Battery Electric Vehicle News / Enjoying the Transportation Revolution

JKenH

Musk weighs in on Waymo versus Tesla autonomous driving

https://thedriven.io/2020/10/09/musk-weighs-in-on-waymo-versus-tesla-autonomous-driving/

JKenH

Martyn1981 said:

EVandPV said:

Electric family cars are CHEAPER to own than petrol and diesel models: Lower maintenance and charging costs mean they are £132-a-month less expensive

https://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/cars/article-8807221/Are-electric-family-cars-cheaper-petrol-diesel.html

Doh! I didn't stop scrolling soon enough, I hit the comments section - "batts need replacing every 5 yrs", "insurance costs 3x more" ...... why won't these people let facts in?

That’s what makes the Mail online article all the more commendable. It is easy to just tell your readers what they want to hear but the Mail have decided to tell them the facts about EVs whether they like it or not (and it seems they don’t). There aren’t too many papers prepared to do that. Let’s judge the Mail article on its merits not the ill informed comments of its readers. 

ed110220

JKenH said:

Martyn1981 said:

EVandPV said:

Electric family cars are CHEAPER to own than petrol and diesel models: Lower maintenance and charging costs mean they are £132-a-month less expensive

https://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/cars/article-8807221/Are-electric-family-cars-cheaper-petrol-diesel.html

Doh! I didn't stop scrolling soon enough, I hit the comments section - "batts need replacing every 5 yrs", "insurance costs 3x more" ...... why won't these people let facts in?

That’s what makes the Mail online article all the more commendable. It is easy to just tell your readers what they want to hear but the Mail have decided to tell them the facts about EVs whether they like it or not (and it seems they don’t). There aren’t too many papers prepared to do that. Let’s judge the Mail article on its merits not the ill informed comments of its readers. 

The problem is that all these ill-informed comments are the product of the culture-wars nonsense that the Mail has been spewing for years - that climate change is a hoax, renewable energy is a fraud designed to harvest subsidies, EVs are useless, insulation is bad etc etc. 
On the other hand it's a good sign perhaps that even here reality is starting to seep through.

Martyn1981

Extracts from this week's Carbon Commentary Newsletter:

7, Electric pick-up trucks. I thought it was courageous of the electric pick-up manufacturer Rivian to allow one of the first of the trucks off its production line to enter a competitive rally. (It has to be admitted that new very rapid charging points were built to enable it to take part). When I last looked, the pick-up was in third place out of 30 trucks in the competition, which tests navigation skills rather than speed. Rivian looks a powerful contender among smaller electric commercial vehicles having had investment and a reported 100,000 unit order from Amazon. The contrast with the troubled Nikola is stark.

10, Hydrogen buses. The debate is not whether buses should be electrified; they clearly should be, particularly in polluted cities. But should they use batteries or hydrogen fuel cells? Aberdeen in Scotland welcomed the first of 15 fuel cell buses made by WrightBus in Northern Ireland to cover its main routes. The English city of Birmingham will follow with 20 next year. The advantage of these buses is the shorter recharging time (5-10 minutes) and a longer range than most battery equivalents. But the Aberdeen buses had a subsidy of about £500,000/$650,000 a bus, partly from the European Union, a source which will no longer be available in eleven weeks time. (An inexpensive diesel bus costs about half this amount). The owner of WrightBus, Jo Bamford, says it is a matter of scale: ‘If you came to me with an order for 3,000 buses, I could get the bus to cost the same as a diesel’. In other countries, the growth of battery buses continues with the Chinese manufacturer BYD taking a large role in the supply. Finland just purchased another 106 vehicles, saying that the typical range is about 400km. My guess is that however fast hydrogen fuel cell buses can improve, battery buses will improve more quickly.

JKenH

ed110220 said:

JKenH said:

Martyn1981 said:

EVandPV said:

Electric family cars are CHEAPER to own than petrol and diesel models: Lower maintenance and charging costs mean they are £132-a-month less expensive

https://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/cars/article-8807221/Are-electric-family-cars-cheaper-petrol-diesel.html

Doh! I didn't stop scrolling soon enough, I hit the comments section - "batts need replacing every 5 yrs", "insurance costs 3x more" ...... why won't these people let facts in?

That’s what makes the Mail online article all the more commendable. It is easy to just tell your readers what they want to hear but the Mail have decided to tell them the facts about EVs whether they like it or not (and it seems they don’t). There aren’t too many papers prepared to do that. Let’s judge the Mail article on its merits not the ill informed comments of its readers. 

The problem is that all these ill-informed comments are the product of the culture-wars nonsense that the Mail has been spewing for years - that climate change is a hoax, renewable energy is a fraud designed to harvest subsidies, EVs are useless, insulation is bad etc etc. 
On the other hand it's a good sign perhaps that even here reality is starting to seep through.

I think the tide has changed in all the mainstream media. The Telegraph are always running positive articles about EVs and even the motoring magazines are singing their praises even though their core audience is still (I suspect) predominantly what are commonly described as petrolheads. (There are a couple of us on here to whom that appellation might apply but who run EVs.) Auto Express have for many years supported EVs and over the past couple of months have run a series of articles on electric vans. In 2019 Auto Express named the Tesla M3 car of the year.

It is a slow process but change is happening. A lot of older people have lived through a lot of changes in their lifetime and are cynical about what scientists and politicians say because they have seen so many about turns. As an example look at how advice has changed on consumption of fat over the decades. 

Old habits die hard. As an example the perception exists that the Mail and the Telegraph oppose EVs and no matter how many articles are posted demonstrating otherwise some people will look for ways to support that long held misconception because that belief is ingrained in them and they are reluctant to change it. It is like that with people who diss EVs. If you have spent the last few years rubbishing them along with your mates you continue to do so even though the facts on which you based your original case have changed. 

JKenH

I know he said it was coming this month but still surprised.

buglawton

EVandPV said:

Electric family cars are CHEAPER to own than petrol and diesel models: Lower maintenance and charging costs mean they are £132-a-month less expensive

https://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/cars/article-8807221/Are-electric-family-cars-cheaper-petrol-diesel.html

Ours cost less than £132/m each to run so I'd like to see how that works.

EVandPV

buglawton said:

EVandPV said:

Electric family cars are CHEAPER to own than petrol and diesel models: Lower maintenance and charging costs mean they are £132-a-month less expensive

https://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/cars/article-8807221/Are-electric-family-cars-cheaper-petrol-diesel.html

Ours cost less than £132/m each to run so I'd like to see how that works.

Er, you could try reading the article.

buglawton

Martyn1981 said:

EVandPV said:

Electric family cars are CHEAPER to own than petrol and diesel models: Lower maintenance and charging costs mean they are £132-a-month less expensive

https://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/cars/article-8807221/Are-electric-family-cars-cheaper-petrol-diesel.html

Doh! I didn't stop scrolling soon enough, I hit the comments section - "batts need replacing every 5 yrs", "insurance costs 3x more" ...... why won't these people let facts in?

Facts like in this article in today's DT?
https://www.pressreader.com/uk/the-daily-telegraph/20201012/281861530974056
Electric car insurance costs drivers up to 62pc more

"Shopping around reduces the difference but electric cars cost more to buy so may often attract higher-priced premiums, said GoCompare."

EricMears

buglawton said:

Facts like in this article in today's DT?
https://www.pressreader.com/uk/the-daily-telegraph/20201012/281861530974056
Electric car insurance costs drivers up to 62pc more

Except that it's not a "fact".  Insurance premiums are at the whim of underwriters but you can always change companies for a better deal.  "up to" is a classic 'weasel phrase';  strictly interpreted it excludes only the possibility of paying more than 62% extra but includes possibility of it being much cheaper 

FWIW,  my BEV insurance is no more than my gas-guzzler's was.