The Growth of Toxic Workplaces

motorguy

Blatchford wrote: »

I don't know what kind of employment experience you have. Maybe you haven't ever had a job? But it is not up to employees to tell their employer when it's convenient for them to turn up. You don't "let the employer know you won't be in" whether in "good time" or not. And what other people may or may not have done is irrelevant - you are not privy to their details. Perhaps they were more polite and didn't just let the boss know they wouldn't be turning up to work? But here's a big hint. When you have employment, the employer very unreasonably expects you to turn up to work and do your job. That isn't "toxic". That called employment. You don't get to tell them when it's convenient to turn up, or when you get time off. You are responsible for your child's situation because you refused to provide her with evidence to support her request for time off.

Ps. I'm sorry but I missed the deleted post in my responses. I can totally see now why your daughter thinks she's entitled. It's an inherited trait. The employer didn't refuse anything. You refused to provide evidence to support her request. So from the employers point of view, it could all have been a lie. There's no right for time off to look after siblings. Maybe they'd have said yes. If you'd been reasonable and given them reason to. Instead you thought it was a right. It wasn't.

Totally agree with all of this.

motorguy

Toomuchdebt wrote: »

I haven't deleted any post here-perhaps someone reported it and that's why it's gone-I don't know why it's not showing up but it's been quoted anyway so it's there for you to see. If I was going to delete posts I would delete them all.
Yes I have had jobs-sadly my health hasn't allowed me to work since 2015.
The other people would often just not turn up after the shift had started ( I was actually at the cafe on 2 occasions when this happened)
You are entitled to whatever opinion you like. The procedure is that in a family emergency she is allowed to take time off and no evidence has to be provided. Obviously if she was doing it often it would be reasonable to be doubtful. I really don't understand why you're attacking me. I don't have any evidence to provide and I think it's reasonable for me to not want her manager to have details of my health right down to medication I am taking.
As I stated earlier she has done more extra hours in this job than contracted hours for the past 6 months, and has covered sickness every single week for other employees. She has not taken any time off for herself whatsoever for her own sickness except when she actually threw up at work and was told to go home as it's a cafe. Perhaps you think she should have left an 11 year old and a 9 year old at home alone until 1am...and before you ask-their dad died last year so no she couldn't ask him to help out.
You seem to have taken a real dislike to me without knowing a single thing about me purely because I don't want to tell a perfect stranger my medical problems and what tablets I am taking.
In any case this will be my last post for some time as I certainly don't need to be stressed out by people's opinions.

edited to add it was removed by the forum team because apparently attacking me is fine but me calling someone a stupid idiot is not fine.

No one has taken a dislike to you - we dont know you. However its been pointed out that your attitude towards your daughter's employment and employers appears toxic, one sided and frankly wrong.

When challenged on it constructively you've become aggressive.

Also, another point of constructive feedback - in your first post you went for the big "fortunately my daughter has options", subsequently this has become "shes looking for other work" which is very different. Is your situation going to be better if she gets sacked? How will that help her job opportunities if a reference was "doesnt turn up for work and couldnt provide evidence of reason not to"?

motorguy

Jsacker wrote: »

I've managed about 500 people on a broad-level in a call centre previously. I only saw numbers and the absence rate was simply a number for me. It was up to the managers to manage absence and they employed the "fear" tactics. The line of questioning your daughter is receiving is very typical of their approach (including the idiotic suggestions of bringing the kids to work till 1am which I don't even think THEY thought would result in the employee coming in!). Designed to make absence a real pain in the !!!!.

Absolutely. Absence in a call centre is a real problem - it means lost revenue and could mean SLAs not being hit which could mean financial penalties, so they will manage absence very tightly.

Lateness is another big problem - one of the ones my wife heard was when an agent was asked why she was late she said "because it was raining" and elaborated "it takes me longer to walk around the puddles".

[Deleted User]

Toomuchdebt wrote: »

In any case this will be my last post for some time as I certainly don't need to be stressed out by people's opinions.

There are a few people on this forum that exhibit the exact behaviour I'm talking about - however, most are decent, so try not to let it put you off posting.

kanosam

In this case it would mean toxic management, allowing that toxic behaviour - rather than nipping it in the bud asap.

i totally agree! i good manager would realise that toxic employees would ruin a department/company if its not nipped in the bud.
a good manager would not allow any form of bullying in the work place but if you leave a toxic atmosphere, this is what will happen.

pickledonionspaceraider

I think some of the behaviour towards toomuchdebt on this thread is pretty shameful to be fair.

The vultures are circling again.

In several decades of working both as a manager and employee, I have never heard of workplaces request evidence of a family emergency, and that stands for everyone I know IRL. I have never known it to be company policy in management positions

This request is not a regular occurrence, and it is not normal + literally the first time I have heard of a company doing this

The management need to realise that they are humans they employ, not robots - and family does - and should, come first.

It does not make you 'Entitled' to expect to be treated with a level of humanity, as an employee.

LilElvis

pickledonionspaceraider wrote: »

I think some of the behaviour towards toomuchdebt on this thread is pretty shameful to be fair.

The vultures are circling again.

In several decades of working both as a manager and employee, I have never heard of workplaces request evidence of a family emergency, and that stands for everyone I know IRL. I have never known it to be company policy in management positions

This request is not a regular occurrence, and it is not normal + literally the first time I have heard of a company doing this

The management need to realise that they are humans they employ, not robots - and family does - and should, come first.

It does not make you 'Entitled' to expect to be treated with a level of humanity, as an employee.

Perhaps the employer has been stung before by less than truthful employees. Countless posts on here regarding phoning in sick/ dental appointment etc to attend job interviews. Think you're going to be refused a day's holiday to go Christmas shopping - easily sorted! Just phone in and say your kid's been throwing up all night. Want a few days off with short notice - no problem! You need to attend your Granny's funeral at the other end of the country. My sister had an employee whose Scottish Grandma died 4 times - emphasis on had, because he was sacked for gross misconduct. Employees with policies which allow x number of days sickness absence in a given period before facing management investigation do treat them as extra days of "holiday" they can use when they feel like it.

Yes, employers should be compassionate and treat their employees as human beings but it is disingenuous to suggest that some employees do not outright abuse this trust, causing employers to request proof of absence from all.

Here_Comes_The_Judge

pickledonionspaceraider wrote: »

I think some of the behaviour towards toomuchdebt on this thread is pretty shameful to be fair.

The vultures are circling again.

In several decades of working both as a manager and employee, I have never heard of workplaces request evidence of a family emergency, and that stands for everyone I know IRL. I have never known it to be company policy in management positions

This request is not a regular occurrence, and it is not normal + literally the first time I have heard of a company doing this

The management need to realise that they are humans they employ, not robots - and family does - and should, come first.

It does not make you 'Entitled' to expect to be treated with a level of humanity, as an employee.

You were about 90 when you retired were you?

pickledonionspaceraider

Here_Comes_The_Judge wrote: »

You were about 90 when you retired were you?

Oh, hello. Nice to meet you.

pickledonionspaceraider

LilElvis wrote: »

Perhaps the employer has been stung before by less than truthful employees. Countless posts on here regarding phoning in sick/ dental appointment etc to attend job interviews. Think you're going to be refused a day's holiday to go Christmas shopping - easily sorted! Just phone in and say your kid's been throwing up all night. Want a few days off with short notice - no problem! You need to attend your Granny's funeral at the other end of the country. My sister had an employee whose Scottish Grandma died 4 times - emphasis on had, because he was sacked for gross misconduct. Employees with policies which allow x number of days sickness absence in a given period before facing management investigation do treat them as extra days of "holiday" they can use when they feel like it.

Yes, employers should be compassionate and treat their employees as human beings but it is disingenuous to suggest that some employees do not outright abuse this trust, causing employers to request proof of absence from all.

Oh I agree. There will always be the P takers.

These things should be treated on a case by case basis where the trustworthy employees aren't tarred with the same brush. Employers know who the mickey takers are