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Legs21

What happened to @PestoPasta post?

alt80

@Sholly so you’re telling me you’ve never discussed anything but work at the office no chat and no banter? FML must be a really !!!!!! boring place to work - that’s not a culture I want to create in my place of work and it’s my company so can discuss whatever the !!!!!! I want. Not every woman is as sensitive to a bit of advice as you are - take it or leave it doesn’t really matter - your life ultimately 100 with you there.

As for HMO tenants - dealt with many, have you? I’ve got a few units and speak as a HMO LL. 100% not a slight on any of my tenants, most of them are great but I still wouldn’t recommend a female member of staff date one. Just my opinion - their’s to do with the advice as they wish.

Relationships not all about money, agreed but it plays a big part can tell you that or does in my experience. No one’s relationship is perfect, always going to be compromise somewhere. 100% my wife was interested in taking things beyond a fling with me because I earn well. 

As for the ‘giving her a break’ thing - if she had the necessary skills/ quals/ experience and said to me ‘tell you what I’ll do those 2 industrial units for you tomorrow, give you a break’ - I’d say thank you and accept the offer on what is it - a nice gesture. So yeah 100% I don’t see the issue with once in a while giving her a break.

@Onebrokelady That’s great but really not my experience of most women at all. 

enthusiasticsaver

My husband was an electronics engineering apprentice when I met him and lived with his mum and I earned more than him in banking but still only an average wage and also lived with my parents but we were young. Money did not come into our relationship at all apart from our attitudes to it. If he was the type who got into masses of debt I would have run a mile as my Dad had brought us up teaching us how to budget and avoid consumer debt and I don't think he would have stuck with me if I was the type of woman to expect expensive gifts or leech off him. Over the years we both progressed in our careers and earned above average, not huge salaries but enough to cover our lifestyle and more.

 Like OBL we have brought our daughters up to be independent and have their own careers..Most of my friends have done the same with their children and I don't know any of my daughter or son in laws friends  who don't work at all. 

@alt80 Maybe you are attracted to the type of woman who likes to be taken care of and treated rather than be independent? From the sound of it the circle you mix in values people on how much property they have, what they earn and what car they drive. In my experience most people are not like that. People who live in HMOs are usually just youngsters starting out so why would that put women or men off dating them? You said yourself you lived in some dumps before buying your house and yet you earn a good wage now. I don't think anyone should be judged on earning power alone, men or women. 

alt80

@enthusiasticsaver idk maybe that’s what it is and how many on here seem to be bucking the trend, maybe it’s me with the outdated views who knows.

Re HMOs - I’m not talking about new grads/ student type places and as for me I’ve lived in a fair few flip projects yes, always owned though never been a tenant apart from when I was at uni and always lived in a good area - not ‘dumps’ in the sense you’re talking about ha, had to climb the ladder somehow no silver spoon for me so don’t really understand the criticism.

katsu

@alt80 we've already established that you find the Katsu house confusing 🤣  whether there are more women on here who are the higher earner or who are working, I really don't know. 

I don't need Mr Katsu to buy me gifts or take care of me financially,  but I do appreciate the other ways that he does take care of me, as he appreciates my care for him. It's give and take and being thoughtful that matters to us. We don't have little Katsus so I can't speak about children.  

Bargainhunter30

I don't need Mr Katsu to buy me gifts or take care of me financially,  but I do appreciate the other ways that he does take care of me, as he appreciates my care for him. It's give and take and being thoughtful that matters to us. We don't have little Katsus so I can't speak about children.  

100% agree. Equality is the way to go, we are a partnership here. We both earnt the same this year (next to nothing and neither of us has paid tax yet), this has been a choice due to having young children and partner studying. We value time over things. The things Mr BH provides in terms of love, support, friendship and taking care of our children far outweigh his earning potential. He has never earnt masses, as a chef and didnt put me off when I met him, his personality and beliefs were far more important to me.

enthusiasticsaver

alt80 said:

@enthusiasticsaver idk maybe that’s what it is and how many on here seem to be bucking the trend, maybe it’s me with the outdated views who knows.

Re HMOs - I’m not talking about new grads/ student type places and as for me I’ve lived in a fair few flip projects yes, always owned though never been a tenant apart from when I was at uni and always lived in a good area - not ‘dumps’ in the sense you’re talking about ha, had to climb the ladder somehow no silver spoon for me so don’t really understand the criticism.

The criticism you are getting is due to the assumptions you are making about what most women look for in a partner. You may not intend it as derogatory but it is coming across that way. Just because you are an employer and a LL that does not make you an authority but it does give you power and sometimes that can skew your thinking because the people around you probably tell you what they think you want to hear. Does not mean they aren't thinking something else though so maybe your staff may have more of a problem with your banter than you think. You still have to abide by employment legislation about inappropriate remarks etc even in your own business.

 There are lots of women on here who are financially savvy but if you go on to mumsnet or some such open forum where mostly women post you will find similar attitudes. Women these days have choices and more independence than 50 years ago. I think your views  about women looking for a provider above all else are outdated. (Your wife seems to be the exception though). Not many of us had the silver spoon either and have had to work our way up. 

Sorry to hijack your diary Ryan and enjoy your date today. 

Purplelady65

Just wanted to pick up on these views expressed by Alt80. (sorry @Ryan8655 your diary is being hijacked re a debate around the roles of men and women!).

 

Most women want to find someone who will look after them, provide if you will, it’s why they want the gifts - gives them a bit of security that if they have a kid, they’ll be ok. Nothing wrong with that, it’s a biological thing. Yeah, I agree not ALL women are looking for that but the majority are. 

 

 it’s a primal thing for a mum to want to be at home with her baby not thinking about earning. It’s why women will generally look for the gifts etc early on. 

 

You are presenting the above statements as fact but based on what information? How many women have you had conversations with about your views who have agreed with you? I think you would be hard-pressed to find any up-to-date academic research to support this as the prevailing view of women in 2021. Fifty or so years ago it might have been a more commonly held view that the man was the provider but that was due to society’s view of women in the workplace and the law. Women working in the Civil Service and a range of other public sector organisations,  professions and occupations including teaching, nursing, banking had to give up work when they got married – it was called the Marriage Bar. It was only abolished in 1946 so there has been a lot of catching up to do since then. I can see then that income would have been more important to women then as women were totally dependent on a man when they got married whether they wanted to be or not. For those that weren’t forced to give up work on marriage there was a societal expectation that women stayed at home once they had children to look after them.

 

I agree with all the other posters and that in this day and age women do not want to be looked after but have their own careers and earn their own money. It gives women choices and freedoms that weren’t there 40-50 years ago. I work in a large organisation (over 3,000 employees) and women make up the majority of the workforce and are represented at all levels including CE and Chair. My role involves engagement with employees at all levels and I’m sure if I presented your views they would be given very short shrift!

 As @Enthusiasticsaver has said it may be that the circles you operate in this is the commonly held view but your world seems to consist of people who value the accumulation of money over anything else and the display of wealth through material possessions which probably attracts a certain type of person to it.

I can honestly say I do not know of a single woman of any age (apart from those that have retired) who stays and home and does not work, including people who don’t need to earn any money but still choose to work. I also do not know of any woman who would expect a man to provide for her.

 

Also re your narrative of biology and primal thinking where does this fit for women and men who choose not to have a partner as they prefer to be on their own? There are many people these days who do not want a life partner or children. Also for same sex couples looking to start a family where does that narrative fit?  

 

You have said previously that you have learned a lot from the MSE forums so I am posting this not to be critical but to provide a different viewpoint and challenge your thinking in a constructive way.

PestoPasta

@Legs21, deleted my post as realised that we are hijacking this lovely thread to respond to Alt’s misogyny. Will just say again, every woman that I know earns her own money and is quite often the main breadwinner in the family. These are beautiful, intelligent woman before Alt thinks I am talking about woman who couldn’t attract a footballer (excuse my Alt speak). The vast majority of woman  in 2021 are definitely not looking for a meal ticket. Fact.  

PestoPasta

Will also just add that I come from a single parent working class family myself. Went to University, moved to London and worked in senior management for FTSE companies. In my experience, most intelligent, charming men are not looking for a bimbo wife. They are looking for sharp intelligence, wit, kindness and similar values. Male barristers, scientists and financiers are not marrying part-time nail technicians. They are marrying woman of ‘at least’ equivalent status.  I have also amassed a fortune, independently of my husband (a lower earner than me) of  over £2 million. Woman rock!
P.S. sorry to derail you thread Ryan.