Royal Mail Dispute

tomdickharry

hi all, a long post coming so be patient.

you maybe aware of the current dispute between royal mail and their workers cwu, some looking close and some just reading the media and some don't know.

being a postal worker, and i consider myself as a very honest hard worker, but things have taken a turn for the worse with royal mail taking my union to court next week to deem our ballot for IA invalid and causes me concern,
i'd like to tell a few facts and probably a few "our side arguments" which are open to debate

i see comments all the time re us striking at peak times, yet it must be 10 years since an official strike

probably the major fact, we aren't after a pay rise,
in fact the full time staff have been working 1 hour for free since october, we were due to drop from 38 to 37 hours as part of the previous agreement but remain on the same weekly pay, this was our "pay rise" same wage but work an hour less, this would also raise our part time staff hourly rate which also hasn't happened,
royal mail reneged on this deal after changing the boardroom.

there have been many many wildcat strikes due to bullying by management but legally the cwu cannot support them other than highlighting them, they cannot advise us to follow our colleagues and also walk out in support or they would be in serious trouble

we didn't vote for IA due to the general election mail pressure, this had been voted in by a massive 97% yes vote weeks before and as for waiting until xmas pressure, yes, i guess it doesn't look good, but the cwu have been trying to resolve issues since around may
our new ceo received a £5m hello bonus to buy him out of his current position despite already being employed by the royal mail group, and according to our union, lives permanently in switzerland and very rarely if any attended any discussions with the cwu regarding the issues.

we believe and this may not matter to most, we must keep a 6 day delivery service to which by law me must do, but the universal service obligation (uso) is up for negotiations soon, just 1 day will wipe 1000s of postal workers out

they have already started to take parcelforce out of the royal mail group (rmg) and eventually these workers will become 0 hour self employed drivers,
then they will try to break up the rest of the rmg
mail centres will be run independently then the delivery offices
i know our service can be pretty poor now, but when they employ people and throw them straight on the streets with very little training yet expect them to perform at 100% instantly

now i know an awful lot of people dislike or even hate our postal service and would prefer it to go, but it's a uk institution and would you like to see a once great service totally disappear when it could be retained and become great again?

we are not threatening strikes for more money, we merely want to maintain our current standard of living and eradicate the bullying side of their puppets, and believe me, they can be ruthless if you cannot stand up to them 1 on 1
i kid you not it's a very physical and mentally challenging job especially being on the wrong side of 50
yes we have (for now) decent t&c compared to most other unskilled workers but that's due to decades of fighting for them,
we cannot let them strip us of this

i absolutely love my job but hate those running/ruining it


please support your postie,
we don't want more, we want what's fair

missile

I have no connection to RM and it saddens me to hear this.

Altarf

Royal Mail is arguing in court that the postal ballot was not conducted correctly and is therefore not valid.

The rules for postal elections for industrial action are they must be sent to home addresses to prevent individuals being pressured to vote in a particular way.

Royal Mail staff were intercepting their ballot paper in the sorting office, and then filming themselves voting for action whilst surrounded by colleagues egging them on.

Royal Mail staff intercepting their own mail and opening it the sorting office is not permitted without permission from Royal Mail management, for obvious security reasons.

So you have a stupid union who know they have a strong mandate for action, but are too incompetent to ensure staff don’t break the electoral rules.

And then you have Royal Mail staff who are too stupid to not break the basic security rule of not opening post in the sorting office.

And now you want sympathy?

kuratowski

I wouldn't worry too much about public perceptions, OP.

People do have a tendency to complain about the merest inconvenience. It's a tiny minority who complain and they are amplified by media and social media in a totally disproportionate way. The number of times I hear noisy condemnation of everyone in my industry, from people who clearly have no understanding of what they are talking about, and full of fake facts they have picked up somewhere, is unbelievable.

Consumers today are so entitled, they think everything should be handed to them on a plate. E.g., they expect cheap goods and instant delivery at the exact hour of the day they choose; without paying any extra! If anything goes wrong for them, someone else must be blamed, it must be incompetence. The irritating details of the real world are denied and dismissed with "how hard can it be to..."

However, in the end, the way this dispute will be resolved is through negotiations between management and unions (and maybe arbitration) and I doubt public opinion will make that much difference one way or the other.

Pollycat

Altarf wrote: »

Royal Mail is arguing in court that the postal ballot was not conducted correctly and is therefore not valid.

The rules for postal elections for industrial action are they must be sent to home addresses to prevent individuals being pressured to vote in a particular way.

Royal Mail staff were intercepting their ballot paper in the sorting office, and then filming themselves voting for action whilst surrounded by colleagues egging them on.

Royal Mail staff intercepting their own mail and opening it the sorting office is not permitted without permission from Royal Mail management, for obvious security reasons.

So you have a stupid union who know they have a strong mandate for action, but are too incompetent to ensure staff don’t break the electoral rules.

And then you have Royal Mail staff who are too stupid to not break the basic security rule of not opening post in the sorting office.

And now you want sympathy?

WOW!

tomdickharry wrote: »

<<snip>>
i'd like to tell a few facts and probably a few "our side arguments" which are open to debate
<<snip>>

tomdickharry - perhaps you can comment on the post above, especially about sorting office staff opening mail that hadn't been delivered to their home address.
Is it true?
If it is, what is your opinion of it?
Do you think the postal ballot was 'properly conducted'?

tomdickharry wrote: »

<<snip>>
now i know an awful lot of people dislike or even hate our postal service and would prefer it to go, but it's a uk institution and would you like to see a once great service totally disappear when it could be retained and become great again?

<<snip>>

Royal Mail is my preferred courier - both for sending and receiving parcels.
I've never had any cause for complaint about my postie (who has been on my 'walk' for a number of years and is great).
I'm happy to support my postie but I would hope that he wasn't stupid enough to be involved in this:

Altarf wrote: »

Royal Mail staff were intercepting their ballot paper in the sorting office, and then filming themselves voting for action whilst surrounded by colleagues egging them on.

Royal Mail staff intercepting their own mail and opening it the sorting office is not permitted without permission from Royal Mail management, for obvious security reasons.

POPPYOSCAR

Most certainly do not hate Royal Mail and do not want it to go.

Our postman told my husband yesterday that there will not be a strike.

tomdickharry

Pollycat wrote: »

WOW!

tomdickharry - perhaps you can comment on the post above, especially about sorting office staff opening mail that hadn't been delivered to their home address.
Is it true?
If it is, what is your opinion of it?
Do you think the postal ballot was 'properly conducted'?

my honest thinking is that the ballot will be deemed invalid on tuesday in the courts due to some who had early access to their ballot papers, it is common practice for people to retrieve their mail if they choose to, i mean, if they have a parcel due the postman delivering it will know he's not at home so makes sence to give it them, but technically they must get permission 1st, and most never do,
i don't work in the office that delivers my post so never have had to ask,

as for people being pressured into voting yes, i don't believe this for 1 minute, our reps asked for a yes vote but that's their job to,

i do think morally the ballot result should stand,
97% yes with a 76% turnout is massive but RM have the legal eagles to pick things out,
but consider this, postal workers are in an extremely trusted position with what we handle, yes there are always going to be a bad egg in the box but the ballot was done in good faith, unfortunately this will probably be quashed and start again

next month will be manic, strikes on not, we usually cannot cope well with a general election or xmas, but the 2 together?

Altarf

kuratowski wrote: »

People do have a tendency to complain about the merest inconvenience. It's a tiny minority who complain and they are amplified by media and social media in a totally disproportionate way. The number of times I hear noisy condemnation of everyone in my industry, from people who clearly have no understanding of what they are talking about, and full of fake facts they have picked up somewhere, is unbelievable.

Consumers today are so entitled, they think everything should be handed to them on a plate. E.g., they expect cheap goods and instant delivery at the exact hour of the day they choose; without paying any extra! If anything goes wrong for them, someone else must be blamed, it must be incompetence. The irritating details of the real world are denied and dismissed with "how hard can it be to..."

If you tried you couldn't sound more like a 1970's union leader who is ignoring that the public when they are fed up dealing with nationalised industries.

The Royal Mail is an outdated institution that is past its 'Use by' date.

The volume of 'letter' post has fallen off a cliff as the majority of individuals and businesses have moved to electronic alternatives.

Where 'letter' post is still used, Royal Mail is hampered by its Universal Service Obligation, whereas its commercial competitors can simply ignore the outer reaches of the UK and concentrate on the cities and large towns.

Parcel post has dramatically increased, but Royal Mail has to compete against the commercial competitors, not only constrained again by the Universal Service Obligation, but also the development of locker deliveries, electronic notification of deliveries, etc.

Royal Mail staff in striking to 'protect' the service will simply hasten its demise.

Altarf

tomdickharry wrote: »

it is common practice for people to retrieve their mail if they choose to, i mean, if they have a parcel due the postman delivering it will know he's not at home so makes sence to give it them, but technically they must get permission 1st, and most never do

Not good to admit that many Royal Mail staff break the security rules, which are in place for very good reasons.

tomdickharry wrote: »

RM have the legal eagles to pick things out

And so does the Communication Workers Union, so knowing how the staff break the rules, they should have been all over this before instigating the ballot.

tomdickharry

Altarf wrote: »

And now you want sympathy?

where did i ask for sympathy?

i definitely don't want any, i was merely trying to explain the situation we are in,
we are all working class people trying to stop the greed of the rmg ruining a once great job and potentially putting 1000s out of work or into jobs without the current t&c we have

tomdickharry

Altarf wrote: »

Not good to admit that many Royal Mail staff break the security rules, which are in place for very good reasons.




And so does the Communication Workers Union, so knowing how the staff break the rules, they should have been all over this before instigating the ballot.

they can get their own mail, but only after getting permission off a manager
and due to past disputes it's common knowledge that rm's legal team are a lot smarter than theirs