Is education in the UK a scam ?

kinger101

justcamehere5 wrote: »

Nope, I just want the UK to have free education for all like Germany. Given that taxation is very similar, I think it is a fair thing to expect.

The tax rates are not very similar at all.

If we take pay of £45,000, the income tax would be £6,500 (14.44%) and the NI would be £4,364 (9.70%)

If we take the EUR equivalent of 52,200, income tax (inc solidarity charge) would be 10,041 (20.0%) and social security 10,479 (20.0%). About half the social security goes toward a much more generous state pension.

The problem with the UK is we want a state sector with the same benefits of Northern Europe but funded for with US levels of taxation.

Voyager2002

spadoosh wrote: »

Ive always thought the best shouldnt pay. So would go for something like the top 25-50% (academically) of uni applicants have their tuition paid with a means tested loan available for everyone else.

IIRC even the current rate of tuition is heavily subsidised. So scrap any subsidies associated and just means test the loan for true tuition cost. Tax payer covers the cost of the brightest (attach conditions, ie moving abroad will result in full repayment of costs etc) for greater benefit to the taxpayer.

Sounds logical, but...

There are plenty of young people who don't do well at school, partly because of a disadvantaged background, partly because of just being teenagers, yet have the innate ability to benefit from a university education. Some of them go on to get top degrees, but if they were to be told at 18 that they would have to pay for themselves while others would get free university, they would be put off, which would be a loss to everyone. So hard to see how to implement your system: maybe loans for everyone, but those who do very well have their loan cancelled on graduation?

At one time university tuiton fees were heavily subsidised, but now they are one of the main sources of income for universities and so probably cover a good deal more than the direct costs of providing courses.Obviously these direct costs vary between institutions and from subject to subject, but in most cases will be lower than the tuiton fee.

Voyager2002

kinger101 wrote: »

The tax rates are not very similar at all.

If we take pay of £45,000, the income tax would be £6,500 (14.44%) and the NI would be £4,364 (9.70%)

If we take the EUR equivalent of 52,200, income tax (inc solidarity charge) would be 10,041 (20.0%) and social security 10,479 (20.0%). About half the social security goes toward a much more generous state pension.

The problem with the UK is we want a state sector with the same benefits of Northern Europe but funded for with US levels of taxation.

All in all, when we look at the OP's inaccurate beliefs about comparative taxation and his limited powers of expression, and marvel that he was chosen for such a good job... this explains why British banks are in such a mess!

LilElvis

justcamehere5 wrote: »

I did not do Economics of course, lol. Let alone any other humanities garbage.

What a ridiculous, immature statement to make. Lol (or insert other toe-curling, emoji/ phrase as the poorly educated see fit).

Davy_Jones_II

justcamehere5 wrote: »

Especially when I could have gone to Germany or the Netherlands if no fluency in German, or even Scotland.... get a much cheaper degree and get a similar if not same opportunity in London for the exact same salary.

30 000 in debt when looking to save for a house is a huge hurdle.

Why didn’t you then?

Davy_Jones_II

justcamehere5 wrote: »

Germans. same place as me. For 30-50k GBP cheaper.

German universities tend to be inferior.

I hope that you got your money’s worth by getting one of the better degrees from a top university.

LilElvis

Consistency is all when you post. So which is it?

justcamehere5 wrote: »

But I pay monthly fees off my salary and I will end up paying more if I am a high-earner, which I will be. They don't do that and will still be as good earner as me. Crazy.

Or:

justcamehere5 wrote: »

I work crazy hours and I am in the high 60s at age 23 so I give a good chunk away in the Basic and Higher tax rate, which I am fine with.

In one post you hope to be a higher-rate tax payer and then you say that you already are. Fantasist.

Davy_Jones_II

justcamehere5 wrote: »

The difference is I can't come easily to the USA to make more money (due to less tax) at a top job due to their preference for hiring people from their OWN top universities.

I’ve worked in the US for two different companies. They actively sought me out, offered me the job, and arranged for the necessary visas.

If you can’t get a job there it’s not the system that’s at fault.

To be honest, you seem to be blaming all of your issues on external factors. Part of being an adult is taking responsibility for your own actions, and you’ll be happier once you manage that.

The point made above is a valid one, how have you made it through a degree in the UK without gaining a higher standard of English?

Are you a Singaporean citizen? I’ve worked there for a while, too, and they most definitely do not welcome people who don’t have a good job unless you are a citizen there.

Davy_Jones_II

Voyager2002 wrote: »

Indeed. Those two countries are among the very best in the world. The UK is not in the same league, but overall is not bad. Things are far worse in most other countries.

Really? No state health service in the Netherlands, paternity leave is four days in total, there is no shared parental leave, they tax lower paid workers more than the U.K., pollution is so bad that they have just called an immediate halt to all construction work and are looking at bringing in a blanket 60mph speed limit across the whole country.

The idea that you can make a blanket statement that the Netherlands is better just makes no sense. It’s different, it has pluses and minuses.

justcamehere5

Voyager2002 wrote: »

All in all, when we look at the OP's inaccurate beliefs about comparative taxation and his limited powers of expression, and marvel that he was chosen for such a good job... this explains why British banks are in such a mess!

Not working in a bank.

Davy_Jones_II wrote: »

Why didn’t you then?

Loopholes like this shouldn't be allowed.

LilElvis wrote: »

Consistency is all when you post. So which is it?
In one post you hope to be a higher-rate taxpayer and then you say that you already are. Fantasist.

Apologies, I did not articulate myself that well. While I might be in the very higher earner based on my age, it is very likely to scale as I age, which was my standard of high-earner. And that might have been a bit misleading.




A lot of assumptions ITT regarding myself, "mummy and daddy money" and all twisting my words as if I am making claims directly regarding other associated issues. Disgusting people, not salvageable even by Labour.