Are U1of 3million+ #ExcludedUK Getting NO Govt Support? Join us!

Grumpy_chap

banthetrolls said:

A lot of people fall outside of any council grant - working from home 
No need for a premises grant if working from home and not incurring the costs of premises while the business was closed.
Bounce back loans have been an issue for quite a few sole traders 
Still available if you persevere (the biggest obstacle seems to be those that do not have business accounts and that is their own fault)
Universal credit if lucky can be pretty pointless once you realise it’s next to nothing and on a lot of cases nothing 
UC is paid based on established criteria - luck has nothing to do with it.  Many claimants would say you are lucky if you are ineligible for UC

so your left with deferring tax and payment holidays 
if you have a family and next to no income you can’t defer payment at Sainsbury’s for example 

Simple fact is most are covered but lots have been left high and dry 
Everyone should have been given a lower grant that meant people weren’t left out and struggling while others thriving 
We will all be repaying it one way or another 

I still fail to see how "lots have been left high and dry".

If there was a lower grant given to everyone, how much would you suggest that grant should be?  Who is your "everyone"?

• premier league footballers
• property magnates
• pensioners unaffected by change of income from coronavirus
• those in PAYE jobs still working as normal

OR, just whatever group you happen to fall in, but not the others who would then be left out?

amykirk1996

Grumpy_chap said:

Who are the 3 million getting NO government support?

That's been well documented, it doesn't matter if it's 3 million or 3 hundred, there are far too many.

amykirk1996

Grumpy_chap said:

Why do you think you have the right to say that I should not be contributing to this discussion?

Of course you should be contributing, but as the saying goes at the moment "you are part of the problem, quit being part of the problem and start being part of the solution".

A good starting point would be recognising that there are a large number of people, the estimates are 1-3 million but pick a number out of the air of your own choosing if you like, currently forgotten and/or excluded from support.

Grumpy_chap

It's not that well documented.  I can't find out who the 3 million or the 300 are getting NO government support.  I can only conceive of a theoretical person that could exist but has sufficient wealth as to not be commenting about the subject on forums such as this.

Senna_1st

Grumpy_chap said:

Who are the 3 million getting NO government support?

This is the list 

These are the trade body & ONS stats collated 

Grumpy_chap

To get NO support, you have to fall into ALL of those groups.  I do not believe that is 3 million people.

The coronavirus support schemes are unbelievably generous.  I have yet to meet any individual anywhere who is getting NO support, except for if they don't chose to claim the support that is available.

GaleSF63

Some people will be counted at least twice as they will fall into more than one group.

Senna_1st

Grumpy_chap said:

To get NO support, you have to fall into ALL of those groups.  I do not believe that is 3 million people.

The coronavirus support schemes are unbelievably generous.  I have yet to meet any individual anywhere who is getting NO support, except for if they don't chose to claim the support that is available.

You’re basically saying that a group of over 10k are being untruthful then? Sadly you’re wrong and not mixing in circles of people that are affected in this way. Yes I could furlough myself and get £210 pm but then under the restrictions of Directors furlough can only carry out statutory duties. Only ltd on advice of accountant to protect my home when I Invested in my biz & expanded 8 years ago I’ve now downsized but can’t disincorporate due to high vale of equipment I use. I’ve only ever thought of myself as self employed for 27 years the Ltd was a technicality as far as I was aware & concerned like majority of SME’s. Caught between a rock & hard place no other grants that I qualify for all savings used to keep Biz afloat. Thank goodness for my state pension! I’m more fortunate than many as I can start earning at a reduced level in 2 weeks after 16 weeks closed. Many can’t or their sector is closed for many months more. I don’t think you have any understanding of the freelance workforce very few of them have or can be furloughed. I really feel for these short term contractors. Believe me I’ve been shocked at the scams of this! Supply teachers get no furlough or support of any kind the list is endless. If you’re single in rented accommodation with no income for 4-8 months ( events, trade shows, gigs, film, tv have so many behind the scenes crews it’s astonishing. Please have some compassion. Especially when people like my son was furloughed 2 months and saved a shed load not paying for childcare or going out days out Meals out fuel etc 80% was way too much 50 or 60% for higher earners but more for those on minimum wages. Then we wouldn’t have ppl not wanting to go back to work! I potentially wouldn’t either. Madness 
the system is not fit for purpose End of. 

gt94sss2

ExcludedUK_NoSupport 
the problem with posters like the one included in your post is that it overstates your case to the point of damaging it - with those who may otherwise sympathize with your argument.

if you started a business in the last 3 years you can actually claim SEISS.
if you don’t employ staff, you don’t need to claim furlough
if you don’t have premises, you don’t need help to offset the business rates bill

If you had a child, SEISS will now ignore the first 12 months if the parent took leave : 
 https://www.gov.uk/government/news/self-employed-new-parents-can-claim-support-grant
The poster is also very dismissive of the government loan schemes which have issued over £35bn - most in bounce back loans - so many are obviously willing to take them out

For your campaign, it’s best to stick to facts and accuracy if you want to be successful rather than emotion. On the other hand, if you really  wanted to increase the numbers you quote.. well you ignore the plight of buy to let landlords who lose out as property income goes on a different part of the tax return than self employment but I guess that’s not as popular a cause.

SidneySmutt

If there is one thing I have learned from this pandemic. Is how little tax the self employed, and owners of LTD compaines pay.