell of the building to habitable standards with BC approval (at a later date) inevitably involves ripping out parts of the expensive work you've done already and doing it to the standards that apply at that point in time.

So it makes more sense to get the shell right now - even if it means waiting for that Peruvian marble, or whatever luxury your tastes desire.

It is a mistake often made by DIYers and/or people employing a budget builder. Their focus is usually on the fit out and finish because they don't understand the regs and the importance of them.

It is summed up by viewing BR as 'hassle'.  BR is about making buildings fit for purpose, keeping people safe and healthy, and saving energy.  Anyone who views that as 'hassle' hasn't really understood the subject.