Battery Electric Vehicle News / Enjoying the Transportation Revolution

GreatApe

silverwhistle wrote: »

Except, of course, less electricity used in refining the petrol..

This is an insignificant figure often blown up to be two magnitudes greater than it actually is

Martyn1981

silverwhistle wrote: »

Except, of course, less electricity used in refining the petrol..

Estimated at 4.5-6kWh per gallon. Or to put it another way, not refining that gallon, would free up enough leccy to move a BEV approx half the distance the petrol would, so you are half way there before you even begin comparisons.

Also (in this article) the three oil refineries had dedicated connections to nearby coal generation plants, though this is now changing as coal falls off the grid .... for good.

Volts for Oil | Fully Charged

GreatApe

almillar wrote: »

Where did you get these prices from?!!

The 1 Series for example is 'from £24,430'.
The A Class is 'from £23,710'
The A3 is 'from £22,725'
The Q2 is 'from £22,720'

Really makes me doubt all your other numbers.

I assume you are quoting RRP almost no one pays RRP
I'm after a new car so I've been looking at the best quotes I have for brand new are

Q2 £18,996
A3 Sportsback £18,337
A Class £20,525
1 series £21,860

Use a car comparison website you will find similar prices local to you maybe £500 up or down on these numbers

The Audi Q2 in particular seems like a lovely small SUV at a good price
Better imo than the E golf with its crippled ~90 mile motorway range which costs £26-27k before grants

GreatApe

almillar wrote: »

Replace 'EV' with 'any electrical device' and we agree. But yes, replacing your ICE, with an EV, means less petrol used, more electricity used.

Yes and that electricity has marginal emmissions of 400-1000grams/KWh at the home socket depending on the national marginal supply

Agreed. But we're comparing EVs with ICEs, not walking.

And the things we've resolved is that an efficient ICE is not far off 100g/km Vs a BEV which ranges from 70-150grams depending on of the local grid is marginal gas or coal and we know most the world's big grids are marginal coal

And your mistake you continue to ignore the overnight charging EVs that can help to balance the grid, and use all that excess wind power. You assume people are always using peak electric.

Why do you think EVs are needed to 'help to balance the grid'?
All that excess wind power is just an empty statement there isn't much excess wind power only about 2% of hours there is excess wind power. Also the grid is changing half the reactors are closing in 2023/4 and the grid is gaining new ability to go lower !!!!!! before curtialment of wind and significant number of interconntors are coming online. what this means is five years from now you shouldn't expect to see any significant curtailment so to pretend or hope the BEVs will be wind charged more than about 2-5% of the time is just empty hope

I'm perfectly happy with this version. Get to the end of the year, production from various sources changes, consumption changes. More EVs will mean more electric consumed. Install RE to keep up.

By 2030 the amount of times were are marginal green may have gone from about 2% now to 5% then so this won't significantly change the emmissions of BEVs and much of the rest of the world is a decade further behind than we are.

I can tell you have neither an EV nor solar panels. You missed one.

#4 Plug your car in when it is sunny and you (within your household) have excess solar production. Make your EV charge more slowly if necessary, or of course, have a charger (Zappi) that sorts it all out for you.

What do you think that achieves?
We've already been through this the proximity to the electricity source is irrelevant electricity moves at the speed of light it doesn't matter that the chines panels on your roof is closer than the CCGT the other side of town

GreatApe

Martyn1981 wrote: »

Estimated at 4.5-6kWh per gallon. O]

That figure is total BS and you should be ashamed of yourself for continually posting that BS when it's been shown to be a lie

Even the you tube video says 5.6TWh for all the UK refineries in 2005 well divided by the amount of oil refined in the UK in 2005 and you get a figure of 1 unit of electricity needed to refine 170 units of oil

A UK gallon of petrol therefore uses 0.26 KWh of electricity not your nonsense of 4.5-6 which is 20x the real figure

So stop posting your fake nonsense

ABrass

Polite reminder: this is the news thread. If it's not news it doesn't belong.

Tesla are inching towards level 4 automation with town level features starting to show up.

The driving visualization can now display additional objects which include stop lights, stop signs and select road markings. The stop sign and stop light visualizations are not a substitute for an attentive driver and will not stop the car. To see these additional objects in your driving visualization, tap Controls > Autopilot > Full Self-Driving Visualization preview.

https://www.teslarati.com/tesla-holiday-update-release-notes/

Martyn1981

Fully Charged vid with Bobby trying out the new V3 Tesla superchargers (from min 12) that have just gone operational in the UK, and you get to see his in car screen as it hits 250kW / 1,000+mph charge rate:

Fully Charged Christmas Unspecial - Tesla 250kW SUPERCHARGERS


Also the latest Tesla Time News with the excellent father/son team, at the start (first 10mins) celebrating the switching on of the Superchargers across the trans-Canadian highway route, meaning you (one day eh guys?) can drive from Vancouver to Halifax, 6,000km, in a BEV.

Tesla Time News - Tesla Takes Canada by Storm!


And E for Electric discussing rumours that Tesla may be about to push the TM3 past 400 mile range with a 100kWh battery. Also questions the need for 400+ mile range, which personally I think sounds great, but also means a lot of money tied up in that BEV cost with a battery size hardly ever needed, especially with rapid chargers rolling out. My (perhaps ours now) forum friend who supplied lots of info for us on owning a domestic battery at the start of the battery thread, has been posting pics on Navitron of his TM3 charging (for free) at 130kW at a Polar site during their trials, and will be able to use the new 250kW V3 chargers.

Going way, way back on a different thread/board, many BEV'ers seemed to think somewhere around 200-250 miles was about adequate, when taking car cost into account, so just wondering if opinions have changed at all?

Tesla Model 3 RUMOR: 400+ Mile Range in 2020

[Remember, I watch all of these vids/vlogs, so that you don't have to, because I'm such a nice guy ..... nah ..... I'm not going to get away with that carp! M.]

almillar

GreatApe:

I assume you are quoting RRP almost no one pays RRP

It's all we've got to go on, without the research. You can do similiar with EVs of course, if you're going to do that with ICEs, remember to do it with EVs too.

The Audi Q2 in particular seems like a lovely small SUV at a good price
Better imo than the E golf

Haven't been in one, but it's meant to be a 'high up A1' I thought, so it's a size down on the Golf. If so, unfair comparison.

Why do you think EVs are needed to 'help to balance the grid'?
All that excess wind power is just an empty statement there isn't much excess wind power only about 2% of hours there is excess wind power

So they fix that 2% then? Great. My understanding is that switching on and off the big plants is inefficient. Leaving one on overnight would balance the grid out and be more efficient. That's all.

We've already been through this the proximity to the electricity source is irrelevant electricity moves at the speed of light it doesn't matter that the chines panels on your roof is closer than the CCGT the other side of town

I'll go with your 'proximity doesn't matter' for the purpose of this example. Can you confirm that you know what a Zappi does? Charging your car, while the sun is shining allows you to say it's solar charged. Taking 2kw to charge your car, whilst YOUR solar panel produces 3, means you can say your car is charging via solar. You can wrap yourself up in practicalities and grids all you like, but that's fairly simple.

ABrass

400 miles might make sense for some people, but my bet is that it's to improve performance rather than because the range is needed. The more battery you have the more power you can supply and the faster you can go. It's why the Roadster 2 is planned to have 600 miles of range, to boost the power.

That fits in with Musk's suggestion of a model 3 ludicrous mode.

ABrass

Lithium supplies are running out. Oh, no, sorry, wrong news, there's too much supply and the price has cratered.

Prices for lithium carbonate, the most common type used in EV batteries, doubled over 2016 and 2017. Since then, they have fallen by more than 40% to around $9.5 per kilo compared to the $18 per kilo mark they hit in May last year, according to S&P Global Platts.

The main factor behind the price slump is the avalanche of new supply that has hit the market over the past year, triggered mainly by mine expansions and a cut in government subsidies for purchasers of electric vehicles in China.

https://www.mining.com/nemaska-lithium-goes-bankrup-first-victim-of-market-glut/