£20k for a wedding?

Retireby40

pickledonionspaceraider said:

Retireby40 said:

pickledonionspaceraider said:

Retireby40 said:

pickledonionspaceraider said:

Retireby40 said:

pickledonionspaceraider said:

Difference in generations I guess? I got wed far later in life than my parents

My parents were still teenagers when they got married in the early 70's. Moved in to a small rented bedsit, with the largest item they owned at that time,  being an ironing board. All 'housey'  wedding gifts were very very gratefully received by them.  Wedding presents they had were things like casserole dishes, crockery etc  They are still together, still very much in love, and now retired.  I am not sure if it was common for teenagers to be getting wed, at that time

Me and husband were in our mid 30s when we got wed.  We didn't need any house items, and requested no presents - although we did get some welcome cash gifts, which was lovely.  We did get a few traditional type presents, but not many

I try my best not to judge people, it's not always easy, i think being judgemental is human nature, but I do try and not be, as best as I can - but in all honesty I am not flawless, who is?

I wonder if society expectations have shifted.  The expectation on the young seems to be get a career, house and other stuff.  Not to get married too soon.  I mean these days you don't really hear of teenagers getting married (well I don't)

Think a big factor in that is that women no longer rely on men to provide a living for themselves meaning women can enjoy the freedom they maybe didnt have 50-100 years ago.

The whole need to rush to get married is outdated. Nowadays there isnt the stigma attached with living with a man and not being married. Also theres no longer that stigma of having a child without being married. It's easy to criticise aspects of this society but those above things are definately improvements.

Yes things have changed massively.  I think I have spoken on various occasions about this perhaps on this forum - about how that freedom comes with huge pressures. 

Pressures women put on themselves and each other, and societal pressures to have it all, (which to me, translates to: Run yourself ragged trying to juggle children, a 45 hour a week career, and a marriage, whilst being a 'home maker', and somehow fit time to go to the gym, and take care of yourself too ) .  It is not the norm for a lady to be a housewife (after children are in school)...After children are in school, at the latest, a woman is expected to pick up her career. 

Life is exhausting trying to do all these things. If this is freedom, it can go swivel. It feels more like a trap, when I look around and watch young mothers struggling.

and im not judging anyone else's choices, but life is far too hectic these days, and I am thinking we have got it all wrong. 

Like Heath Ledger once said, no one ever asks if you are happy.  You meet someone for the first time and one of the first things they ask is 'What do you do?'.....it is like a caste of judgement, if you have a degree founded job, then they are impressed by you, but if you are a street sweeper, they do not understand you.

But again that's down to choice what some people do. Not just women but also men. This idea that people have to have it all is a fault of society and one that we can choose to ignore.

If peoples insecurities and desires to keep up with the Jones makes their life difficult so be it. Its self inflicted.

Everyone in life has a choice how to live their life.

People generally ask "what you do" because by finding out that, you can find out many other things about a person. Plus it's a much less intense question as "are you happy". 

It is easy to underestimate the pressure that people put on each other and themselves 

I don't think it is right, but many  people seem obsessed by what others are doing on the internet. People like 'Influencers'  and Z list celebs have the brand that it all comes so easy to them.  It it wasn't so, these people would not become millionaires...and they are....there are a lot out there...blogging as I type - lifestyle advice.....it is everywhere, streaming on to every tablet, smart phone and laptop.  It is crazy - and I really dislike it.  But it is the way of the world now.  I am so glad I am not in my 20s these days

What else can be learned when asking a person what they do for a living?  Their social status, their education level, their income....all references of judgement.  I am not interested in that. If I get asked, I tell them I am a space cadet.  Then they laugh awkwardly and think I am weird, and move on to judge someone else

It is not such a free choice as you may think, as many households simply cannot live on one wage anymore...so there is the financial pressure also - which is much harder and closer to home, to ignore

I don't think the world is as free as you say it is.  

Again they choose to be "influenced". They choose to follow people. They choose to have Facebook or Instagram. That is a conscious choice so if it is having a negative impact its simple. Delete them.

What can be learned from someones profession? Education. Intelligence. Determination. Ambition. Work/life balance (do they work all weekend while you are off?) Salary (which is one of the least important things). Those things are very important.

Imagine you are a very self motivated person. Ambitious. Wanting to achieve the best you can and you meet someone who says yeah, I quit school at 16, bummed around and now I work in a factory on minimum wage. I've worked there 10 years and still on the same basic wage. What someone do can indicate their character and their outlook in life which can transfer into other areas in life.

If you have kids are they going to push them to do the best or the type of parents who dont really care. Give them a tablet to play on for an easy life.

It's not being judgemental. Its learning about what kind of person they have been in the past and how they have managed their life up to the point you meet them. Nothing to do with material goods. But personality.

Of course there is financial pressure. But again that is on the family as a whole. Not just the mother. And again this is the type of thing that needs to be assessed before kids and during the process of thinking about more. Many things can happen in life that you cant account for. But theres many people who cant even cope as a couple financially who then decide they have a given right to have children and then they struggle even more. 

Theres many families who live in a house they cant afford, drive a car or 2 they cant really afford, have I phones and full sky packages they cant afford, wear nice clothes and eat out once a week and cry that both parents have to work. I'm not talking about the genuine people who fall on hard times or who are stuck in a minimum wage job. I'm talking middle class. earning half decent money but living beyond their means.

London is a huge example of it. I know people who work and live in London because its London. They earn say 40k a year there. Cry they cant afford to buy/live/do anything. However when you suggest they take a job up North or in another part of the UK earning maybe 30k a year and having much more potential they say. Ppffftt I wouldnt move to Manchester or Belfast or Glasgow. London is where it is at.

 If it were not influencing- would there even be such a thing as social influcencers? It is the public that have even created this as a requirement.  Yes you can choose, but by mere existence of these type of roles, shows that many do not march to the beat of their own drum.  I do not even know why the role of social influencers exists, nor agree with it, but people have created a need for that kind of clap trap

I am sorry, but the whole 'what do you do for a living' question IS judgemental.  It's completely irrelevant upon first meeting someone. I'd rather know what type of person they are, the personality they have, are they kind to small animals, what hobbies, what interests.  All the rest of it - career wise - is none of my business, and to imagine how they may bring up future kids?  Why would I even do that lol.  Like I said, I just shut down if someone asks me this.. and make excuses to  to find someone with a bit more depth of character to talk to

Not everyone gets the same opportunities in life and I always bear that in mind. Someone in a well paid job would get equal respect to someone in a minimum wage job. Society is so wrapped up in this. Because we have been influenced to be - to bear the weight of someones entire existence on what job they currently do.  Very shallow.  Everything you say, you have been influenced and conditioned to think that a decent job = status = a great person - a fantastic life -  a fantastic future parent.  It is all influence.  

Just because one is in a great job, doesn't mean you are a decent person and vice versa.  Look at the biggest mass murderer in British History - a well respected GP. My point being that likewise there are persons who have held jobs as Caretakers and murdered children.  Job titles have no bearing on the type of person one is

Just because one is a well paid job doesn't mean they aren't stressed out to the max with the pressures, and are deeply miserable going home to take stress out on their family and suffering mental health.   

The whole 'living in London' thing you mention - I don't get why that is such a big draw either, but they have been influenced to think the big smoke is the best place to be.  In fact is almost like brain washing when there are so many better options available.

Human beings were not physically built for the work days we have.  Ten hours sitting at a desk.  The human body and mind is still mostly the same as it was when Humans were hunter gatherers.  

We disagree and there is no talking to you. You have your own point of view I have mine.

And it's all of topic.

Whoever wants to spend whatever amount of money on their wedding is neither my business nor yours. Nor should we be judgemental over it. It isnt our money and it isnt our lives.

Gavin83

pickledonionspaceraider said:

Retireby40 said:

pickledonionspaceraider said:

Retireby40 said:

pickledonionspaceraider said:

Retireby40 said:

pickledonionspaceraider said:

Difference in generations I guess? I got wed far later in life than my parents

My parents were still teenagers when they got married in the early 70's. Moved in to a small rented bedsit, with the largest item they owned at that time,  being an ironing board. All 'housey'  wedding gifts were very very gratefully received by them.  Wedding presents they had were things like casserole dishes, crockery etc  They are still together, still very much in love, and now retired.  I am not sure if it was common for teenagers to be getting wed, at that time

Me and husband were in our mid 30s when we got wed.  We didn't need any house items, and requested no presents - although we did get some welcome cash gifts, which was lovely.  We did get a few traditional type presents, but not many

I try my best not to judge people, it's not always easy, i think being judgemental is human nature, but I do try and not be, as best as I can - but in all honesty I am not flawless, who is?

I wonder if society expectations have shifted.  The expectation on the young seems to be get a career, house and other stuff.  Not to get married too soon.  I mean these days you don't really hear of teenagers getting married (well I don't)

Think a big factor in that is that women no longer rely on men to provide a living for themselves meaning women can enjoy the freedom they maybe didnt have 50-100 years ago.

The whole need to rush to get married is outdated. Nowadays there isnt the stigma attached with living with a man and not being married. Also theres no longer that stigma of having a child without being married. It's easy to criticise aspects of this society but those above things are definately improvements.

Yes things have changed massively.  I think I have spoken on various occasions about this perhaps on this forum - about how that freedom comes with huge pressures. 

Pressures women put on themselves and each other, and societal pressures to have it all, (which to me, translates to: Run yourself ragged trying to juggle children, a 45 hour a week career, and a marriage, whilst being a 'home maker', and somehow fit time to go to the gym, and take care of yourself too ) .  It is not the norm for a lady to be a housewife (after children are in school)...After children are in school, at the latest, a woman is expected to pick up her career. 

Life is exhausting trying to do all these things. If this is freedom, it can go swivel. It feels more like a trap, when I look around and watch young mothers struggling.

and im not judging anyone else's choices, but life is far too hectic these days, and I am thinking we have got it all wrong. 

Like Heath Ledger once said, no one ever asks if you are happy.  You meet someone for the first time and one of the first things they ask is 'What do you do?'.....it is like a caste of judgement, if you have a degree founded job, then they are impressed by you, but if you are a street sweeper, they do not understand you.

But again that's down to choice what some people do. Not just women but also men. This idea that people have to have it all is a fault of society and one that we can choose to ignore.

If peoples insecurities and desires to keep up with the Jones makes their life difficult so be it. Its self inflicted.

Everyone in life has a choice how to live their life.

People generally ask "what you do" because by finding out that, you can find out many other things about a person. Plus it's a much less intense question as "are you happy". 

It is easy to underestimate the pressure that people put on each other and themselves 

I don't think it is right, but many  people seem obsessed by what others are doing on the internet. People like 'Influencers'  and Z list celebs have the brand that it all comes so easy to them.  It it wasn't so, these people would not become millionaires...and they are....there are a lot out there...blogging as I type - lifestyle advice.....it is everywhere, streaming on to every tablet, smart phone and laptop.  It is crazy - and I really dislike it.  But it is the way of the world now.  I am so glad I am not in my 20s these days

What else can be learned when asking a person what they do for a living?  Their social status, their education level, their income....all references of judgement.  I am not interested in that. If I get asked, I tell them I am a space cadet.  Then they laugh awkwardly and think I am weird, and move on to judge someone else

It is not such a free choice as you may think, as many households simply cannot live on one wage anymore...so there is the financial pressure also - which is much harder and closer to home, to ignore

I don't think the world is as free as you say it is.  

Again they choose to be "influenced". They choose to follow people. They choose to have Facebook or Instagram. That is a conscious choice so if it is having a negative impact its simple. Delete them.

What can be learned from someones profession? Education. Intelligence. Determination. Ambition. Work/life balance (do they work all weekend while you are off?) Salary (which is one of the least important things). Those things are very important.

Imagine you are a very self motivated person. Ambitious. Wanting to achieve the best you can and you meet someone who says yeah, I quit school at 16, bummed around and now I work in a factory on minimum wage. I've worked there 10 years and still on the same basic wage. What someone do can indicate their character and their outlook in life which can transfer into other areas in life.

If you have kids are they going to push them to do the best or the type of parents who dont really care. Give them a tablet to play on for an easy life.

It's not being judgemental. Its learning about what kind of person they have been in the past and how they have managed their life up to the point you meet them. Nothing to do with material goods. But personality.

Of course there is financial pressure. But again that is on the family as a whole. Not just the mother. And again this is the type of thing that needs to be assessed before kids and during the process of thinking about more. Many things can happen in life that you cant account for. But theres many people who cant even cope as a couple financially who then decide they have a given right to have children and then they struggle even more. 

Theres many families who live in a house they cant afford, drive a car or 2 they cant really afford, have I phones and full sky packages they cant afford, wear nice clothes and eat out once a week and cry that both parents have to work. I'm not talking about the genuine people who fall on hard times or who are stuck in a minimum wage job. I'm talking middle class. earning half decent money but living beyond their means.

London is a huge example of it. I know people who work and live in London because its London. They earn say 40k a year there. Cry they cant afford to buy/live/do anything. However when you suggest they take a job up North or in another part of the UK earning maybe 30k a year and having much more potential they say. Ppffftt I wouldnt move to Manchester or Belfast or Glasgow. London is where it is at.

I am sorry, but the whole 'what do you do for a living' question IS judgemental.  It's completely irrelevant upon first meeting someone. I'd rather know what type of person they are, the personality they have, are they kind to small animals, what hobbies, what interests.  All the rest of it - career wise - is none of my business, and to imagine how they may bring up future kids?  Why would I even do that lol.  Like I said, I just shut down if someone asks me this.. and make excuses to  to find someone with a bit more depth of character to talk to

So it's OK for you to judge people for asking this question but not OK for them to judge you for the job you have? Does that not just make you a hypocrite?

Honestly your post just makes it appear that you're the one with the hang ups here rather than society as a whole. Most people don't ask you what you do for a living to judge. Most people ask because it's a part of who you are. It's no different to asking if you have kids, what your hobbies are, where you live or any other standard question you'd ask someone to build a picture of who they are, or even just to fill an awkward silence.

If you're that embarrassed about what you do as a job I'd suggest you either look to better yourself until you're happy or you just get over it.

John_

pickledonionspaceraider said:

wymondham said:

 I wonder if the old saying still applies, the more you spend on the wedding the poorer the marriage (ie it'll be short!)….

No, Old sayings are just bitter and judgemental jabs - they aren't factual. 
Really old fashioned way of thinking.  Younger people are far more 'live and let live' now than they clearly were years ago.
Yes,  people do spend that much, and it is no one else's business....unless they are asked to fund it.

It isn't bonkers, it is their life - they don't need approval from anyone. 

Personally, if I had that kind of money to spend (and already had the house sorted) I would have a 5k wedding and a 15k honeymoon and go see the world.. well you have to dream

And of course, a good number of them will be finding it with debt, and then whining on about how their generation has it so hard and they can’t get on the housing ladder.
They’ll then look at people like me, who spent £300 on a wedding and live in a big Georgian townhouse in London and say that I ought to be taxed more to help them out.

Pollycat

John_ said:

pickledonionspaceraider said:

wymondham said:

 I wonder if the old saying still applies, the more you spend on the wedding the poorer the marriage (ie it'll be short!)….

No, Old sayings are just bitter and judgemental jabs - they aren't factual. 
Really old fashioned way of thinking.  Younger people are far more 'live and let live' now than they clearly were years ago.
Yes,  people do spend that much, and it is no one else's business....unless they are asked to fund it.

It isn't bonkers, it is their life - they don't need approval from anyone. 

Personally, if I had that kind of money to spend (and already had the house sorted) I would have a 5k wedding and a 15k honeymoon and go see the world.. well you have to dream

And of course, a good number of them will be finding it with debt, and then whining on about how their generation has it so hard and they can’t get on the housing ladder.
They’ll then look at people like me, who spent £300 on a wedding and live in a big Georgian townhouse in London and say that I ought to be taxed more to help them out.

Or maybe they'll just mind their own business.

Which is what we should be doing.

It's nobody else's business what anybody else spends their money on.

pickledonionspaceraider

R?  

Whoever wants to spend whatever amount of money on their wedding is neither my business nor yours. Nor should we be judgemental over it. It isnt our money and it isnt our lives.

Oh yes, I agree with that - as I said several pages ago - but we went off topic and haven't been discussing weddings.

happyandcontented

I agree we all have priorities, we had a big wedding 39 years ago, but we had saved for a house and a honeymoon as well. My parents helped out because they had had a rushed wedding during the war whilst my Dad was home on 2 weeks' leave and they wanted us to have the wedding they didn't have. It was a fantastic, memorable day.

One of my sons is getting married next year and their wedding will be c25k all paid for without debt. The Bride's parents are chipping in, as are we, and the couple themselves. They are early 30's, he is a Lawyer and she is a Barrister and they each have a house,  so why shouldn't they have the kind of wedding they want?

pickledonionspaceraider

Gavin83 said:

pickledonionspaceraider said:

Retireby40 said:

pickledonionspaceraider said:

Retireby40 said:

pickledonionspaceraider said:

Retireby40 said:

pickledonionspaceraider said:

Difference in generations I guess? I got wed far later in life than my parents

My parents were still teenagers when they got married in the early 70's. Moved in to a small rented bedsit, with the largest item they owned at that time,  being an ironing board. All 'housey'  wedding gifts were very very gratefully received by them.  Wedding presents they had were things like casserole dishes, crockery etc  They are still together, still very much in love, and now retired.  I am not sure if it was common for teenagers to be getting wed, at that time

Me and husband were in our mid 30s when we got wed.  We didn't need any house items, and requested no presents - although we did get some welcome cash gifts, which was lovely.  We did get a few traditional type presents, but not many

I try my best not to judge people, it's not always easy, i think being judgemental is human nature, but I do try and not be, as best as I can - but in all honesty I am not flawless, who is?

I wonder if society expectations have shifted.  The expectation on the young seems to be get a career, house and other stuff.  Not to get married too soon.  I mean these days you don't really hear of teenagers getting married (well I don't)

Think a big factor in that is that women no longer rely on men to provide a living for themselves meaning women can enjoy the freedom they maybe didnt have 50-100 years ago.

The whole need to rush to get married is outdated. Nowadays there isnt the stigma attached with living with a man and not being married. Also theres no longer that stigma of having a child without being married. It's easy to criticise aspects of this society but those above things are definately improvements.

Yes things have changed massively.  I think I have spoken on various occasions about this perhaps on this forum - about how that freedom comes with huge pressures. 

Pressures women put on themselves and each other, and societal pressures to have it all, (which to me, translates to: Run yourself ragged trying to juggle children, a 45 hour a week career, and a marriage, whilst being a 'home maker', and somehow fit time to go to the gym, and take care of yourself too ) .  It is not the norm for a lady to be a housewife (after children are in school)...After children are in school, at the latest, a woman is expected to pick up her career. 

Life is exhausting trying to do all these things. If this is freedom, it can go swivel. It feels more like a trap, when I look around and watch young mothers struggling.

and im not judging anyone else's choices, but life is far too hectic these days, and I am thinking we have got it all wrong. 

Like Heath Ledger once said, no one ever asks if you are happy.  You meet someone for the first time and one of the first things they ask is 'What do you do?'.....it is like a caste of judgement, if you have a degree founded job, then they are impressed by you, but if you are a street sweeper, they do not understand you.

But again that's down to choice what some people do. Not just women but also men. This idea that people have to have it all is a fault of society and one that we can choose to ignore.

If peoples insecurities and desires to keep up with the Jones makes their life difficult so be it. Its self inflicted.

Everyone in life has a choice how to live their life.

People generally ask "what you do" because by finding out that, you can find out many other things about a person. Plus it's a much less intense question as "are you happy". 

It is easy to underestimate the pressure that people put on each other and themselves 

I don't think it is right, but many  people seem obsessed by what others are doing on the internet. People like 'Influencers'  and Z list celebs have the brand that it all comes so easy to them.  It it wasn't so, these people would not become millionaires...and they are....there are a lot out there...blogging as I type - lifestyle advice.....it is everywhere, streaming on to every tablet, smart phone and laptop.  It is crazy - and I really dislike it.  But it is the way of the world now.  I am so glad I am not in my 20s these days

What else can be learned when asking a person what they do for a living?  Their social status, their education level, their income....all references of judgement.  I am not interested in that. If I get asked, I tell them I am a space cadet.  Then they laugh awkwardly and think I am weird, and move on to judge someone else

It is not such a free choice as you may think, as many households simply cannot live on one wage anymore...so there is the financial pressure also - which is much harder and closer to home, to ignore

I don't think the world is as free as you say it is.  

Again they choose to be "influenced". They choose to follow people. They choose to have Facebook or Instagram. That is a conscious choice so if it is having a negative impact its simple. Delete them.

What can be learned from someones profession? Education. Intelligence. Determination. Ambition. Work/life balance (do they work all weekend while you are off?) Salary (which is one of the least important things). Those things are very important.

Imagine you are a very self motivated person. Ambitious. Wanting to achieve the best you can and you meet someone who says yeah, I quit school at 16, bummed around and now I work in a factory on minimum wage. I've worked there 10 years and still on the same basic wage. What someone do can indicate their character and their outlook in life which can transfer into other areas in life.

If you have kids are they going to push them to do the best or the type of parents who dont really care. Give them a tablet to play on for an easy life.

It's not being judgemental. Its learning about what kind of person they have been in the past and how they have managed their life up to the point you meet them. Nothing to do with material goods. But personality.

Of course there is financial pressure. But again that is on the family as a whole. Not just the mother. And again this is the type of thing that needs to be assessed before kids and during the process of thinking about more. Many things can happen in life that you cant account for. But theres many people who cant even cope as a couple financially who then decide they have a given right to have children and then they struggle even more. 

Theres many families who live in a house they cant afford, drive a car or 2 they cant really afford, have I phones and full sky packages they cant afford, wear nice clothes and eat out once a week and cry that both parents have to work. I'm not talking about the genuine people who fall on hard times or who are stuck in a minimum wage job. I'm talking middle class. earning half decent money but living beyond their means.

London is a huge example of it. I know people who work and live in London because its London. They earn say 40k a year there. Cry they cant afford to buy/live/do anything. However when you suggest they take a job up North or in another part of the UK earning maybe 30k a year and having much more potential they say. Ppffftt I wouldnt move to Manchester or Belfast or Glasgow. London is where it is at.

I am sorry, but the whole 'what do you do for a living' question IS judgemental.  It's completely irrelevant upon first meeting someone. I'd rather know what type of person they are, the personality they have, are they kind to small animals, what hobbies, what interests.  All the rest of it - career wise - is none of my business, and to imagine how they may bring up future kids?  Why would I even do that lol.  Like I said, I just shut down if someone asks me this.. and make excuses to  to find someone with a bit more depth of character to talk to

So it's OK for you to judge people for asking this question but not OK for them to judge you for the job you have? Does that not just make you a hypocrite?

Honestly your post just makes it appear that you're the one with the hang ups here rather than society as a whole. Most people don't ask you what you do for a living to judge. Most people ask because it's a part of who you are. It's no different to asking if you have kids, what your hobbies are, where you live or any other standard question you'd ask someone to build a picture of who they are, or even just to fill an awkward silence.

If you're that embarrassed about what you do as a job I'd suggest you either look to better yourself until you're happy or you just get over it.

I decided not to bother to post a proper response to this as you aren't worth the effort.

Gavin83

pickledonionspaceraider said:

Gavin83 said:

pickledonionspaceraider said:

Retireby40 said:

pickledonionspaceraider said:

Retireby40 said:

pickledonionspaceraider said:

Retireby40 said:

pickledonionspaceraider said:

Difference in generations I guess? I got wed far later in life than my parents

My parents were still teenagers when they got married in the early 70's. Moved in to a small rented bedsit, with the largest item they owned at that time,  being an ironing board. All 'housey'  wedding gifts were very very gratefully received by them.  Wedding presents they had were things like casserole dishes, crockery etc  They are still together, still very much in love, and now retired.  I am not sure if it was common for teenagers to be getting wed, at that time

Me and husband were in our mid 30s when we got wed.  We didn't need any house items, and requested no presents - although we did get some welcome cash gifts, which was lovely.  We did get a few traditional type presents, but not many

I try my best not to judge people, it's not always easy, i think being judgemental is human nature, but I do try and not be, as best as I can - but in all honesty I am not flawless, who is?

I wonder if society expectations have shifted.  The expectation on the young seems to be get a career, house and other stuff.  Not to get married too soon.  I mean these days you don't really hear of teenagers getting married (well I don't)

Think a big factor in that is that women no longer rely on men to provide a living for themselves meaning women can enjoy the freedom they maybe didnt have 50-100 years ago.

The whole need to rush to get married is outdated. Nowadays there isnt the stigma attached with living with a man and not being married. Also theres no longer that stigma of having a child without being married. It's easy to criticise aspects of this society but those above things are definately improvements.

Yes things have changed massively.  I think I have spoken on various occasions about this perhaps on this forum - about how that freedom comes with huge pressures. 

Pressures women put on themselves and each other, and societal pressures to have it all, (which to me, translates to: Run yourself ragged trying to juggle children, a 45 hour a week career, and a marriage, whilst being a 'home maker', and somehow fit time to go to the gym, and take care of yourself too ) .  It is not the norm for a lady to be a housewife (after children are in school)...After children are in school, at the latest, a woman is expected to pick up her career. 

Life is exhausting trying to do all these things. If this is freedom, it can go swivel. It feels more like a trap, when I look around and watch young mothers struggling.

and im not judging anyone else's choices, but life is far too hectic these days, and I am thinking we have got it all wrong. 

Like Heath Ledger once said, no one ever asks if you are happy.  You meet someone for the first time and one of the first things they ask is 'What do you do?'.....it is like a caste of judgement, if you have a degree founded job, then they are impressed by you, but if you are a street sweeper, they do not understand you.

But again that's down to choice what some people do. Not just women but also men. This idea that people have to have it all is a fault of society and one that we can choose to ignore.

If peoples insecurities and desires to keep up with the Jones makes their life difficult so be it. Its self inflicted.

Everyone in life has a choice how to live their life.

People generally ask "what you do" because by finding out that, you can find out many other things about a person. Plus it's a much less intense question as "are you happy". 

It is easy to underestimate the pressure that people put on each other and themselves 

I don't think it is right, but many  people seem obsessed by what others are doing on the internet. People like 'Influencers'  and Z list celebs have the brand that it all comes so easy to them.  It it wasn't so, these people would not become millionaires...and they are....there are a lot out there...blogging as I type - lifestyle advice.....it is everywhere, streaming on to every tablet, smart phone and laptop.  It is crazy - and I really dislike it.  But it is the way of the world now.  I am so glad I am not in my 20s these days

What else can be learned when asking a person what they do for a living?  Their social status, their education level, their income....all references of judgement.  I am not interested in that. If I get asked, I tell them I am a space cadet.  Then they laugh awkwardly and think I am weird, and move on to judge someone else

It is not such a free choice as you may think, as many households simply cannot live on one wage anymore...so there is the financial pressure also - which is much harder and closer to home, to ignore

I don't think the world is as free as you say it is.  

Again they choose to be "influenced". They choose to follow people. They choose to have Facebook or Instagram. That is a conscious choice so if it is having a negative impact its simple. Delete them.

What can be learned from someones profession? Education. Intelligence. Determination. Ambition. Work/life balance (do they work all weekend while you are off?) Salary (which is one of the least important things). Those things are very important.

Imagine you are a very self motivated person. Ambitious. Wanting to achieve the best you can and you meet someone who says yeah, I quit school at 16, bummed around and now I work in a factory on minimum wage. I've worked there 10 years and still on the same basic wage. What someone do can indicate their character and their outlook in life which can transfer into other areas in life.

If you have kids are they going to push them to do the best or the type of parents who dont really care. Give them a tablet to play on for an easy life.

It's not being judgemental. Its learning about what kind of person they have been in the past and how they have managed their life up to the point you meet them. Nothing to do with material goods. But personality.

Of course there is financial pressure. But again that is on the family as a whole. Not just the mother. And again this is the type of thing that needs to be assessed before kids and during the process of thinking about more. Many things can happen in life that you cant account for. But theres many people who cant even cope as a couple financially who then decide they have a given right to have children and then they struggle even more. 

Theres many families who live in a house they cant afford, drive a car or 2 they cant really afford, have I phones and full sky packages they cant afford, wear nice clothes and eat out once a week and cry that both parents have to work. I'm not talking about the genuine people who fall on hard times or who are stuck in a minimum wage job. I'm talking middle class. earning half decent money but living beyond their means.

London is a huge example of it. I know people who work and live in London because its London. They earn say 40k a year there. Cry they cant afford to buy/live/do anything. However when you suggest they take a job up North or in another part of the UK earning maybe 30k a year and having much more potential they say. Ppffftt I wouldnt move to Manchester or Belfast or Glasgow. London is where it is at.

I am sorry, but the whole 'what do you do for a living' question IS judgemental.  It's completely irrelevant upon first meeting someone. I'd rather know what type of person they are, the personality they have, are they kind to small animals, what hobbies, what interests.  All the rest of it - career wise - is none of my business, and to imagine how they may bring up future kids?  Why would I even do that lol.  Like I said, I just shut down if someone asks me this.. and make excuses to  to find someone with a bit more depth of character to talk to

So it's OK for you to judge people for asking this question but not OK for them to judge you for the job you have? Does that not just make you a hypocrite?

Honestly your post just makes it appear that you're the one with the hang ups here rather than society as a whole. Most people don't ask you what you do for a living to judge. Most people ask because it's a part of who you are. It's no different to asking if you have kids, what your hobbies are, where you live or any other standard question you'd ask someone to build a picture of who they are, or even just to fill an awkward silence.

If you're that embarrassed about what you do as a job I'd suggest you either look to better yourself until you're happy or you just get over it.

I decided not to bother to post a proper response to this as you aren't worth the effort.

Yet you decided it was worth the effort of posting this. Thanks, appreciate it.

pickledonionspaceraider

Gavin83 said:

pickledonionspaceraider said:

Gavin83 said:

pickledonionspaceraider said:

Retireby40 said:

pickledonionspaceraider said:

Retireby40 said:

pickledonionspaceraider said:

Retireby40 said:

pickledonionspaceraider said:

Difference in generations I guess? I got wed far later in life than my parents

My parents were still teenagers when they got married in the early 70's. Moved in to a small rented bedsit, with the largest item they owned at that time,  being an ironing board. All 'housey'  wedding gifts were very very gratefully received by them.  Wedding presents they had were things like casserole dishes, crockery etc  They are still together, still very much in love, and now retired.  I am not sure if it was common for teenagers to be getting wed, at that time

Me and husband were in our mid 30s when we got wed.  We didn't need any house items, and requested no presents - although we did get some welcome cash gifts, which was lovely.  We did get a few traditional type presents, but not many

I try my best not to judge people, it's not always easy, i think being judgemental is human nature, but I do try and not be, as best as I can - but in all honesty I am not flawless, who is?

I wonder if society expectations have shifted.  The expectation on the young seems to be get a career, house and other stuff.  Not to get married too soon.  I mean these days you don't really hear of teenagers getting married (well I don't)

Think a big factor in that is that women no longer rely on men to provide a living for themselves meaning women can enjoy the freedom they maybe didnt have 50-100 years ago.

The whole need to rush to get married is outdated. Nowadays there isnt the stigma attached with living with a man and not being married. Also theres no longer that stigma of having a child without being married. It's easy to criticise aspects of this society but those above things are definately improvements.

Yes things have changed massively.  I think I have spoken on various occasions about this perhaps on this forum - about how that freedom comes with huge pressures. 

Pressures women put on themselves and each other, and societal pressures to have it all, (which to me, translates to: Run yourself ragged trying to juggle children, a 45 hour a week career, and a marriage, whilst being a 'home maker', and somehow fit time to go to the gym, and take care of yourself too ) .  It is not the norm for a lady to be a housewife (after children are in school)...After children are in school, at the latest, a woman is expected to pick up her career. 

Life is exhausting trying to do all these things. If this is freedom, it can go swivel. It feels more like a trap, when I look around and watch young mothers struggling.

and im not judging anyone else's choices, but life is far too hectic these days, and I am thinking we have got it all wrong. 

Like Heath Ledger once said, no one ever asks if you are happy.  You meet someone for the first time and one of the first things they ask is 'What do you do?'.....it is like a caste of judgement, if you have a degree founded job, then they are impressed by you, but if you are a street sweeper, they do not understand you.

But again that's down to choice what some people do. Not just women but also men. This idea that people have to have it all is a fault of society and one that we can choose to ignore.

If peoples insecurities and desires to keep up with the Jones makes their life difficult so be it. Its self inflicted.

Everyone in life has a choice how to live their life.

People generally ask "what you do" because by finding out that, you can find out many other things about a person. Plus it's a much less intense question as "are you happy". 

It is easy to underestimate the pressure that people put on each other and themselves 

I don't think it is right, but many  people seem obsessed by what others are doing on the internet. People like 'Influencers'  and Z list celebs have the brand that it all comes so easy to them.  It it wasn't so, these people would not become millionaires...and they are....there are a lot out there...blogging as I type - lifestyle advice.....it is everywhere, streaming on to every tablet, smart phone and laptop.  It is crazy - and I really dislike it.  But it is the way of the world now.  I am so glad I am not in my 20s these days

What else can be learned when asking a person what they do for a living?  Their social status, their education level, their income....all references of judgement.  I am not interested in that. If I get asked, I tell them I am a space cadet.  Then they laugh awkwardly and think I am weird, and move on to judge someone else

It is not such a free choice as you may think, as many households simply cannot live on one wage anymore...so there is the financial pressure also - which is much harder and closer to home, to ignore

I don't think the world is as free as you say it is.  

Again they choose to be "influenced". They choose to follow people. They choose to have Facebook or Instagram. That is a conscious choice so if it is having a negative impact its simple. Delete them.

What can be learned from someones profession? Education. Intelligence. Determination. Ambition. Work/life balance (do they work all weekend while you are off?) Salary (which is one of the least important things). Those things are very important.

Imagine you are a very self motivated person. Ambitious. Wanting to achieve the best you can and you meet someone who says yeah, I quit school at 16, bummed around and now I work in a factory on minimum wage. I've worked there 10 years and still on the same basic wage. What someone do can indicate their character and their outlook in life which can transfer into other areas in life.

If you have kids are they going to push them to do the best or the type of parents who dont really care. Give them a tablet to play on for an easy life.

It's not being judgemental. Its learning about what kind of person they have been in the past and how they have managed their life up to the point you meet them. Nothing to do with material goods. But personality.

Of course there is financial pressure. But again that is on the family as a whole. Not just the mother. And again this is the type of thing that needs to be assessed before kids and during the process of thinking about more. Many things can happen in life that you cant account for. But theres many people who cant even cope as a couple financially who then decide they have a given right to have children and then they struggle even more. 

Theres many families who live in a house they cant afford, drive a car or 2 they cant really afford, have I phones and full sky packages they cant afford, wear nice clothes and eat out once a week and cry that both parents have to work. I'm not talking about the genuine people who fall on hard times or who are stuck in a minimum wage job. I'm talking middle class. earning half decent money but living beyond their means.

London is a huge example of it. I know people who work and live in London because its London. They earn say 40k a year there. Cry they cant afford to buy/live/do anything. However when you suggest they take a job up North or in another part of the UK earning maybe 30k a year and having much more potential they say. Ppffftt I wouldnt move to Manchester or Belfast or Glasgow. London is where it is at.

I am sorry, but the whole 'what do you do for a living' question IS judgemental.  It's completely irrelevant upon first meeting someone. I'd rather know what type of person they are, the personality they have, are they kind to small animals, what hobbies, what interests.  All the rest of it - career wise - is none of my business, and to imagine how they may bring up future kids?  Why would I even do that lol.  Like I said, I just shut down if someone asks me this.. and make excuses to  to find someone with a bit more depth of character to talk to

So it's OK for you to judge people for asking this question but not OK for them to judge you for the job you have? Does that not just make you a hypocrite?

Honestly your post just makes it appear that you're the one with the hang ups here rather than society as a whole. Most people don't ask you what you do for a living to judge. Most people ask because it's a part of who you are. It's no different to asking if you have kids, what your hobbies are, where you live or any other standard question you'd ask someone to build a picture of who they are, or even just to fill an awkward silence.

If you're that embarrassed about what you do as a job I'd suggest you either look to better yourself until you're happy or you just get over it.

I decided not to bother to post a proper response to this as you aren't worth the effort.

Yet you decided it was worth the effort of posting this. Thanks, appreciate it.

Well I appreciate your appreciated-ness.   I hope you are having a wonderful day

joyce_150

The old saying may be right and may be wrong at some point. I think it is still more on priorities.