I know, You've heard it all before. More CCJ angst

Le_Kirk

It would explain why the papers went to the wrong address; whether the judge will accept it or not is up to judge bingo.  You are supposed to chase DVLA if you don't hear back in two weeks after submitting change of ownership/sale of car forms.

henrik777

If you're arguing defective service and a mandatory set aside you DO NOT want costs reserved. If successful you want the costs as you've successfully argued they were at fault and winners get costs.

Greenwich2019

Many thanks again,
Hopefully I get a "good" judge Le_Kirk. I would hate to think I am stuck with these CCJs ☹️.
Henrik777 would you suggest after correcting the costs reserved issue and adding the reason why the address was wrong on the car docs that I move on to the defence?
Thanks again.

Greenwich2019

I wonder how point #17 taken from at Coupon Mads most recent and up to date template defence should be tackled in respect of the original violation being completely unknown due to everything being served at a previous address.
If a CCJ set aside is successful then the defence document would come in to play and thus anything stated in #17 would, in the event of the case being contested would need to be relied on.
As no details are known, would it be better to leave this blank as lots of generic signage and over charging elements have been dealt with elsewhere in the template?

Coupon-mad

I would put in #17 that the facts of the event, location, date, contract,claim particulars and cause of action are completely unknown due to everything being served at a previous address and the Defendant requires a copy of the Claim form and further particulars, and reserves the right (once full particulars and evidence is furnished) to cover the facts in a witness statement before the hearing about the claim itself.

nosferatu1001

As above, you make part of yor Draft Order that, once they serve full and detailed Particulars of Claim, including a copy of any purported contract, you will file and serve an Amended Defence within 14 days. 

D_P_Dance

 You are supposed to chase DVLA if you don't hear back in two weeks after submitting change of ownership/sale of car forms.

But does anyone do so?

Greenwich2019

Thank you for this. I am using the template and then stating in the defence that I am unaware of other elements.

Greenwich2019

So, bit of an update.......these rotters have finally contacted me. I paid for 2 X hearings to get the CCJs set aside.....I submitted all the documents based on the help I have been given here. I also asked CEL the opportunity to agree to a set aside......obviously they never got back to me so all payments have been made to the court and copies sent to CEL.
CEL sent me documentation that they held about me way past the GDPR deadline and NOT in relation to my old address despite me specifically asking for data in relation to that address. All I got from them related to my current address! Mistake ? Who knows?
I have now requested they fixed the GDPR "error" they made and furnish me with EVERYTHING they hold on me. I have not received that information but they did write to me to say they would now agree to a set aside...but only if I pay x amount of money. Thus offer only related to one of the alleged contraventions. So I wrote back to tell them this related to only do I could not evenceven the  offer even if I wanted to.
Today I have received a further short letter stating their offer covers both alleged offences. This letter is very short on detail and as usual has no meaningful  meaningfuldetails I could use to contact this company other than their address.
What this letter did tell me was the address of the car park where the alleged contraventions took place. Both the same car park. I have noted MSE experts have assisted a motorist here with that exact carpark and CEL backed down.
So, essentially that is where I am. I have been dealing with some personal issues (medical) which have put this on the back burner but it is now back in the forefront of my mind.
Currently I have 2 questions....
1. Should I accept CELs offer of two agreed set asides? If so, how go I contact the court to explain my request for contested set asides no longer stands and I would like to reapply for  2 agreed set asides? Or should I just go for broke at this stage?

2. This second question related to Covid-19. Is my request for hearing more likely to be kicked out due to a back log at the court? I really hope not but I have a niggling suspicion anything remotely "not in the timeframe" or "incomplete" may be knocked back as a matter of course.

Sorry for the length of this. I hope the update has been useful for those fighting CEL and many thanks to all those that have helped me to even get to this stage! Henrick777, Coupon-Mad & noseferatoo1001 in particular.

Hope everyone is well & staying safe.

Coupon-mad

Currently I have 2 questions....
1. Should I accept CELs offer of two agreed set asides? If so, how go I contact the court to explain my request for contested set asides no longer stands and I would like to reapply for  2 agreed set asides?

No.  You will end up £510 out of pocket to the court and £500 or more out of pocket to CEL with no guarantee that they will actually sign consent to set aside (CEL have been known to demand £600-odd then just mark CCJs as 'satisfied', leaving them to ruin the person's credit anyway).

 Or should I just go for broke at this stage?

Yes.

2. This second question related to Covid-19. Is my request for hearing more likely to be kicked out due to a back log at the court? I really hope not but I have a niggling suspicion anything remotely "not in the timeframe" or "incomplete" may be knocked back as a matter of course.

I suspect you might get offered a telephone hearing (insist on one for both claims) but it depends on your court.  I think a telephone hearing for a set aside application is do-able because your job is merely to show that the critieria for setting aside a CCJ has been met and satisfy the Judge that you will have reasonable prospects of success in defending the claims if they proceed after set aside.   

Make sure you ask for your costs to be 'reserved' and 'awarded' if the Claimant should discontinue after the set aside, and whether the court might refund part of the fee if there is just one hearing because £510 is a huge sum to pay for one remote hearing!

DON'T forget or be too scared to ask for your costs to be reserved, because CEL's claims are both an abuse of process and the fact they filed two separate claims has caused you double cost, and the fact they used an old address and have been breaching the GDPR with the data they have so far withheld, is 'unreasonable conduct' that you want to be examined at the main hearing, and not to be left £510 out of pocket if CEL do their usual disappearing act & discontiue and hope to get off without any award for costs against them, after set aside.

Have a look at the telephone hearings thread, page 10, specifically the list bargepole posted about which courts are doing what right now.  You could always email your court and ask for progress and remind them that the facts are the same so one single hearing is all that is needed for both set asides, and that you would consider a telephone hearing for the set aside application (but not for the main hearing if the claimant doesn't discontinue, as they often do).