legal advice for being taken to a small claims court needed!!

kandy22

I'm being taken to small claims court by my ex house mate.
On the 2nd December 2019 I received a letter of my ex house mate via court proceedings, this was a claim form from the county court business centre.
I moved into their house which they had been living there solo for 6 months. I went into the spare bedroom with my own belongings.

the total amount was for £374.42 that was being claimed for by my ex house mate
I replied only accepting some of the balance and that I wanted to dispute the rest. The break down for the amount for the claim is:

£275 for rent from 5th of the month to 28th from when I first moved in to the house. I paid on the 28th of the month £350, this was the agreed amount for rent and bills. The claim against me says I should of paid £275 in advance when I moved in to the property on the 5th as rent was paid for the month in advance.
I didn't end up going on the tenancy agreement until after a I moved in (October officially) as I could not afford the £240 admin fee at the time (I was very broke at the time and had outstanding bills from a house I had bought with a ex-girlfriend, I left that house after finding out she was cheating on me)

£22 for a internet bill. We discussed changing internet provider in February to somebody I had a account with. At the time the account I had was in arrears so if I kept my account I only had to pay £200. So we agreed to change from there internet provider to mine when the current internet contract was up in (April) providing I could find missing wires for the router which I could not provide in the end so therefore we did not switch. I have a message of them stating either way they where going to change the internet provider at the end of the contract to find a cheaper option. they kept the same provider and the normal £29 bill went up to £51 for a month. in their message to me they ask me to pay the difference from the usual £29 to the £51 which amounts to £22. I'm unclear as to how this is all my charge?

£40 for admin fees. The total was £240. I paid £200 last year with the £40 still outstanding. I genuinely thought I had paid this but I cant find any evidence I did so I have admitted I need to pay this. since I have admitted to this when do I need to pay this? I can't see a date it needs to be paid by but my ex house mate states I missed the deadline of 29th January, where would they have found this out as I wasn't aware?

I sent a letter to my ex house mate asking for a copy of the bills for the property from my move in and move out date. I wanted a break down of what it was I had to pay for my stay there. I was always under the impression that it was a house share and it should be 50/50. sadly none of the bills where in my name so I can not access any of this information myself. we exchanged messages where I agree to pay a flat rate of £350 which should apparently cover a decrease in gas etc for summer and a increase for gas etc in the winter.
I received a reply to this yesterday and the letter states..
"Unfortunately, this information is not relevant to the case at hand, as you agreed, verbally and in writing, to pay the sum of £350 per month, and later £365 per month for your stay.

In return for this amount, I took on the administration and responsibility of running the house, dealt with landlord, liaised with estate agents, settled the bills, purchased all of the essential products, such as toilet paper, kitchen rolls and cleaning equipment and provided amenities such as the fridge, washing machine, dryer and furniture"

We where in a house share, in the house they agreed to rent solo before I ever moved in. There for very unfair of them to state that they provided the amenities that of course where already in the property when I moved in. I furnished my own room and clearly I could not of provided any amenities myself for the house. If I decided to provide any this would be deemed silly really as it would be very unnecessary. they never stated there disproval or that this would be covered under the rental amount. they also state that they took on responsibility of running the house, dealt with the landlord and liaised with the estate agents, again they agreed on the house solo before I was ever moving in so naturally this was already in hand and also unfair to now state this was part of my rental amount to them. Along with purchasing cleaning equipment, toilet roll and kitchen roll, to be frank the house was never cleaned by them and there cats litter tray was often over flowing. I did my own washing, washed up if I ever cooked and kept my room clean and tidy which for most of the time is where I was when I was at home. Myself and my partner cleaned the house often, as a prime example to my commitment to our house share would be the time me and my partner planned to go away for 2 week. I spent the first week away from home then returned to prepare for a camping trip to be greeted by the absolute mess them and there partner had left behind, dirty plates and a over flowing bin with maggots. The 2nd week of my holiday was cancelled due to there being as gas leak at the property so I had to remain home as much as I physically could. At this point me and my partner cleaned all of the house to which they where rude and very unwelcoming towards my partner about this (They sent a apology message to my partner) At this point I'm now unsure if they wanted me to clean up or not? It was my understanding that we where in a house share and rental and bills would be 50/50 so for them to try and claim that my rental amount included compensation for the above I find lodicule and this is why I felt it would be very relevant for a copy of all bill amounts for my stay. I owe 50% of the bills not 50% plus what they deem extra for there "troubles".

where do I stand with requesting this information? do I have any rights to it? I've read as the bills where in there name I'm legally not responsible for them but would this stand up in small claims court without a legal repensetive?

they have screen shots of most messages to surport there evidence. at a few points I said I would set a oayment plan up for the sake of the friendship but i'm so broke most months I just couldn't afford to do so. I'm now a bit better off and I can now afford to give them some money each month but i'm so annoyed they are taking me to small claims I want to fight it. If I don't have a leg to stand on I'll pay but I feel now they have destoried are friendship.

any advise would be greatly appreicatited, I can not afford legal help and ive been to citziens advise who could not offer me any help.

NewShadow

I don't think I can be much help, but my first reaction is to ask why you're liable for the increased cost of the internet if your £360pm included all bills, or is it only utility bills?

Who is your landlord/who did you pay money to?

Did you sign any form of contract - if so, what does your contract say re liability for bills and what you were due to pay/when?

Alternatively, what was agreed in writing re your liability to pay and what was agreed in writing to be included in this amount?

Did you pay for all months you were in occupancy - i.e. your former housemate states you were paying in arrears rather than in advance. If this is the case, did you make a last payment when you moved out/to cover from the day you moved in until your last day?

How did you pay - cash, bank transfer - can you get records to prove what you paid and when, cross checking against when monies were due?

G_M

[QUOTE=kandy22;76792721...
I moved into their house which they had been living there solo for 6 months. I went into the spare bedroom with my own belongings.
you were a lodger?
the total amount was for £374.42 that was being claimed for by my ex house mate
I replied only accepting some of the balance and that I wanted to dispute the rest. The break down for the amount for the claim is:

£275 for rent from 5th of the month to 28th from when I first moved in to the house. I paid on the 28th of the month £350, this was the agreed amount for rent and bills. The claim against me says I should of paid £275 in advance when I moved in to the property on the 5th as rent was paid for the month in advance.


So the rent was £350.
You moved in on 5th (of ?) but paid no rent till 28th.
So you owe from 5th to 18th: £11.50 pd x 23 days = £264.65

I didn't end up going on the tenancy agreement until after a I moved in (October officially) as I could not afford the £240 admin fee at the time (I was very broke at the time and had outstanding bills from a house I had bought with a ex-girlfriend, I left that house after finding out she was cheating on me)
Very unclear.
Date you moved in = 5th of what month?
Date you paid rent as lodger - 28th of what month?
Date you 'went on the tenancy'? So on that date you and housemate became joint tenants?

£22 for a internet bill. We discussed changing internet provider in February to somebody I had a account with. At the time the account I had was in arrears so if I kept my account I only had to pay £200. So we agreed to change from there internet provider to mine when the current internet contract was up in (April) providing I could find missing wires for the router which I could not provide in the end so therefore we did not switch.
So this is all irrelevant

I have a message of them stating either way they where going to change the internet provider at the end of the contract to find a cheaper option. they kept the same provider and the normal £29 bill went up to £51 for a month. in their message to me they ask me to pay the difference from the usual £29 to the £51 which amounts to £22. I'm unclear as to how this is all my charge?
I asume you have to pay 50% of the internet charges.

How much were the total charges, per month, from the date you moved in?
How much have you paid?
What is the difference between what you owe and what you paid?


£40 for admin fees. The total was £240. I paid £200 last year with the £40 still outstanding.
Admin fees due to who? The housemate? The property landlord from when you became a joint tenant?

I genuinely thought I had paid this but I cant find any evidence I did so I have admitted I need to pay this. since I have admitted to this when do I need to pay this?
ASAP!
I can't see a date it needs to be paid by but my ex house mate states I missed the deadline of 29th January, where would they have found this out as I wasn't aware?
You should have paid this when it was first demanded. Or as soon as possibleafter that.

I sent a letter to my ex house mate asking for a copy of the bills for the property from my move in and move out date. I wanted a break down of what it was I had to pay for my stay there. I was always under the impression that it was a house share and it should be 50/50.
It is stillnot clear if you were a lodger - your housemate was your landlord, or a joint tenant - the property owner was your landlord.
You said earlier you 'went on the tenancy agreement'. Plase clarify.

sadly none of the bills where in my name so I can not access any of this information myself. we exchanged messages where I agree to pay a flat rate of £350 which should apparently cover a decrease in gas etc for summer and a increase for gas etc in the winter.
If you have doubts about the utility bills, write to the account holder (your housemate) asking for a copy of the bills.

I received a reply to this yesterday and the letter states..
"Unfortunately, this information is not relevant to the case at hand, as you agreed, verbally and in writing, to pay the sum of £350 per month, and later £365 per month for your stay.
Well, did you agree this?

In return for this amount, I took on the administration and responsibility of running the house, dealt with landlord, liaised with estate agents, settled the bills, purchased all of the essential products, such as toilet paper, kitchen rolls and cleaning equipment and provided amenities such as the fridge, washing machine, dryer and furniture"
So you agreed to pay an extra £15 pm in order to cover your housemate's extra financial and administrative responsibility? Did you agree? In writing?

We where in a house share, in the house they agreed to rent solo before I ever moved in. There for very unfair of them to state that they provided the amenities that of course where already in the property when I moved in. I furnished my own room and clearly I could not of provided any amenities myself for the house. If I decided to provide any this would be deemed silly really as it would be very unnecessary. they never stated there disproval or that this would be covered under the rental amount. they also state that they took on responsibility of running the house, dealt with the landlord and liaised with the estate agents, again they agreed on the house solo before I was ever moving in so naturally this was already in hand and also unfair to now state this was part of my rental amount to them. Along with purchasing cleaning equipment, toilet roll and kitchen roll, to be frank the house was never cleaned by them and there cats litter tray was often over flowing. I did my own washing, washed up if I ever cooked and kept my room clean and tidy which for most of the time is where I was when I was at home. Myself and my partner cleaned the house often, as a prime example to my commitment to our house share would be the time me and my partner planned to go away for 2 week. I spent the first week away from home then returned to prepare for a camping trip to be greeted by the absolute mess them and there partner had left behind, dirty plates and a over flowing bin with maggots. The 2nd week of my holiday was cancelled due to there being as gas leak at the property so I had to remain home as much as I physically could. At this point me and my partner cleaned all of the house to which they where rude and very unwelcoming towards my partner about this (They sent a apology message to my partner) At this point I'm now unsure if they wanted me to clean up or not?
All irrelevant. All that matters is
* what rent was agreed
* what arrangement for bills was agreed (utilities, council tax, consumables etc)

It was my understanding that we where in a house share and rental and bills would be 50/50 so for them to try and claim that my rental amount included compensation for the above I find lodicule and this is why I felt it would be very relevant for a copy of all bill amounts for my stay. I owe 50% of the bills not 50% plus what they deem extra for there "troubles".
Either you agreed the extra £15 or you did not. Which?

where do I stand with requesting this information? do I have any rights to it? I've read as the bills where in there name I'm legally not responsible for them but would this stand up in small claims court without a legal repensetive?
You can put in your defense that you were never given sight of the bills.

they have screen shots of most messages to surport there evidence. at a few points I said I would set a oayment plan up for the sake of the friendship but i'm so broke most months I just couldn't afford to do so. I'm now a bit better off and I can now afford to give them some money each month but i'm so annoyed they are taking me to small claims I want to fight it. If I don't have a leg to stand on I'll pay but I feel now they have destoried are friendship.
Clearly.

any advise would be greatly appreicatited, I can not afford legal help and ive been to citziens advise who could not offer me any help.[/QUOTE]
You need to work out exactly what you really owe.
Not what you think is 'fair', but what you actually agreed to.

If you offer to pay what you owe, and the housemate accepts this, the court case will end.
If the housemate disagrees with what youoffer, you need to enter a defense and the judge will decide.
You need to put in writing a clear breakdown of what you have paid, what the contract says you should have paid, as wellas stating you've never seen any utility bills.

I'm still unclear if you were a lodger or tenant - please clarify.

kandy22

It was agreed i paid a set price of £350 per month that included rent and all bills includeig internet

I paid the money to my house mate who then in turn paid the estate agents who paid the landlord

I signed a tenancy agreement for the house with the estate agents in October

the message from my house mate reads "are you okay to set up a standing order for £350? was just thinking that in summer gas will be less and winter it will be more, but at £350 it should balance for both, so there's no need to mess around changing it each month"

I did not pay from the 5th August to the 28th August 2018 when I first moved in according to her records. I made my last payment to her for September 2019 rent on the 28th August 2019.

I paid her via Bank transfers my first payment was on the 28th August 2018 (Moved in on the 5th August 2018) last payment was 28th August 2019 (Liable for the rent up until 28th September but the property was empty from 10th August) 1 1/2 months of bills and rent still paid as normal even though nobody was there using any gas or electric, and a reduced council tax rate

Slithery

Why would the property being empty mean reduced council tax?

kandy22

not a lodger no, I moved into a house she had a agreed to rent solo 6 months ealier. I moved in and went on the tenanacy agreement as a house share

Yes rent was £350
Moved in on 5th August 2018, I paid my rent on the 28th August 2018
I moved out around 10th August 2019 and paid went up until 28th September 2019 even though the property remained empty for that time, I paid the set out amount. (Gas, electric, council tax etc would of been less)

I understand that yes I may owe rent for this period, but after recent events I'm reluctant to pay them any more money. After I paid my set amount to them for the months the house was empty they tried to put the council tax in all my name after claiming I still lived there even though I moved out before them. I had paid my half of the bills to them like normal just cover any extra costs. I ensured I paid for the time I was liable and on the tenancy agreement

I moved in on the 5th August 2018
28th August 2018 I paid £350 (I paid on the 28th of every month)
I went on the tenancy 28th October 2018

I have a message of them stating either way they where going to change the internet provider at the end of the contract to find a cheaper option. they kept the same provider and the normal £29 bill went up to £51 for a month. in their message to me they ask me to pay the difference from the usual £29 to the £51 which amounts to £22. I'm unclear as to how this is all my charge?

I paid internet charges which was included in the amount I sent to them on the 28th of each month
I guess I could pay 50% of the charges but they had already had my half of the internet bill that month so why should I pay the extra £22 for them not fixing the internet out sooner, and if they wanted 50% yeah ok I did use the internet but they are trying to get the full amount out of me

I paid them £350 per month this included, rent, gas, eclectic, water, council tax and internet

The £240 Admin fees where payable to the estate agents, they paid this on my behalf as I could not afford this. I then paid them £100 in cash and £100 on transfer.
I will pay the remaining £40 now!

I was a joint tenant - the property owner was my landlord.
I moved in 6 months after they had agreed to rent the house solo hence me being added onto the tenancy agreement

I have wrote to them asking for a copy of the bills but they wrote back claiming it had no relevance to the case and refused,

yes I agreed to pay £350 and then £365 for a rental increase, this was to cover bills. when I agreed to this it was made clear it was for connivance and was a average cost. (the property was empty from 10th August 2019 - 28th September 2019, yet I still paid the £365 which also covered gas and electric and reduced council tax, in turn they had more money of me)

The jump from £350 to £365 was a rental increase from June 2019, I agreed to pay this what I did not agree to pay was their idea of property management

"where do I stand with requesting this information? do I have any rights to it? I've read as the bills where in there name I'm legally not responsible for them but would this stand up in small claims court without a legal repersentive?
You can put in your defence that you were never given sight of the bills."
this is good thank you so much

kandy22

You are entitled to a reduced rate if you are still responbilbe for the tenanacy I.e. rent but are also living in a altrnative property and paying counil tax else where. which I was, at my new house

boo_star

kandy22 wrote: »

You are entitled to a reduced rate if you are still responbilbe for the tenanacy I.e. rent but are also living in a altrnative property and paying counil tax else where. which I was, at my new house

That depends on the council. It certainly isn't a legal right.

GS..

Couldn't be bothered with the long tale of woe, but as soon as I see this, I see a person mitigating why they haven't paid what THEY KNOW THEY SHOULD HAVE PAID. So unless you pay what you know you owe, they have a case against you

kandy22 wrote: »

........I was very broke at the time and had outstanding bills from a house I had bought with a ex-girlfriend, I left that house after finding out she was cheating on me.

HampshireH

Couldn't be bothered with the long tale of woe, but as soon as I see this, I see a person mitigating why they haven't paid what THEY KNOW THEY SHOULD HAVE PAID. So unless you pay what you know you owe, they have a case against you

“

........I was very broke at the time and had outstanding bills from a house I had bought with a ex-girlfriend, I left that house after finding out she was cheating on me.

Originally posted!by!kandy22”

Perhaps on this occasions actually reading the post would have been helpful.:o can't see that the above quote is the OP mitigating against these claims more that it's back ground and somewhat irrelevant information.

OP your tenancy agreement will state what you are liable to pay. Your posts are confusing.

You say you had a tenancy and an estate agent. Then you go on to say you agreed to pay an increase due to a rent increase as if it were a choice and to your housemate and you were doing them a favour. Rather than fulfilling your contractual obligation.

The jump from £350 to £365 was a rental increase from June 2019, I agreed to pay this what I did not agree to pay was their idea of property management

As they have put the claim in make sure you prepare a solid defence & submit it in time. To include not having sight of individual bills nor any in your name.

Your bank statements/receipts will prove you have made payment as you say you did.

If you have paid everything you were meant to except for the £40 pay up and ensure you are prepared to defend the claim.

It is odd that any tenancy agreement asks for rent to be paid in arrears. From what I Can see in your posts you haven't overpaid by £265 you just paid for your 1st month at the end. (Based on your posts)

Wanderingpomm

Letting fees are banned.
What is the £240 for? I’m not sure this is a legal charge. You can’t just charge an ‘admin fee’ any more.