Why is air con not covered by service or warranty in this day and age.

Petriix

mobileron said:

And you get to your destination all sweaty and frustrated, what you doing with the money you save?

That's some wonky logic. Not leaving it permanently on doesn't mean never using it. I'll turn the aircon on whenever the car starts to get uncomfortably hot, where passive cooling methods don't work. I'll also use it where necessary to clear the windscreen and othewise ensure I run it for a few minutes every few days. That's a big difference in comparison to leaving it permanently on.

motorguy said:

Petriix said:

AdrianC said:

If aircon is not used frequently, then the seals dry and allow the refrigerant gas to escape. This is not a manufacturing fault, so is not a warranty claim.

There is no reason to turn it off. Leave it on.

The reason to turn it off is all the extra power it uses. It can reduce my range by 10 miles (or ultimately increase my charging costs by 5%) if I just leave it on permanently.

Then you need to decide if that saving is worth the potential to have to spend £££s down the line to get your aircon working if it fails.

I'm not certain that running the aircon permanently is better for it than using it with discretion. I'm fairly sure my entire HVAC system is covered for a portion of the 7 year warranty; eith 2 or 3 years off the top of my head. It might be longer because it's integral to the battery cooling.

In any case, the savings are part of the overall low cost of running an EV which is what enabled me to buy one in the first place.

AdrianC

Petriix said:

mobileron said:

And you get to your destination all sweaty and frustrated, what you doing with the money you save?

That's some wonky logic. Not leaving it permanently on doesn't mean never using it. I'll turn the aircon on whenever the car starts to get uncomfortably hot, where passive cooling methods don't work. I'll also use it where necessary to clear the windscreen and othewise ensure I run it for a few minutes every few days. That's a big difference in comparison to leaving it permanently on.

You do realise that's how climate control works anyway? It kicks it in and out as necessary to maintain your set temperature.

I'm fairly sure my entire HVAC system is covered for a portion of the 7 year warranty; eith 2 or 3 years off the top of my head.

For manufacturing defects, yes. That's what warranties cover. Not from failures arising from user error. They don't cover that. EVER. For anything.
Hit a kerb, the tyre isn't covered.

I was talking to somebody the other day who has an ID3. They were recently doing their first long journey in it... and to maximise range, turned the HVAC off "because they didn't need it". They said they "finally relented" when they realised their kid's glasses had steamed up. Price of everything, value of nothing.

Petriix

AdrianC said:

Petriix said:

mobileron said:

And you get to your destination all sweaty and frustrated, what you doing with the money you save?

That's some wonky logic. Not leaving it permanently on doesn't mean never using it. I'll turn the aircon on whenever the car starts to get uncomfortably hot, where passive cooling methods don't work. I'll also use it where necessary to clear the windscreen and othewise ensure I run it for a few minutes every few days. That's a big difference in comparison to leaving it permanently on.

You do realise that's how climate control works anyway? It kicks it in and out as necessary to maintain your set temperature.

I'm fairly sure my entire HVAC system is covered for a portion of the 7 year warranty; eith 2 or 3 years off the top of my head.

For manufacturing defects, yes. That's what warranties cover. Not from failures arising from user error. They don't cover that. EVER. For anything.
Hit a kerb, the tyre isn't covered.

I was talking to somebody the other day who has an ID3. They were recently doing their first long journey in it... and to maximise range, turned the HVAC off "because they didn't need it". They said they "finally relented" when they realised their kid's glasses had steamed up. Price of everything, value of nothing.

If the systems were designed intelligently then I'd be fine leaving it on auto. But I have a tolerance of +/- a few degrees and don't feel the need to dry out the air. Much of the time, the outside air is perfectly good without any heating or cooling (let alone both at the same time).

If I turn it on to auto at 18 degrees, it will initially use lots of energy to make it exactly 18 degrees. I'm happy at anything between 17 and 22 degrees so it really is a waste of energy. The car shows exactly how much energy is being consumed at any point so it's abundantly clear. The estimated range goes down significantly as soon as you turn it on (not that it's accurate).

What it needs is a setting to avoid the extremes rather than keep to a target temperature. Anything between the minimum and maximum without steaming up while using the least amount of energy. Because this setting doesn't exist, I have to micro-manage it. In practice this means mostly leaving it as passive airflow and occasionally putting the heating or aircon on.

AdrianC

Petriix said:

If the systems were designed intelligently then I'd be fine leaving it on auto. But I have a tolerance of +/- a few degrees and don't feel the need to dry out the air. Much of the time, the outside air is perfectly good without any heating or cooling (let alone both at the same time).

If I turn it on to auto at 18 degrees, it will initially use lots of energy to make it exactly 18 degrees. I'm happy at anything between 17 and 22 degrees so it really is a waste of energy.

So set it to 20 or 21 or 22 when it's warm out. 17 or 18 or 19 when it's cool out.

What it needs is a setting to avoid the extremes rather than keep to a target temperature.

Every single climate I've ever used works far harder when the temp inside the car is far from the set temp. As they get closer, it works less hard. They take temperature and humidity into account.

Of course, it's entirely possible some manufacturers still haven't got that right after three decades of climate control systems being mainstream...

BOWFER

Can't believe there are still people out there, in 2021, that actively switch their aircon on and off.
Bad enough when it's simple 'on demand' aircon, ludicrous when it's climate control.
Some manufacturers have thought of these people now and the default is 'on'.
Renault, for example, the default is ON and you have to request the aircon goes OFF via a button.
I can't think of a single reason why it would ever be switched off, but there you go....at least the default is on.

ANYWAY - we had an argument with Kia about the faulty aircon in our Sportage.
They charged us for a regas, within weeks it was the same again.
They said they'd pressure tested for leaks etc, but it must have been a poor test.
The car went back to the lease company with non-cold air.

fred246

I turn it off sometimes when I need loads of power 

neilmcl

AdrianC said:

Petriix said:

If the systems were designed intelligently then I'd be fine leaving it on auto. But I have a tolerance of +/- a few degrees and don't feel the need to dry out the air. Much of the time, the outside air is perfectly good without any heating or cooling (let alone both at the same time).

If I turn it on to auto at 18 degrees, it will initially use lots of energy to make it exactly 18 degrees. I'm happy at anything between 17 and 22 degrees so it really is a waste of energy.

So set it to 20 or 21 or 22 when it's warm out. 17 or 18 or 19 when it's cool out.

What it needs is a setting to avoid the extremes rather than keep to a target temperature.

Every single climate I've ever used works far harder when the temp inside the car is far from the set temp. As they get closer, it works less hard. They take temperature and humidity into account.

Of course, it's entirely possible some manufacturers still haven't got that right after three decades of climate control systems being mainstream...

I don't think I've ever felt the need to have my climate control set to 18C, far too cool. Mine's always set at 20 and permanently on and has a negligible affect on fuel economy, if any.

coffeehound

I had to micro-manage the a/c on my last car.  Even though it was a 2-litre, so you'd think wouldn't be affected, the engine management appeared to alter the mapping when a/c was selecton on, giving odd engine behaviour.  It definitely drove better around town with a/c off.

BOWFER

neilmcl said:

I don't think I've ever felt the need to have my climate control set to 18C, far too cool. Mine's always set at 20 and permanently on and has a negligible affect on fuel economy, if any.

This is how any climate control should work, set it to a comfy temp and leave it.
Every car I've come across with climate then has a 'boost' button to either rapidly cool or heat the car to that temp, or to rapidly demist.
So set once, then press boost button if required - that's it - FOREVER

motorguy

BOWFER said:

neilmcl said:

I don't think I've ever felt the need to have my climate control set to 18C, far too cool. Mine's always set at 20 and permanently on and has a negligible affect on fuel economy, if any.

This is how any climate control should work, set it to a comfy temp and leave it.
Every car I've come across with climate then has a 'boost' button to either rapidly cool or heat the car to that temp, or to rapidly demist.
So set once, then press boost button if required - that's it - FOREVER

Yup.  I just keep it at a set temperature.  On constantly.  I let the air con sort it all out and balance out the temperature.

If you need to eke out that last percentage of economy you're probably driving the wrong car in the first place.