John Lewis

newbussinessowner

Hi.
 I purchased and iPad Pro 12.9” for £1319 and it arrived on 23/04/2019 from John Lewis online and came with a 2 year warranty as opposed to Apples 1 year warranty.

In the last several months their has been charging problems, regrettably I plodded along as best I could as John Lewis stores were closed and Covid measures were in place.  It got to the point last week that the problems were so bad that it was not possible to keep using the iPad.   I rang John Lewis on the Saturday 7th July 2021 and explained the problem.  They advised as it was 2 months out of their warranty to take to an Apple store for repair, which I did on the Sunday.   Apple thoroughly examined the iPad and declared that it was not repairable.  They said about a 6 year consumer rights law that if I had purchased with them, they would have exchanged it, unfortunately I purchased through John Lewis and that I need to go down this route with them.  

I went across to John Lewis Exeter sat in a “tech room “ with a chap and explained everything.  He said as it was out of warranty it was not their problem.  I then told him about the 6 year consumer rights thing and he basically said Apple were lying.  I googled it in front of him and he just told me to ring John Lewis customer service which I did .  

Again I explained everything and they said they would get it picked up and inspected.

Today I received a call saying the unit was not repairable and they wanted over £600 to replace it.  They said that my iPad was not damaged by me in the report.

I rang John Lewis customer service again and said about the 6 year protection and they said only if I had contacted them in the previous 2 years that there was a fault.  As I didn’t it is not covered.  I said I would seek advice from the ombudsman and their reply was you can try but they will agree with us.
 Not sure what to do next 

JJ_Egan

Bought for business use ?? If so Consumer Laws do not apply .

Six year CR is  not as you describe . Its 6 years to take out court proceedings

the_lunatic_is_in_my_head

So if JL have advised you the unit was not customer damaged they should be offering a remedy under the Consumer Rights Act as the goods haven't conformed to the contract in terms of durability. 

Arguing with customer service is a waste of time so it's best to send JL a letter before action with a brief explanation and a copy of the information demonstrating the goods aren't repairable and aren't customer damaged. 

You should request an amount that reflects 2 years 2 months of ownership vs the unit's expected life. Some may suggest "second hand value" but personally I don't agree with this. if it was taken the unit would last 6 years £843 would be a figure to look at.

Your other option is to haggle with them for the cost of the replacement, as above based on 6 years a fair price for a brand new replacement would be around £440-£480, they'll likely offer refurbished which should be good as new but perhaps worth looking to pay £400-£440. 

If you want to haggle have a Google of CEO email and search that site for John Lewis to get an email for a higher level of customer facing staff. 

powerful_Rogue

newbussinessowner said:

Hi.
 I purchased and iPad Pro 12.9” for £1319 and it arrived on 23/04/2019 from John Lewis online and came with a 2 year warranty as opposed to Apples 1 year warranty.

In the last several months their has been charging problems, regrettably I plodded along as best I could as John Lewis stores were closed and Covid measures were in place.  It got to the point last week that the problems were so bad that it was not possible to keep using the iPad.   I rang John Lewis on the Saturday 7th July 2021 and explained the problem.  They advised as it was 2 months out of their warranty to take to an Apple store for repair, which I did on the Sunday.   Apple thoroughly examined the iPad and declared that it was not repairable.  They said about a 6 year consumer rights law that if I had purchased with them, they would have exchanged it, unfortunately I purchased through John Lewis and that I need to go down this route with them.  

I went across to John Lewis Exeter sat in a “tech room “ with a chap and explained everything.  He said as it was out of warranty it was not their problem.  I then told him about the 6 year consumer rights thing and he basically said Apple were lying.  I googled it in front of him and he just told me to ring John Lewis customer service which I did .  

Again I explained everything and they said they would get it picked up and inspected.

Today I received a call saying the unit was not repairable and they wanted over £600 to replace it.  They said that my iPad was not damaged by me in the report.

I rang John Lewis customer service again and said about the 6 year protection and they said only if I had contacted them in the previous 2 years that there was a fault.  As I didn’t it is not covered.  I said I would seek advice from the ombudsman and their reply was you can try but they will agree with us.
 Not sure what to do next 

Don't believe the bit in bold. If you had purchased from Apple, they would not have replaced it for you. Many threads on here where people have bought direct from Apple and they still try to charge them.

MalMonroe

You DO have rights, under the Consumer Rights Act 2015. My advice would be to contact Citizens Advice to discuss what you can do next. An expensive iPad pro should last longer than yours has. Goods have to be 'fit for purpose' and 'of satisfactory quality' which yours are not. 

Link to Govt info about the Consumer Rights Act 2015.  https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2015/15/contents/enacted

Link to Citizens Advice - https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/resources-and-tools/search-navigation-tools/Search/?q=consumer+rights+act+2015&c=TOP-PUBLIC

When speaking to Citizens Advice, ask them about appealing to the Financial Ombudsman. Do not take heed of what John Lewis has told you because I have, in the past, contacted the Financial Ombudsman and have successfully challenged what I've been told by companies who have tried to keep my money when their goods were faulty.

The only problem with the Financial Ombudsman is that they are very busy right now but they DO get round to everyone eventually. If you have to wait, then you have to wait but in a case such as this, where I do believe you are in the right, it's worth waiting. Don't take JL's word that the Ombudsman will agree with them! They don't know that. 

If you used your credit card, do read the info in this link - you could use Section 75 to get your money back. 

https://www.which.co.uk/consumer-rights/regulation/section-75-of-the-consumer-credit-act-aZCUb9i8Kwfa

Good luck - and don't give up until you've had a really good try to get things put right!  £1319 is a lot of money to lose.

MalMonroe

JJ_Egan said:

Bought for business use ?? If so Consumer Laws do not apply .

Six year CR is  not as you describe . Its 6 years to take out court proceedings

That's just not helpful at all. 

The OP has to try to recoup money when goods are not fit for purpose - for whatever use - and really doesn't need harbingers of doom right now. 

powerful_Rogue

MalMonroe said:

You DO have rights, under the Consumer Rights Act 2015. My advice would be to contact Citizens Advice to discuss what you can do next. An expensive iPad pro should last longer than yours has. Goods have to be 'fit for purpose' and 'of satisfactory quality' which yours are not. 

Link to Govt info about the Consumer Rights Act 2015.  https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2015/15/contents/enacted

Link to Citizens Advice - https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/resources-and-tools/search-navigation-tools/Search/?q=consumer+rights+act+2015&c=TOP-PUBLIC

When speaking to Citizens Advice, ask them about appealing to the Financial Ombudsman. Do not take heed of what John Lewis has told you because I have, in the past, contacted the Financial Ombudsman and have successfully challenged what I've been told by companies who have tried to keep my money when their goods were faulty.

The only problem with the Financial Ombudsman is that they are very busy right now but they DO get round to everyone eventually. If you have to wait, then you have to wait but in a case such as this, where I do believe you are in the right, it's worth waiting. Don't take JL's word that the Ombudsman will agree with them! They don't know that. 

If you used your credit card, do read the info in this link - you could use Section 75 to get your money back. 

https://www.which.co.uk/consumer-rights/regulation/section-75-of-the-consumer-credit-act-aZCUb9i8Kwfa

Good luck - and don't give up until you've had a really good try to get things put right!  £1319 is a lot of money to lose.

How's the Financial Ombudsman going to help?

Sandtree

newbussinessowner said:

Hi.
 I purchased and iPad Pro 12.9” for £1319 and it arrived on 23/04/2019 from John Lewis online and came with a 2 year warranty as opposed to Apples 1 year warranty.

In the last several months their has been charging problems, regrettably I plodded along as best I could as John Lewis stores were closed and Covid measures were in place.  It got to the point last week that the problems were so bad that it was not possible to keep using the iPad.   I rang John Lewis on the Saturday 7th July 2021 and explained the problem.  They advised as it was 2 months out of their warranty to take to an Apple store for repair, which I did on the Sunday.   Apple thoroughly examined the iPad and declared that it was not repairable.  They said about a 6 year consumer rights law that if I had purchased with them, they would have exchanged it, unfortunately I purchased through John Lewis and that I need to go down this route with them.  

I went across to John Lewis Exeter sat in a “tech room “ with a chap and explained everything.  He said as it was out of warranty it was not their problem.  I then told him about the 6 year consumer rights thing and he basically said Apple were lying.  I googled it in front of him and he just told me to ring John Lewis customer service which I did .  

Again I explained everything and they said they would get it picked up and inspected.

Today I received a call saying the unit was not repairable and they wanted over £600 to replace it.  They said that my iPad was not damaged by me in the report.

I rang John Lewis customer service again and said about the 6 year protection and they said only if I had contacted them in the previous 2 years that there was a fault.  As I didn’t it is not covered.  I said I would seek advice from the ombudsman and their reply was you can try but they will agree with us.
 Not sure what to do next 

The retailer has the options of repair, replace or refund, however if they decide to refund they are entitled to reduce the refund to reflect the use you have already had from the item. The law doesnt describe how this should be calculated but from personal experience with white goods John Lewis did a straight forward coundown of value.

You can reject paying towards a replacement as that isnt a statutory resolution but dont expect a full refund instead.

mattyprice4004

MalMonroe said:

JJ_Egan said:

Bought for business use ?? If so Consumer Laws do not apply .

Six year CR is  not as you describe . Its 6 years to take out court proceedings

That's just not helpful at all. 

The OP has to try to recoup money when goods are not fit for purpose - for whatever use - and really doesn't need harbingers of doom right now. 

It is helpful because it's correct - the legislation governing business to business sales does have quite a few differences. 
In a perfect world you'd be right, but if it's a business purchase then your rights simply aren't the same.  

Sandtree

mattyprice4004 said:
but if it's a business purchase then your rights simply aren't the same.  

I'll be the first to admit that I scan read and therefore do occasionally miss points but other than the OP's chosen username what is there to imply the purchase was a business one?

born_again

powerful_Rogue said:

MalMonroe said:

You DO have rights, under the Consumer Rights Act 2015. My advice would be to contact Citizens Advice to discuss what you can do next. An expensive iPad pro should last longer than yours has. Goods have to be 'fit for purpose' and 'of satisfactory quality' which yours are not. 

Link to Govt info about the Consumer Rights Act 2015.  https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2015/15/contents/enacted

Link to Citizens Advice - https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/resources-and-tools/search-navigation-tools/Search/?q=consumer+rights+act+2015&c=TOP-PUBLIC

When speaking to Citizens Advice, ask them about appealing to the Financial Ombudsman. Do not take heed of what John Lewis has told you because I have, in the past, contacted the Financial Ombudsman and have successfully challenged what I've been told by companies who have tried to keep my money when their goods were faulty.

The only problem with the Financial Ombudsman is that they are very busy right now but they DO get round to everyone eventually. If you have to wait, then you have to wait but in a case such as this, where I do believe you are in the right, it's worth waiting. Don't take JL's word that the Ombudsman will agree with them! They don't know that. 

If you used your credit card, do read the info in this link - you could use Section 75 to get your money back. 

https://www.which.co.uk/consumer-rights/regulation/section-75-of-the-consumer-credit-act-aZCUb9i8Kwfa

Good luck - and don't give up until you've had a really good try to get things put right!  £1319 is a lot of money to lose.

How's the Financial Ombudsman going to help?

Strange as this is the 2nd person that has mentioned FOS in relation to consumer rights... 
New one all round as the ymake no mention of them covering it on their pages.