Need PCN Advice!

Sylith

Hi all. I could do with some advice about a private parking notice that I've received and it said on the Newbies post to start a new thread for individual cases.

My PCN was issued as I hadn't paid for sufficient time (I was sat in the car park before purchasing my ticket and didn't realise your time started upon entry). I received no windscreen ticket but did receive a PCN by post from Smart Parking Ltd, telling me to pay £54 (or £90 after 14 days followed by £100 after 28 days).

I hadn’t heard of this site at the time so I made an appeal claiming that the time for which I hadn’t paid was due to setting up an account on the mobile app that you can also use to pay and that the signage implied that the only way to pay was through the physical machines; there was no mention of an alternative payment method.

I received a letter a few days later that rejected my appeal and informed me that I can either make a complaint with POPLA or pay the fine. Since I hadn’t seen the NEWBIES forum, I was not able to send the example appeal. 

So I am now wondering whether it is worth appealing via POPLA even though I didn’t send the suggested appeal or whether to cut my losses and pay while I’m still discounted. 

Many thanks in advance.

Fruitcake

It is not a fine. What a shame you revealed the driver's identity. Never mind, that cannot now be helped.

First of all, what happened when you complained to the landowner? That is always Plan A.

Yes it is always worth appealing (not complaining) to PoPLA using all the template points available to you from the third post of the NEWBIES. Get pics of the site and signage in preparation.

Normal appeal points will include,
Not the landowner
No standing (no valid contract) to issue charges
Inadequate signage
BPA CoP failures
Grace periods

SAnythiung else relevant.

Post your draft here for checking before you submit it.

Don't forget to complain to your MP as well about this unregulated scam.

Sylith

Yes. Had I known what I do now, I may have been able to nip it in the bud. 
I have yet to complain to the landowner as I'm unsure of how to find out who owns the land. I could not find the relevant information in their letters or on their site. A review was left about the carpark which claimed the landowners are "Aviva Investors" but there was no evidence to support this claim. 

So sacrificing the "Discount period" to appeal to PoPLA is likely to be the best plan of action? I did see this on the NEWBIES forum but didn't know whether it would still apply, given the situation. I'll look into this. 

Thank you for your reply.

1505grandad

Which car park is it?

Sylith

1505grandad said:

Which car park is it?

Haven Banks Retail Park, Exeter.

KeithP

Haven Banks Retail Park, Exeter is mentioned in five other threads here.

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/search?adv=1&search="Haven+Banks+Retail+Park+Exeter"&title=&author=&cat=163&tags=&discussion_d=1&comment_c=1&discussion_poll=1&within=1+day&date=

There might be something useful there.

D_P_Dance

 (I was sat in the car park before purchasing my ticket and didn't realise your time started upon entry).

It starts when you park, read this.,

http://parking-prankster.blogspot.com/2014/03/waiting-for-space-is-not-parking.html

It is not a fine, it is an invoice from an ex-clamper to compensate them for the alleged harm they suffered when you did what you did. We call it a scam. Pay them not a penny unless a judge so orders it.

Nine times out of ten these tickets are scams, so consider complaining to your MP., it can cause the scammer extra costs and work, and in some cases, cancellation. 

Parliament is well aware of the MO of these private parking companies, many of whom are former clampers, and on 15th March 2019 a Bill was enacted to curb the excesses of these shysters. Codes of Practice are being drawn up, an independent appeals service will be set up,

Just as the clampers were finally closed down, so hopefully will many DVLA's date base more rigorously policed, persistent offenders denied access to the DVLA database and unable to operate.

Hopefully life will become impossible for the worst of these scammers, but until this is done you should still complain to your MP, citing the new legislation.

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2019/8/contents/of these Private Parking Companies.

Just as the clampers were finally closed down, so hopefully will many of these Private Parking Companies.

  

Le_Kirk

Fruitcake said:

Yes it is always worth appealing (not complaining) to PoPLA using all the template points available to you from the fourth post of the NEWBIES. Get pics of the site and signage in preparation.

Oops!, it's the third post of the NEWBIE sticky.

nosferatu1001

Also, if it took time to download and register with the app, yet there is nothing that indicates IN THE APP that you are required to wokr out your paid time back to the moment you entered the car park, then the GREEN BUTTON case for NCP is triggered; in a pay and display, or pay by mobile, the contract starts when the button is pressed, on a machine or otherwise. 

Fruitcake

Le_Kirk said:

Fruitcake said:

Yes it is always worth appealing (not complaining) to PoPLA using all the template points available to you from the fourth post of the NEWBIES. Get pics of the site and signage in preparation.

Oops!, it's the third post of the NEWBIE sticky.

Thanks. I think the heat has affected my brain. 

MistyZ

I think Aviva Investors are indeed the landowner:
https://completelyindustrial.co.uk/portfolio/Aviva/scheme/Haven-Banks-Retail-Park-Exeter

Email their CEO straight away.  If purchases were made at the retail park, send evidence or cite the spend.  Say which stores or other premises were visited.  If the purpose was browsing, state that - few purchases would be made if shoppers didn't go looking first.  If occupants of the car are regular visitors to the retail park, mention that repeat custom.  If you had a great day - emphasise that.  The PPC is engaged to deter non-customers, not to alienate genuine customers.  Your understanding of that must inform the whole complaint.

Explain the reason for the alleged overstay.  Apologise if you wish, but do not overdo it.  Customers are very important.  Politely but firmly request that they cancel this charge.

All you need to do first is to find the CEO & his/her email.

If the landowner complaint doesn't work out, then try POPLA.  But don't give in if a reply to email is tardy - follow it up.  Don't give in if first answer is a fob-off either - just reiterate the basis on which a cancellation is requested all the more strongly.