Octopus Tracker

[Deleted User]

peter3hg said:

savers_united said:

It also states that the cap is normally adjusted the same time as the Ofgem cap but can be changed at anytime and on more than 1 occasion. Its not designed to make tracker the cheapest tariff but to protect customers from extreme price swings. 

They haven't previously changed the caps of any of the versions of the Tracker tariff so not sure what you/they mean by "normally" here.
What they have done is release a new version but left current customers on the old version until the term expires.
I'm not convinced that situation will change in October but we will see.

I also don't understand Octopus' response. Tracker Gas is not linked to any Cap set by Ofgem: it follows the market. If wholesale prices fall, then so will the cost of Tracker. The 'things' in Octopus' control are the Cap that it chooses to impose on the maximum price/kWh; the duration of each tariff version (currently 12 months)  AND most importantly the formula that Octopus uses to convert the wholesale gas price to a retail unit price.

If Octopus is now saying that it carries out an internal review to set the internally-imposed Cap on 1 April/October then that is within their gift, as is a change to the underpinning conversion formula.

" The formula for these updates is fixed, and we'll let you know of any changes with reasonable notice. Today's wholesale price. p = (W * 1.06) + 1.30." (Source: Octopus)

savers_united

[Deleted User] said:

peter3hg said:

savers_united said:

It also states that the cap is normally adjusted the same time as the Ofgem cap but can be changed at anytime and on more than 1 occasion. Its not designed to make tracker the cheapest tariff but to protect customers from extreme price swings. 

They haven't previously changed the caps of any of the versions of the Tracker tariff so not sure what you/they mean by "normally" here.
What they have done is release a new version but left current customers on the old version until the term expires.
I'm not convinced that situation will change in October but we will see.

I also don't understand Octopus' response. Tracker Gas is not linked to any Cap set by Ofgem: it follows the market. If wholesale prices fall, then so will the cost of Tracker. The 'things' in Octopus' control are the Cap that it chooses to impose on the maximum price/kWh; the duration of each tariff version (currently 12 months)  AND most importantly the formula that Octopus uses to convert the wholesale gas price to a retail unit price.

If Octopus is now saying that it carries out an internal review to set the internally-imposed Cap on 1 April/October then that is within their gift, as is a change to the underpinning conversion formula.

" The formula for these updates is fixed, and we'll let you know of any changes with reasonable notice. Today's wholesale price. p = (W * 1.06) + 1.30." (Source: Octopus)

I have re read the email they sent me yesterday, the only purpose of the cap that octopus have introduced themselves is to protect those on tracker from shock pricing due to the current volatile market. Tracker is not a fixed price tariff, its variable but unlike SVT the rates can change daily.

The reason I believe they adjust the tracker cap at the same time as the Ofgem cap is to ensure that tracker does not become the default tariff. If they kept it at 11p after October then Martin Lewis would be telling everyone to switch to tracker as it would be cheaper than the SVT and you could get days where the rate is less than 11p. So it makes sense to just keep the cap above the SVT rate, those who really believe In tracker have protection against a really high daily rate but can also benefit when prices fall.

As you can switch tariffs with Octopus at anytime your not stuck on the tracker if it does not work out for you, the only reason I can see for the 12mth term is that Octopus themselves have to honour the tariff to existing customers even if they were to stop selling tracker to new customers. As its not fixed and the caps don't form part of any contract Octopus can change them whenever they feel they need to, although they have stated that customers will be given notice of any changes to the tariff.

I don't even think a v4 will be launched this time unless the standing charge changes, if it does not they will likely just adjust the caps in line with the new Ofgem rate. It seems the new version is only there to reflect a different standing charge. 

SJMALBA

savers_united said:

SNIP
I don't even think a v4 will be launched this time unless the standing charge changes, if it does not they will likely just adjust the caps in line with the new Ofgem rate. It seems the new version is only there to reflect a different standing charge. 

That's incorrect:

MWT said:

SJMALBA said:

AFAIK, the change from Tracker v1 to v2 was the increased cap of 40p/11p; v2 was only available for a few weeks before they introduced v3, which had the increased SCs.

This is correct.

So far, no existing version has had either the cap or the standing charge changed.

V1 is the only one that was changed, when the cap was first introduced.

SC changes are part of the T&Cs, subject to at least 30 days' notice.

savers_united

SJMALBA said:

savers_united said:

SNIP
I don't even think a v4 will be launched this time unless the standing charge changes, if it does not they will likely just adjust the caps in line with the new Ofgem rate. It seems the new version is only there to reflect a different standing charge. 

That's incorrect:

What are the differences between v2 & v3? All I can se at present is the SC, both have the same formula and price cap.

What would be the purpose of a v4 if everything remained the same as v3 in terms of SC, and any cap changes was applied to all versions. 

MWT

savers_united said:

What are the differences between v2 & v3? All I can se at present is the SC, both have the same formula and price cap.

What would be the purpose of a v4 if everything remained the same as v3 in terms of SC, and any cap changes was applied to all versions. 

You are assuming something that they have not so far chosen to do...

v4 with a new cap and SC would be consistent with their previous behaviour where any change to the cap or the SC has been through a new version. (v2 introduced a new cap, v3 a new SC).

SJMALBA

savers_united said:

SJMALBA said:

savers_united said:

SNIP
I don't even think a v4 will be launched this time unless the standing charge changes, if it does not they will likely just adjust the caps in line with the new Ofgem rate. It seems the new version is only there to reflect a different standing charge. 

That's incorrect:

What are the differences between v2 & v3? All I can se at present is the SC, both have the same formula and price cap.

What would be the purpose of a v4 if everything remained the same as v3 in terms of SC, and any cap changes was applied to all versions. 

My point is that each new version was introduced to change something: v1 to v2 was an increase in cap; v2 to v3 (just a few weeks after v2 was introduced) was an increase in SC, this despite the fact that they can change the SC for existing versions, subject to at least 30 days' notice.

The cap has no qualification of any kind, it merely states that there is one, and what it currently is; no guarantee that it will continue to be applied, or at what level, not even that there is any notice requirement for changing it, AFAIK.

The key question is whether Octopus will follow past practice i.e. introduce a new version if they wish to change SC, cap or both, or whether they will change the SC for existing versions, as they are entitled to do as per the T&Cs, or change the cap, which they are also entitled to do, as there are no T&Cs attached to it.

movingon

Hi, I have just joined tracker. At the risk of appearing totally thick, what does, "today's costs" mean? I keep looking at this and the amounts are different every day. How do they work this out in the absence of meter readings every day?

 When I  click "launch tracker"  nothing happens (I don't have a smart meter. 

YOUR TARIFF

Octopus Tracker

Octopus Tracker v3

Electricity

39.99p/kWh 48.26p/day

(All rates inc. VAT)

Gas

YOUR TARIFF

Octopus Tracker

Octopus Tracker v3

7.79p/kWh 27.22p/day

(All rates inc. VAT)

Today's Octopus Tracker costs

Electricity

£2.40

Gas

£0.69

Alnat1

It appears like that for me too and has done since I moved to Tracker on 17th June.

The daily prices are correct and mine show exactly the same as yours (Yorkshire region for me)

Those daily costs, I have no clue where they come from and that is not what you will be charged today. I do have smart meters and the launch button just shows a demo.

SJMALBA

The daily cost just seems to be based upon a guesstimate by Octopus as to the energy you will use that day.

As @Alnat1 says, 'launch tracker' doesn't work.

movingon

Alnat1 said:

It appears like that for me too and has done since I moved to Tracker on 17th June.

The daily prices are correct and mine show exactly the same as yours (Yorkshire region for me)

Those daily costs, I have no clue where they come from and that is not what you will be charged today. I do have smart meters and the launch button just shows a demo.

Ok, Thank you. Glad its not just me. I thought my brain was frying in the Yorkshire heat!