UKPC LTD - Overstay !!!!!! Appreciated

TheHennyQ

Hi team,

I have fully perused the NEWBIES threads and am seeking clarification/ guidance/assistance a tad further ther story so far . . . Driver recently visited the site.

Driver browsed in one store. Left and went to another store where they purchased food items to consume inside it. Walked to green space attached to site. Returned to vehicle  of third party. Returned to original vehicle cleaned vehicle of waste and left site.  A few days later NTK has arrived in post with requests stating overstaying 3 hour limit by 13 minutes . . images submitted on NTK time stamps imply overstay of 16 minutes. . company has history of "doctoring timestamps"  - will upload NTK as soon as scanner is accessible and image can be "cleared".

any assistance will be greatly appreciated.

1 Date of the infringement: 07/10/2020

2 Date on the NTK [this must have been received within 14 days from the 'offence' date]: 13/10/2020 (Having trouble with the scanner at the moment and will upload images as soon as is possible)

3 Date received : 17/10/2020 

4 Does the NTK mention schedule 4 of The Protections of Freedoms Act 2012? [Y/N?] Yes

5 Is there any photographic evidence of the event?: Image of entry and exit provided

6 Have you appealed? [Y/N?] post up your appeal] About to use template (blue) unsure of amendments following Beavis ruling and rumour that keeper is now required to submit identity of driver. Have you had a response? [Y/N?] post it up: N/A

7 Who is the parking company?: UKPC LTD (UK PARKING CONTROL LTD)

8. Where exactly [carpark name and town]: Friern Barnet Retail Park N11 3PW

For either option, does it say which appeals body they operate under: POPLA

complaints have been made to the two stores visited

     store 1: H - respond that they are unable to prove any service or purchases due to lack of receipts and will not be able to waiver the charges

     store 2: C - yet to respond

     Land Owner: Email address has been submitted but is for lettings agents

document has been sent to DVLA requesting info. .

Trying to make sur ethe wording is as air tight as possible on the appeal. Have considered strongly worded refusal.

Will fully appreciate any assistance/ steers in the right direction.

Umkomaas

About to use template (blue) unsure of amendments following Beavis ruling and rumour that keeper is now required to submit identity of driver. 

The template was produced post-Beavis, so nothing to be unsure about. The keeper should be invited to provide the driver's details, but should not be required to do so - no rumours on that I've heard of, but it's not going to change. Does the UKPC state a requirement to identify the driver?

Trying to make sur ethe wording is as air tight as possible on the appeal. Have considered strongly worded refusal. 

The blue text template is as 'air tight' as necessary. Use that and obtain your POPLA code. Hopefully you can find a technicality to win this at POPLA, as an overstay per se is difficult to appeal successfully.

By the way, is the exclamation mark button on your keyboard defective, or do 6 exclamation marks in a row have some specific meaning?  Or has the forum profanity software kicked in?

BrownTrout

Where is this rumour

nosferatu1001

Where on earth have you heard that "rumour"? Given this site is THE site for private parking knowledge , we have ne ver heard of it meaning its likely pub !!!!!!...

D_P_Dance

UKPC have form, read this

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/crime/11858473/Parking-firm-UKPC-admits-faking-tickets-to-fine-drivers.html#:~:text=UKPC - which is now at,in the firm's photograph system.

Nine times out of ten these tickets are scams, so consider complaining to your MP, sometimes it can lead to cancellation.,

Parliament is well aware of the MO of these private parking companies, many of whom are former clampers. On 15th March 2019 a Bill was enacted to curb the excesses of these shysters. Codes of Practice are being drawn up, and hopefully this will become law shortly

Umkomaas

nosferatu1001 said:

Where on earth have you heard that "rumour"? Given this site is THE site for private parking knowledge , we have ne ver heard of it meaning its likely pub !!!!!!...

It will be Bob the Gob again down at the local. You know the one who tells the great unwashed to ignore private parking tickets, that they are unenforceable, that if the PPC can't show any loss, you owe them nowt ....... and that the moon is made of cheese!  We'll never be without a job here!

TheHennyQ

A colleague of mine is a magistrate (fairly new to the post though) so I thought I better get it checked out.

The button wasn't stuck per se. .

I went with the response below:

Without prejudice, except as to costs Parking Charge Notice - Notice to Keeper [NUMBER]

This letter is a formal challenge to the issue of your Parking Charge Notice - Notice to Keeper as set out in the current BPA Ltd AOS Code of Practice B.22 On [DATE] I was the registered keeper of a Ford Fiesta Vignalle registration number [REGISTRATION]. Before I decide how to deal with your Parking Charge Notice - Notice to Keeper, I should be grateful if you would first answer all the questions and deal with all the issues I have set out below. Once you have done so, I will be able to make an informed decision on how I deal with the matter. I should be grateful for specific answers to all questions raised. In this respect I remind you of the obligations set out in the current Practice Direction on Pre-Action Conduct. I dispute your claim for the reasons set out below.

Please note that although I dispute the whole basis of the parking charge, my main concern is its disproportionate and punitive level. 1. Your parking charge amount claim. Please explain on which of the following grounds your claim is based: (i) Damages for trespass (ii) Damages for breach of contract (iii) A contractual sum 2. Your loss. If it is your case that that a trespass was committed or that a contract was breached such that your claim is one for damages; please give me a full breakdown of the actual losses which evidences that this parking charge is a true reflection of the damages caused solely by the alleged parking contravention. 3. Your status – the creditor. Your Parking Charge Notice - Notice to Keeper simply mentions UKPC UK Parking LTD. Please tell me who is the actual creditor making this £100 parking charge demand. I need to know exactly who is making the claim and in what capacity. 4. Ownership of premises. Please tell me who owns the car park as I wish to send them a copy of this letter. 5. Contractual Authority (as required by BPA Ltd AOS CoP B.7) Please provide me with a copy of the contract between your company and the landowner/landholder that provides the necessary contractual written authority for the issue and enforcement of your Parking Charge Notice - Notice to Keeper. 6. Signage. If it is your case that a contract has been breached or that a contractual sum is now due, please send me photographs of the signs that you display and upon which you seek to evidence that a lawful and legally enforceable contract was been entered into. Please ensure that the photographs show the terms and conditions in a clear and legible manner. Please provide me with a diagram showing the locations and layout of those signs at the car park. Also provide evidence that the wording is in plain and intelligible language and in sufficiently large print as to be legible to a driver at the car park’s entry point. 7. Summary I look forward to receiving your acknowledgement within 14 days and as there are no ‘exceptional circumstances’ your comprehensive reply within 35 days (in accordance with the BPA AOS Code of Practice B.22.8). I will then be able to make an informed decision as to how I deal with your Parking Charge Notice – Notice to Keeper. If you reject this challenge or fail to address the issues that have been raised then, in accordance with the BPA AOS Code of Practice 22.12, please ensure that you enclose all the required information (including the necessary ‘POPLA code’) so that I may immediately refer the matter for their decision. If you fail to follow any of the procedures outlined in the BPA AOS Code of Practice or your legal requirements under the Protection of Freedoms Act, or the requirements of the Practice Direction on Pre-Action Conduct then I will make a formal complaint to the DVLA Data Sharing Policy Group, D16.

Please Note: Unless you have specifically requested it and received my express permission, you do not have my authority to disclose or refer this letter or any other communication from me to any other person or organisation.

Redx

The first post looks more like a CAG or legal beagles q and a template

I do not see the point of a WP query

Coupon-mad

That is all rubbish, including the pointless WP heading ''Without prejudice, except as to costs''.

I hope you haven't sent that.

BrownTrout

Coupon-mad said:

That is all rubbish, including the pointless WP heading ''Without prejudice, except as to costs''.

I hope you haven't sent that.

i fear they have, i see WP all over the place, people have no idea what i means or what it is for

Umkomaas

That looks very much like the Parking Cowboys' ancient template. 'Without Prejudice' doesn't half make it sound all 'legal', enough to send the most bellicose  PPC scurrying for the phone in panic to call their lawyers!