FTSE rising whilst prospect of FTA seems to be fading

csgohan4

benbay001 said:

csgohan4 said:

Not sure if Joe Public/business was aware of the serious ramifications of leaving the EU and voted for Brexit blindly/ informed way

I think you seriously underestimate the intelligence of the average person who voted to leave.
Its been just over a month since we left and less than 2 months ago everyone still expected a no deal.
Business takes time to adapt and no doubt the EU and UK will work toward further legislation to harmonise trade.
Ultimately, imo we ended up with an almost perfect deal that gives us enough freedom in the world whilst retaining some links to the EU.
To reply to El_Torro's comment, here is a link to the Barclays boss's view of financial services post brexit. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-55939857

So the people/industries in the mentioned articles would vote for brexit? who knows ? speculative I guess

Would changes occur in a timely manner? If not, the business in the UK would further incur costs and make economically unviable to sell to the EU, cutting back their operations  and therefore UK jobs which is self defeating. 

It all boils down what deal was promised, or not, either way as I mentioned previously, the EU are under no obligation to give us what the UK wants.  There is a deal, I suppose better than the WTO tariffs. But still significant costs for Joe business. It certainly isn't pocket money. 

Yes a Brexit has happened, however the consequences will be forever looming over the next few decades. This is only the tip of the iceberg. I would expect more bad news to follow. 

The only good thing is the UK didn't join the Failed EU vaccine procurement process.  

Thrugelmir

csgohan4 said:

benbay001 said:

csgohan4 said:

Not sure if Joe Public/business was aware of the serious ramifications of leaving the EU and voted for Brexit blindly/ informed way

I think you seriously underestimate the intelligence of the average person who voted to leave.
Its been just over a month since we left and less than 2 months ago everyone still expected a no deal.
Business takes time to adapt and no doubt the EU and UK will work toward further legislation to harmonise trade.
Ultimately, imo we ended up with an almost perfect deal that gives us enough freedom in the world whilst retaining some links to the EU.
To reply to El_Torro's comment, here is a link to the Barclays boss's view of financial services post brexit. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-55939857

The only good thing is the UK didn't join the Failed EU vaccine procurement process.  

Merely reflects and reinforces what some of us have known for a very long time about the bureaucrats in Brussels. . 

benbay001

csgohan4 said:

benbay001 said:

csgohan4 said:

Not sure if Joe Public/business was aware of the serious ramifications of leaving the EU and voted for Brexit blindly/ informed way

I think you seriously underestimate the intelligence of the average person who voted to leave.
Its been just over a month since we left and less than 2 months ago everyone still expected a no deal.
Business takes time to adapt and no doubt the EU and UK will work toward further legislation to harmonise trade.
Ultimately, imo we ended up with an almost perfect deal that gives us enough freedom in the world whilst retaining some links to the EU.
To reply to El_Torro's comment, here is a link to the Barclays boss's view of financial services post brexit. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-55939857

So the people/industries in the mentioned articles would vote for brexit? who knows ? speculative I guess

Would changes occur in a timely manner? If not, the business in the UK would further incur costs and make economically unviable to sell to the EU, cutting back their operations  and therefore UK jobs which is self defeating. 

It all boils down what deal was promised, or not, either way as I mentioned previously, the EU are under no obligation to give us what the UK wants.  There is a deal, I suppose better than the WTO tariffs. But still significant costs for Joe business. It certainly isn't pocket money. 

Yes a Brexit has happened, however the consequences will be forever looming over the next few decades. This is only the tip of the iceberg. I would expect more bad news to follow. 

The only good thing is the UK didn't join the Failed EU vaccine procurement process.  

"So the people/industries in the mentioned articles would vote for brexit? who knows ? speculative I guess"
What is this a reply to?

 "Would changes occur in a timely manner? If not, the business in the UK would further incur costs and make economically unviable to sell to the EU, cutting back their operations  and therefore UK jobs which is self defeating. " 
Of course changes take time. Im still not sure exactly which bit youre replying to with this either.


"There is a deal, I suppose better than the WTO tariffs. But still significant costs for Joe business. It certainly isn't pocket money." 
If tarriff free market access is the be all - end all, then i find that it very strange that I cant think of a single EU country that has been a standout economic success over the last 20 years. 
Its also quite telling IMO that despite having a larger population, I cant name an EU company that i would consider "innovative" or cutting edge, yet jump to the US and i can reel off 10s and 10s. Could this be a sign that having the correct policies to foster innovation is equally if not more important that 0% tarriffs?

"I would expect more bad news to follow. "
Would you have expected roses and wine had the vote been to remain?

El_Torro

benbay001 said:

To reply to El_Torro's comment, here is a link to the Barclays boss's view of financial services post brexit. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-55939857

Thanks for the link. I've read it and it does touch on some of my concerns about the Brexit deal.

Saying "The financial sector has been screwed when it comes to trading with the EU by this deal, but that's OK, we can adapt and focus our attention on other economies" seems like a massive cop out to me. In my view there is no assurance that the financial business we lose in the EU will be replaced by trading elsewhere. 

The article touches on the fishing industry, another puzzling thing when it comes to this deal. The fishing industry makes up what, 0.1% of the UK economy? In that case why was so much attention put on it? Sure, I appreciate that people working in the industry care, but why did the politicians? Perhaps some of the time and energy put into working on that part of the agreement should have been spent on focussing on areas that would have a bigger impact on the average British person.

csgohan4

El_Torro said:

benbay001 said:

To reply to El_Torro's comment, here is a link to the Barclays boss's view of financial services post brexit. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-55939857

Thanks for the link. I've read it and it does touch on some of my concerns about the Brexit deal.

Saying "The financial sector has been screwed when it comes to trading with the EU by this deal, but that's OK, we can adapt and focus our attention on other economies" seems like a massive cop out to me. In my view there is no assurance that the financial business we lose in the EU will be replaced by trading elsewhere. 

The article touches on the fishing industry, another puzzling thing when it comes to this deal. The fishing industry makes up what, 0.1% of the UK economy? In that case why was so much attention put on it? Sure, I appreciate that people working in the industry care, but why did the politicians? Perhaps some of the time and energy put into working on that part of the agreement should have been spent on focussing on areas that would have a bigger impact on the average British person.

it's the fetish on sovereignty which is why fishing was brought to the forefront and show control. 

Turns out the UK's own VAT rules are prohibitive for trade and the EU are responding in kind with VAT as well

https://www.ft.com/content/f5cf57f5-0d62-4158-b67b-46b2df5c04bd

Thrugelmir

El_Torro said:

benbay001 said:

To reply to El_Torro's comment, here is a link to the Barclays boss's view of financial services post brexit. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-55939857

The article touches on the fishing industry, another puzzling thing when it comes to this deal. The fishing industry makes up what, 0.1% of the UK economy? In that case why was so much attention put on it?

Fishing could provide a jobs boost to areas of the country which could be described as economically deprived. Better to boost employment than simply provide benefits.  Will also stop places dying and becoming little more than temporary holiday resorts for the wealthy. GDP is a misleading indicator when it comes to life on the street for the average Joe. A recent study on Ireland's economy has blown away that myth. 

BananaRepublic

I thought the anti Brexit extremism had died, once the predicted flesh eating zombies failed to materialise. 

The boss of Nissan recently said the extra paperwork was insignificant for them, and they were planning to set up a battery factory here. 

Cadbury are bringing back production to the UK, some was overseas. 

I suspect it’s partly short term issues with systems not in place and maybe even the French being awkward. A disorganised UK government, and troublesome French, who would have thought it. Possibly also annoyance at our having ordered vaccines earlier. 

csgohan4

BananaRepublic said:

I thought the anti Brexit extremism had died, once the predicted flesh eating zombies failed to materialise. 

The boss of Nissan recently said the extra paperwork was insignificant for them, and they were planning to set up a battery factory here. 

Cadbury are bringing back production to the UK, some was overseas. 

I suspect it’s partly short term issues with systems not in place and maybe even the French being awkward. A disorganised UK government, and troublesome French, who would have thought it. Possibly also annoyance at our having ordered vaccines earlier. 

bare in the mind the financial side of things have not been dealt with from banking point of view. So it will be a long journey.

 I sincerely hope the UK business will not suffer too much, but Sadly things have started to crop up which I believe are beyond 'teething problems'. Even the most prepared firms are having issues with paperwork and costs as outlined in my links

Thrugelmir

BananaRepublic said:

Cadbury are bringing back production to the UK, some was overseas. 

Was a PR disaster when production was moved overseas originally. Given the importance of the UK market for Dairy milk sales. Increasing home based production has many benefits. 

Cus

Thrugelmir said:

El_Torro said:

benbay001 said:

To reply to El_Torro's comment, here is a link to the Barclays boss's view of financial services post brexit. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-55939857

The article touches on the fishing industry, another puzzling thing when it comes to this deal. The fishing industry makes up what, 0.1% of the UK economy? In that case why was so much attention put on it?

Fishing could provide a jobs boost to areas of the country which could be described as economically deprived. Better to boost employment than simply provide benefits.  Will also stop places dying and becoming little more than temporary holiday resorts for the wealthy. GDP is a misleading indicator when it comes to life on the street for the average Joe. A recent study on Ireland's economy has blown away that myth. 

It's not going to stop places dying, as being in the EU wasn't the cause in the first place.
As someone else said on a similar thread, it was a flag waving, rules the waves type PR area perfectly suited to focus on.  Why else focus on 24k person industry rather than trying to protect a 1.1million people financial services industry.  Doesn't get the heart pumping, showing Boris sticking it to the EU by protecting a financial services employee versus a fisherman.

I understand why the government did it this way, as at the moment perception is more important than reality,but let's not kid ourselves.
Also doesn't mean that brexit was incorrect.