CST Law & Leasing Company - Please Help.

pcnvictim92

Hello.
Firstly, thank you to the kind heroes who have put this forum together and share information (not all heroes wear capes!).
I aim to be as conclusive as possible here in the hopes that I will have clear direction of action moving forward, and I am greatly appreciative of the information shared so far and would be hugely thankful for assistance in my case.

The long and the short, I have accumulated a number of Parking Charge Notices from an APCOA Station Car Park. Part of the issue with these has been that a number have been paid by the car leasing provider. The debt collection agencies appear to have broken through on a few where the liability has not been transferred to me, and unknowingly to me until recently, the Lease Firm decided to pay these (frustrating) - I feel as though my hands are tied here now? Although I have seen mentions of Leased Car PCNs - is there advise that I should know about for this, in terms of tackling the issue?

Further to this the known driver at the time in each incident has not been proven, and remains to be unproven - I have seen in various threads something regarding POFA 2012 and APCOA - are there actions for me to here to fight my point of the known (or unknown) driver at the time?

So I'm not at the LBC stage just yet, although I have had a letter which I understand to be noise and nothing to be concerned about at the moment. However, I want to get on the front foot as I am sure this will move forward. See the letter attached.
I understand the below:

1: DRP cannot instruct them as it's not their debt.   WRONG ENTITY CST ??
2: The costs are disproportionate and grossly inflated

As a result there is some form of abuse of process going on here. I also understand as mentioned above, this letter isn't much to worry about at this stage... I'm just looking for the list of actions once (if) we get to LBC stage. And also if possible, some advice on the fines that the lease company have unfortunately paid ..

So as i understand from reading the SRA thread, once and LBC is issued, I should then raise an SRA with the information contained with the SRA thread. This helps me to understand my position, but also helps to delay things..
From what I have read there are also a few questions that should be posed to CST, such as:

1: Deny any debt
2: They say DRP instructed them ...... THEY LIE, DRP cannot instruct anyone as it's not their debt
Ask them for a contractual agreement between you and DRP ... there is none ?
3: Ask them on what legal authority they have to add £60 ... they have none ?

Is there anything further I should know re APCOA, and specifically POFA 2012 as mentioned above?

Thanks in advance, and thanks for all of the informative information share within these forums.

Regards

Redx

Read the CST letters thread. https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/6166004/cst-letters-forum-group-thread/p1

Apcoa do not follow POFA , even if it applies , so no keeper hirer liability , do not disclose who was driving , not to anyone

The lease company should have named the hirer and passed on copies of the lease documents , which is extremely rare

If it is an actual station car park under a TOC on network rail land then bylaws apply and POFA doesn't apply anyway
Check if it's private land or administered by the TOC , because bylaws issues are dealt with within 6 months in magistrates courts , again rate as the TOC would have to do it

Chances are it's just scare tactics , especially if no court claim has arrived

pcnvictim92

So I've just checked, and it is network rail station / TOC owned land - where does this leave me? As mentioned previously there has been no proof of driver, but in addition to this 6 months are long gone ..

Redx

it leaves you with no mags court , but 6 years if they wanted to try civil court, which is what they are threatening, but no keeper liability for 2 reasons, 1) its railway land and bylaws apply, , 2) APCOA have never complied with POFA anyway, so no keeper liability

they dont know who is driving, they wont have the lease docs , POFA does not apply , bylaws apply, its a dogs dinner , for them more than you , many hurdles to climb, not least jurisdiction

deny the allged debts, do the SAR to APCOA too

there is absolutely no reason whatsoever why the lease company as keeper cannot pay the pcn,s , they definitely can as keeper , all keepers have that right

the point is that depending on the lease contract they cannot hold the lessee responsible for reimbursement  , but that has never stopped them clouding the issues and charging hirers and lessees

you need to check the small print of the lease contract, because I doubt that private parking charge notices from private parking irms are in it , they usually mention fines and penalties from authorities

Coupon-mad

Are you saying the lease firm paid ones that had already been transferred to you?  Had you acknowledged the Notices?

nosferatu1001

Do the notices sTate 

penalty
or
Parking  

pcnvictim92

The lease company paid the fines based on the following information:
'Your account preference has been set up as transfer of liability, which Fines Management have done so. They have paid to date 4 PCN's where the correct procedure was followed in transferring liability to yourself. These were not paid and so transferred to the debt collection agency where Fines Management have paid and recharged so that no further are incurred.'
I had not acknowledged the notices prior to the payments being made. Thereon afterwards i disputed that they weer 'illegitimate fines' and refused to pay.

I checked the wording of the lease agreement which states the following:

fixed penalty, fine, congestion or other charge in connection with the Vehicle or its use,
I argued as mentioned above that these were illegitimate.

Unsure where that leaves me, or what i could possibly try here?

pcnvictim92

They state 'Parking Charge Notice'

Redx

then they are civil invoices , not fines or penalties , on land where bylaws and penalties apply

if the lease company paid them , then they would issue to debt collectors to chase you up for non payment of the invoice from the lease company

if they had named you as hirer or lessee to APCOA then it would be between Apcoa and yourself, this is the guidance given by the BVRLA several years ago

pcnvictim92

Agreed ... and this was the dispute that I was involved in with the Lease firm, but unfortunately i had a direct debit with the lease firm and had to wear the losses on those occasions.

D_P_Dance

Trading Standards might be interested in your dispute with the hire company and, as stated above, these PCNs have no legal status, they are neither fines not penalties, merely invoiices from am ex clamper/scammerho thinks they have been damaged by your actions. 

Nine times out of ten these tickets are scams, so consider complaining to your MP., it can cause the scammer extra costs, and in some cases, cancellation. 

Parliament is well aware of the MO of these private parking companies, many of whom are former clampers, and on 15th March 2019 a Bill was enacted to curb the excesses of these shysters. Codes of Practice are being drawn up, an independent appeals service will be set up later this year,

Just as the clampers were finally closed down, so hopefully will many of these companies, persistent offenders denied access to the DVLA database and unable to operate.

Hopefully life will become impossible for the worst of these scammers, but until this is done you should still complain to your MP, citing the new legislation.

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2019/8/contents/of these Private Parking Companies.