Civil Enforcement Ltd Claim

Maximus21

Thank you. Just don't know which defence to use. Looking at particulars of claim they refer to being "authorised to manage the car park at all material times". Claimant uses ANPR at entrance and exit. Stating clear and visible signs at entrance and around site (although defendant didn't notice upon entry, They refer to car being parked in breach of terms and conditions of contract although payment had been made to park in the car park, just overran by about 9 minutes. States payment was due within 28 days of PCN yet PCN was not received until after this time as was sent to Registered Keeper and not Defendant. Claims commercially justifiable penalty as regulated by British Parking Association to enable efficient management and control of private car parks quoting Parking Eye v Beavis and driver acceptance of terms and conditions of parking Vine v Waltham Forest. Can anyone point the defendnat to the best defence to adapt?

Maximus21

Thank you KeithP. Trying to get the defence done this weekend and submitted this week if at all possible. Beginning to wonder though if it's too late though as someone else has pointed out :0(

KeithP

Maximus21 wrote: »

Thank you KeithP. Trying to get the defence done this weekend and submitted this week if at all possible. Beginning to wonder though if it's too late though as someone else has pointed out :0(

I don't understand why you think you are already too late.

As I said earlier...

...you have until 4pm on Tuesday 21st January 2020 to file your Defence.

That's over two weeks away. Plenty of time to produce a Defence...

Redx

Maximus21 wrote: »

Thank you KeithP. Trying to get the defence done this weekend and submitted this week if at all possible. Beginning to wonder though if it's too late though as someone else has pointed out :0(

I don't understand it either , I gave you a link to a post with approximate target dates and then KeithP told you exact details based on the dates we squeezed out of you , which is usually 33 days from the date of service

As for a defence , start with the concise defence by bargepole , add no landowner authority and poor signage , address the POC and add the abuse of process and CRA points from post #14 of the abuse of process thread

You won't find an exact match , so find a close match or do what I said above , this is a self help forum wher you do the work , we advise , criticise and help you to the best draft and using the correct words

Maximus21

RedX I was referring to the point you made regarding doing something earlier before it got to this stage. I am aware the Defendant has until 21 January as KeithP kindly told me. Thank you though for the pointers

Redx

My point was that you are the architect of your current woes by not appealing at the time and using the BPA CoP clause #13 regarding grace periods to get a slam dunk win at popla with much less risk and much lower charges involved

So its now too late for those initial appeal stages meaning a judge may not take kindly for having to sort out the mess, court should be a last resort

My other point is that you have a great deal more to learn about the legal processes now that a court claim has been issued , plus to learn the whole topic that you would have needed to have learned a few years ago about appeals and popla and the BPA CoP etc

So you need to stop complaining about this situation and get on with the massive tasks ahead in order to fix it, then learn that early intervention is always preferable

Maximus21

RedX, I am not complaining at all. In fact, i'm hugely grateful for the help which I have received so far. Unfortunately I have never had a parking fine like this before and have stupidly listened to people who advised me to ignore the penalty as it was not enforceable! I unfortunately happen to be one of the minority of people the company has decided to take to court. If I fail, I fail, I will simply pay the fine. Unfortunately I'm not in a position to just pay the fine now but it's not really helpful being told "to stop complaining about the situation". I am not complaining just needing guidance and I thought this was the place to find it but clearly you seem to have taken offence at my requests for help for which I apologise!

Umkomaas

I unfortunately happen to be one of the minority of people the company has decided to take to court. If I fail, I fail,

CEL threaten almost everyone who hasn't paid them with court action. They take many up to the wire, but for those who have a solid defence they more often than not discontinue. The ones that get to court are those cases where no defence has been filed, giving CEL an easy default win.

So to give you the best chance of a discontinuation, you must keep jumping through all the hoops. The added benefit is that even if this does get to a court hearing, you go there having completed all the processes correctly and with a good defence that will hopefully be successful.

Redx

You complained about the site in post #20 on page 1

I have not taken offence , just want you to understand what this forum is actually for and to give you basic guidance in your case , which has dozens of hundreds of similar examples , hence why Umkomaas also laid out the bare facts in his last reply, including that CEL have done this thousands of times before and continue to do so , so you are NOT in a minority at all

Most of the replies on here like ours are from lay persons who usually have not been through it , but have put enough time and energy over several years to help thousands of people like yourself

You asked for advice and help , so we have criticised , admonished and generally assisted you to get this far and learn what not to do , as well as what to do

This is a parking charge forum , not a court case forum , you won't find many legal eagles on here , most get paid for the job , not do it for free , those pro bono people are very , very rare Indeed

I have never been issued with a private PCN , never been to court either , but after 7 years of helping people on here I have a wealth of basic knowledge in the words to use and processes involved, so I give you the facts of what I see and perceive , as do KeithP , Le_Kirk , Umkomaas , fruitcake , coupon mad and many others too. Not one legally qualified person has replied yet, think about that fact too

You will have to grow a thicker skin to get through this , to take the knocks and learn from mistakes , because it won't get any better over the next few months , but you will come out of it better and more informed than when you went in

We want you to succeed , so if it takes criticism and cajoling to achieve it , sobeit , but I have nothing against you personally , just your naivety and clear newbieness which you do not need to apologise for , but which we will eradicate quite quickly , if you get onboard and involved

Getting newbies to stop self incrimination when they use the words "My , Me , Myself & I" is the first task we try for and achieve through cajoling and criticism, like pleading the 5th in America , or a no comment in an interview (prove it), the second task is getting Newbies to reveal the issue date from a PCN or claim form

You have done everything we asked so far, so it's onwards and upwards, post your defence draft asap , for more criticism and cajoling , to hone it to perfection

Good luck

Edit , read a few winners , like this 2019 one , look how naive and Newbie they were at the start , notice that CEL discontinued too

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/6016969/civil-enforcement-claim-form

Or this one where they did not attend

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/5892994/cel-ticket

So remove the poor victim hat and swap it for a full suit of defensive armour, get defending

Coupon-mad

CEL cases are almost never lost by posters and almost everyone who comes here with a CEL court claim, ignored them first. You are the same, and you will win.