£100 for a 2 minute job?

abc987

matticus7 said:

abc987 said:

@matticus7 How much would you have liked to pay them for the work they did?

For not fixing the problem on either their first or second visit? I'd have liked to have not paid them at all based on that. It's still leaking and not fixed despite all the replies that seem to be ignoring that point.

If you were the plumber, what would you do now. Would you give the customer a full refund?

Risteard

Phil4432 said:

They definitely should have told you how much it would cost, and what their rates were.  Always best to ask when booking.  And don;t let them in without PPE, especially if you have kids in the house.

Masks are not recognised as a mitigation measure generally for construction and engineering works being carried out. The advice stresses maintaining a distance. There is no obligation to wear a mask carrying out works. I would never wear one without it specifically being requested. I also realise that there is absolutely no scientific evidence to support the use of masks, and it is merely virtue signalling. I am not a virtue signaller.

Doozergirl

Risteard said:

Phil4432 said:

They definitely should have told you how much it would cost, and what their rates were.  Always best to ask when booking.  And don;t let them in without PPE, especially if you have kids in the house.

Masks are not recognised as a mitigation measure generally for construction and engineering works being carried out. The advice stresses maintaining a distance. There is no obligation to wear a mask carrying out works. I would never wear one without it specifically being requested. I also realise that there is absolutely no scientific evidence to support the use of masks, and it is merely virtue signalling. I am not a virtue signaller.

Oh God.  Why do you have to expose yourself as an anti-masker.  

Masks DO work as a source control and there is plenty of peer reviewed evidence now.  It is an airborne virus.  You wear one to protect other people, not yourself.  

The only thing I read into this is that anti-maskers don't give a **** about anyone else, because it's no great hardship.  

matticus7

abc987 said:

matticus7 said:

abc987 said:

@matticus7 How much would you have liked to pay them for the work they did?

For not fixing the problem on either their first or second visit? I'd have liked to have not paid them at all based on that. It's still leaking and not fixed despite all the replies that seem to be ignoring that point.

If you were the plumber, what would you do now. Would you give the customer a full refund?

I don't know where you're trying to go with this as I haven't mentioned a refund or what should be done now.

You asked how much I would have LIKED to have paid for the work they did. There is still a leak, I called them out and paid for a leak to be fixed therefore they haven't done the job they were paid for.

Will I let them come back? No. Will I be seeking a refund? No. Will I chalk this up as a learning experience to trust word of mouth over reviews on a website? Definitely.

Risteard

Doozergirl said:

Risteard said:

Phil4432 said:

They definitely should have told you how much it would cost, and what their rates were.  Always best to ask when booking.  And don;t let them in without PPE, especially if you have kids in the house.

Masks are not recognised as a mitigation measure generally for construction and engineering works being carried out. The advice stresses maintaining a distance. There is no obligation to wear a mask carrying out works. I would never wear one without it specifically being requested. I also realise that there is absolutely no scientific evidence to support the use of masks, and it is merely virtue signalling. I am not a virtue signaller.

Oh God.  Why do you have to expose yourself as an anti-masker.  

Masks DO work as a source control and there is plenty of peer reviewed evidence now.  It is an airborne virus.  You wear one to protect other people, not yourself.  

The only thing I read into this is that anti-maskers don't give a **** about anyone else, because it's no great hardship.  

Actually, the evidence (as shown by the Damask study) is that they have no, or a negligible, effect. It is also a known fact that the majority are not worn properly, and cause an increase in touching around the facial area. They also are not sufficiently washed or replaced. This can all actually increase the viral load.

There is no scientific basis for masks. They are simply virtue signalling. Many scientific and medical experts have categorically stated this. The fact that the perceived wisdom allows no debate around this does not make it correct. Totalitarianism is not something which should be supported.

The so-called "cases" are also based on an over-amplified PCR test which was never intended to be used to determine who was infected or not. It had always previously been the case that someone who was not presenting with symptoms was not considered to be a case. The fact is that the COVID figures have been counted in an entirely different way to how we count the figures for any other disease, which makes comparison impossible.

The greatest threat to the human race is the rise in such authoritarianism, totalitarianism and dictatorships. It should be called what it actually is - Treason.

Jeepers_Creepers

matticus7 said:

You asked how much I would have LIKED to have paid for the work they did. There is still a leak, I called them out and paid for a leak to be fixed therefore they haven't done the job they were paid for.

Will I let them come back? No. Will I be seeking a refund? No. Will I chalk this up as a learning experience to trust word of mouth over reviews on a website? Definitely.

And if you cannot fix the remaining leak?

It's not been a good experience for you, as it should have been sorted fully. The fact that they thought they'd sorted the leak in 2 minutes during that first visit and charged you the full £100, is largely neither H nor T. I'm assuming £100 is their 'call-out + first hour' charge, and - depending on where you are in the country - is not unreasonable. However long a task takes, there is an immediate and unrecoverable cost to them - two people, almost certainly a 'lost' hour regardless, and the ongoing cost of running their business. Sometimes a customer will get cracking value if the job turns into a swine, and it takes a whole hour of two men grunting and sweating and plumbing. Other times, not so much. C'est la whatsit. They win some, they lose some.

However, they didn't fix it. Why? Because they jumped to conclusions as to the cause and didn't check the repair far enough - as they should have. They got it wrong. It was their error. It doesn't matter what you said to them about what was leaking - you are a layman. They are the pros, and they should be asking you the necessary questions which will form part of their IDing the source.

I'm not saying they were incompetent - we all make mistakes - but the fact is they didn't sort it. So, what they should be doing is offering to come out to fix it properly at no extra charge provided the job doesn't encroach into a second hour. And they shouldn't - unless there's a very good reason - be fixing it with sealant (unless it's a part that requires sealant during assembly.)

So, what should you be doing? Asking them to come out and sort it a third time. Nicely, and with a smile. Josh with them - make light of how evasive the leak is, and you bet they're cheesed off with it, but "could you come out and sort it, please, because it needs to be done as it's still leaking and my ceiling is being damaged".  

For them to charge you more would require them to justify it - eg. "There were three separate leaks, and the job would have taken us over an hour had we traced them all on that first visit..."

Yes, this will now have taken them three visits, so they are thoroughly out of pocket. But, guess what? They win some they lose some.

Jeepers_Creepers

Risteard said:

Actually, the evidence (as shown by the Damask study) is that they have no, or a negligible, effect. It is also a known fact that the majority are not worn properly, and cause an increase in touching around the facial area. They also are not sufficiently washed or replaced. This can all actually increase the viral load.

There is no scientific basis for masks. They are simply virtue signalling. Many scientific and medical experts have categorically stated this. The fact that the perceived wisdom allows no debate around this does not make it correct. Totalitarianism is not something which should be supported.

The so-called "cases" are also based on an over-amplified PCR test which was never intended to be used to determine who was infected or not. It had always previously been the case that someone who was not presenting with symptoms was not considered to be a case. The fact is that the COVID figures have been counted in an entirely different way to how we count the figures for any other disease, which makes comparison impossible.

The greatest threat to the human race is the rise in such authoritarianism, totalitarianism and dictatorships. It should be called what it actually is - Treason.

I think I've just ID'd another threat to the human race.

Risteard, are you saying masks have no effect at all against transmission?

Mickey666

fred246 said:

It's dead easy to teach yourself plumbing. Hardly any tools needed. Just connecting up a few pipes. 

Well, if you define plumbing as just connecting a few pipes then I suppose you're right, but on that basis I wouldn't a 'plumber' to design my heating system.

Mickey666

Risteard said:

The greatest threat to the human race is the rise in such authoritarianism, totalitarianism and dictatorships. It should be called what it actually is - Treason.

No, the greatest threat to the human race is stupidity.  Unfortunately, the internet enables stupidity to flourish because it can help find enough other stupid people to actually believe it and reinforce their stupidity.  Many wrongs don't make a right, they just make many wrongs.

Doozergirl

Mickey666 said:

Risteard said:

The greatest threat to the human race is the rise in such authoritarianism, totalitarianism and dictatorships. It should be called what it actually is - Treason.

No, the greatest threat to the human race is stupidity.  Unfortunately, the internet enables stupidity to flourish because it can help find enough other stupid people to actually believe it and reinforce their stupidity.  Many wrongs don't make a right, they just make many wrongs.

Thanks.  I'm not going to add anything else.