Octopus Tracker

bristolleedsfan

MSE forum member who changed from tracker tariff to 12 month fixed rate due to tracker winter kwh prices going so high messaged me earlier asking what my opinion  was about staying on fixed rate or changing back to tracker

His fixed rate is 15.82  Kwh ( Octopus Direct 12 Month January)

My reply  i have  been getting weekly statements, waiting for latest these were my average weekly rates on tracker plus 5%  vat

                                 7 days up until 12th April - Average kwh rate 14.74 Kwh plus Vat

                                 7 days up until 19th April- Average kwh rate 16.73 Kwh plus Vat

                                 7 days up until 26th  April- Average kwh rate  14.94 Kwh plus Vat

I make average of the 3 weeks i listed above 16.24 including vat  which is more than your fixed rate

It should be noted that average kwh rate that Octopus quote on statements is EXCLUSIVE of VAT

Looking at above figures from  PHoppers -   1 -15th April quoting figure of 13.65

https://energy.guylipman.com/sm/electracker  The above figures dont state which region, I therefiore looked for cheapest region which appears to be M  to best of me glancing those figures are inclusive of Vat,  1 -15th April produces average kwh rate including   VAT 16.4

14.312. 14.406,14.374,13.944,11.014,13.892.15.099,14.847, 15.311, 15.088, 14.983, 16.296,20.318, 19.887,16.034

I also changed to tracker April 2020 these were cheapest 12 Month fixed rate Octopus were offering at the time based on my region

Electricity Unit rate: 13.63 p/kWh  Standing charge: 20.64 p/day  Gas Unit rate: 2.28 p/kWh   Standing charge: 17.85 p/day

[Deleted User]

I hate to restate the obvious but for electricity it is easy to beat those average Tracker prices by switching to Go or Go Faster. The maximum that I pay is 14.62p/kWh with 28 hours a week at 5p/kWh. Looking back nearly 2 years, an average unit price of 10p/kWh was easy to achieve with just a little demand shifting; eg, using the dishwasher and washing machine delay timers.

bristolleedsfan

PHoppers said:

Hi
I've been on Tracker v1 for Electricity since 4 April 2020. 
My unit rate has been as low as 9.90p per kwh incl vat (May 20) and as high as 19.17p per kwh incl vat (first 2 weeks in Jan .

https://energy.guylipman.com/sm/electracker

Everybody can see on above link on 13 April 2021 all regions were over 20pkwh rate and everybody can see again from above link that kwh rate hit 31p/33pkwh  depending on region 13 January 2021

Guy Lipman has said on his facebook page/ a facebook group ignore tracker projections that Octopus give being as people use more fuel during winter months when tracker rates are likely to be highest

PHoppers

I was quoting the prices (incl vat) that appear on my invoices which will be averaged out price over the period of the invoice ie 1st - 15th April 2021 13.65. 
For purposes of the info I was passing on to the OP (merely to give an idea of what my prices have been on my invoices) the fact that on one day it was over 20p is immaterial, 13.65 was my average price over the 15 days that appeared on my invoice. 19.17 was the most expensive price that appeared on all my invoices. Yorkshire region BTW. Ultimately the most useful figure for the OP would be an average price for an entire year to compare against the usual 12month fixed tariff.

bristolleedsfan

PHoppers said:

I was quoting the prices (incl vat) that appear on my invoices which will be averaged out price over the period of the invoice ie 1st - 15th April 2021 13.65 for the info I was passing on to the OP to give an idea of what prices have been the fact that on one day it was over 20p is immaterial, 13.65 was my average price over the 15 days. 19.17 was the most expensive price that appeared on all my invoices. Yorkshire region BTW

With exception of Estimated annual cost, VAT total and Total Bill including VAT, all prices/rates/average unit rates that Octopus quote on PDF statements/invoices are "EXCLUSIVE" of VAT

These are 15 days 1-15th April cheapest region that I could see on Guy Lipmans tables, everybody can see just by looking isnt possible to end up with average of 13.65

14.312

14.406,

14.374,

13.944,

11.014,

13.892.

15.099,

14.847,

15.311,

15.088,

14.983,

16.296,

20.318,

19.887,

16.034

https://energy.guylipman.com/sm/electracker

PHoppers

[Deleted User] said:

I hate to restate the obvious but for electricity it is easy to beat those average Tracker prices by switching to Go or Go Faster. The maximum that I pay is 14.62p/kWh with 28 hours a week at 5p/kWh. Looking back nearly 2 years, an average unit price of 10p/kWh was easy to achieve with just a little demand shifting; eg, using the dishwasher and washing machine delay timers.

Don't rub it in, I signed up for Agile Octopus / Octopus Go in December 2019, unfortunately my new smart meter can't communicate so I've been in limbo on Tracker v1 for over a year, hoping for a solution.

PHoppers

Bristolleedsfan all the prices I've quoted are with vat added on. 
I've looked back at the invoice 1-15 April 2021 and it appears to be split (which I didn't notice before). So in fact I should have quoted  1-6 April 13.65 and 6- 15 April 16.15. which I guess will be heavily weighted by the 13th and might make more sense to you now, I do apologize.

masonic

PHoppers said:

Bristolleedsfan all the prices I've quoted are with vat added on. 
I've looked back at the invoice 1-15 April 2021 and it appears to be split (which I didn't notice before). So in fact I should have quoted  1-6 April 13.65 and 6- 15 April 16.15. which I guess will be heavily weighted by the 13th and might make more sense to you now, I do apologize.

That's very strange. I've been on three different tariffs at Octopus and all of my bills have, without fail, quoted unit rates without VAT, with a subtotal and then the amount of VAT charged and then total charges. I have never seen a unit rate on any bill that is inclusive of VAT, including average rates. Perhaps the Tracker is unique in that respect, I've never been on it to know definitively, but presumably Octopus wants these to serve as VAT invoices, which have the requirement to show the amounts excluding VAT with the amount of VAT split off as a separate charge.

PHoppers

masonic said:

PHoppers said:

Bristolleedsfan all the prices I've quoted are with vat added on. 
I've looked back at the invoice 1-15 April 2021 and it appears to be split (which I didn't notice before). So in fact I should have quoted  1-6 April 13.65 and 6- 15 April 16.15. which I guess will be heavily weighted by the 13th and might make more sense to you now, I do apologize.

That's very strange. I've been on three different tariffs at Octopus and all of my bills have, without fail, quoted unit rates without VAT, with a subtotal and then the amount of VAT charged and then total charges. I have never seen a unit rate on any bill that is inclusive of VAT, including average rates. Perhaps the Tracker is unique in that respect, I've never been on it to know definitively, but presumably Octopus wants these to serve as VAT invoices, which have the requirement to show the amounts excluding VAT with the amount of VAT split off as a separate charge.

You're correct, on the invoice its unit price ex vat with vat shown later, but I just used a calculator. As long as you make it clear what you're quoting then people can make sense of it

niktheguru

[Deleted User] said:

I hate to restate the obvious but for electricity it is easy to beat those average Tracker prices by switching to Go or Go Faster. The maximum that I pay is 14.62p/kWh with 28 hours a week at 5p/kWh. Looking back nearly 2 years, an average unit price of 10p/kWh was easy to achieve with just a little demand shifting; eg, using the dishwasher and washing machine delay timers.

This is on the money and extremely important at the moment.
why speculate on tracker when prices are high at the moment with no guarantee they’ll reduce significantly this summer when you have a very competitive rate on go faster, with the ability to go back on tracker immediately if by some miracle the price drops this summer...... the only reason I can see tracker being a better bet is if you don’t want a smart meter, though I’d argue tracker is more accurate with a smart meter anyway,