Lack of signs for penalty charge notice

Countrymanor

Hi all, I've gone through a lot of posts here but can't find one in relation to my posted pcn from a company called Highview Parking., so am looking for help. The letter arrived on the 7th July, stating 4th July as Date Of Notice. The pics on their letter show my car arriving and leaving. The letter states the car was over the stayed limit but doesn't state what this limit was, just states the arrival and leaving times. However, their letter states that "the vehicle exceeded the maximum stay prominently displayed on the signage at the site".
Having revisited the site today (its a retail site consisting of 4 large stores), there is one sign stating the time limit but at a place you wouldn't have time to read it as you are driving through into the car park. The only signs clearly on display at the area of car park where the car was parked only has signs saying customer car park, no time limit given. In fact the only 2 signs that state the time limit are right at the other end of the car park and which you wouldn't see unless you were visiting that particular shop in this retail park. (one sign is displayed on the wall of this store but it is hidden from certain areas of this car park due to a wall from the shop next door to it being out in front and not in line - clearly unseen from the 3 shops in front of the one which has it on their wall in display)The letter says I can appeal within 14 days (so 18th July by D. O. N on the letter, or 21st July if taken from when I received it)... Now here's the interesting thing.. I logged on to make my appeal but it says it doesn't recognise my Charge Notice Ref Number, so how can I appeal? I even called and when I entered the same number followed by the star button (as instructed), again it says that the number isn't recognised. Any advice as to what I should do? I thought to write a letter saying all the above, but of course it will be received by them after the 14days (yes I will date my letter of course), and I was going to write my reasons of appeal (lack of signs and no signs of time limit outside or near the shop I was using) and also to say that the ref no on my letter isn't recognised on their online appeal form or on their telephone line. Should I write this letter or ignore everything as the ref no is not recognised by them.? Like everyone else here, I can pay a reduced sum of £51 now (within 14days of their received letter) or £85 if payment is paid 28days from the date of their letter, plus an additional debt recovery charge of £40 on top (bringing it up £125).....or I can not pay at all)). Where do I legally stand over this, not just based on the lack of "time signs" in the car park, but also based upon the Charge Notice Ref No not being recognised on their own appeal page? Thanks in advance...

The_Deep

This is not a penalty, nor is it a fine. It is an invoice from a scammer for the damage they claim to have suffered when you allegedly breached an alleged contract. Pay them nothing unless a judge so orders it.

… plus an additional debt recovery charge of £40

This is an unlawful demand, read this

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/6014081/abuse-of-process-district-judge-tells-bwlegal

and ask the judge to dismiss theclaim.

Nine out of ten of these so called breaches of contract are scams, so complain to your MP.

Parliament is well aware of the MO of these private parking companies, and on 15th March 2019 a Bill was enacted to curb the excesses of these shysters. Codes of Practice are being drawn up, an independent appeals service will be set up, and access to the DVLA's date base more rigorously policed, and persistent offenders denied access. Hopefully life will become impossible for the worst of these scammers.

Until this is done you should still complain to your MP, citing the new legislation.

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2019/8/contents/enacted

Countrymanor

Hi The Deep, thank you for your reply. I have to write to them to appeal bcos I can't do it online (or even to pay via the phone) because their Charge Notice Ref no. isn't recognised on their system... So would this make their original letter not valid to begin with?

Fruitcake

Edit your post to remove information about who parked! Only ever refer to The Driver and The Keeper who are two different people.

Once you have done that, read the sticky thread for NEWBIES that was just underneath where you clicked on the button, asking you to read it before you post.

The NEWBIES looks like this,

Sticky: **NEWBIES!! PRIVATE PARKING TICKET? OLD OR NEW? **READ THESE FAQS FIRST!** Thankyou! Coupon-mad

Never ever 'phone a parking scammer!

The 14 days you mention is irrelevant.

You have not received a penalty charge.

Your situation s no different to the hundred or so cases we see here every day.

What happened when you complained to the landowner? You should also complain to your MP about this unregulated scam.

If the scammers' appeal system isn't working but you received a NTK through the post, then The Keeper should complain to the BPA.

fisherjim

I'm afraid your situation isn't unique at all there are hundreds of Highview cases and the generic appeal is the one you need from the newbies thread.


The 14 days is just a con to get you to fold, the debt recovery charge is a threat you won't pay because no one in their right minds pays a debt collector.


These are just scammers, read up on it all in the newbies thread, in chunks that refer to your circumstance carefully.

Fruitcake

Once you have edited your post here, you need to go and delete your post on the other thread you hijacked.

Countrymanor

Hi Fruitcake, how do I edit my post and also delete my one in reply to "advice"..... Where do I go for these please as I don't see the options... Many thanks

waamo

Countrymanor wrote: »

Hi Fruitcake, how do I edit my post and also delete my one in reply to "advice"..... Where do I go for these please as I don't see the options... Many thanks

Don't use a phone. Half the forum functionality seems to go awry on a phone.

Countrymanor

Ps... In my written letter of appeal, should I inform them that I tried to appeal via their online form but that their Charge Notice Ref isn't recognised.? And should I also write that because of this, this makes their letter not valid in this claim. The actual date of incident was 23rd June (as shown in their pics) and they wrote to me on the 4th July. Have they got a certain amount of days to issue me their PCN, and if so, then as their letter can be seen as invalid due to incorrect information ie unrecognisable ref no, then they would have to reissue me with another letter for this offence. Though I'm understanding that they can't issue me twice for the same offence.... Once again, thank you for your advice.

waamo

Countrymanor wrote: »

Ps... In my written letter of appeal, should I inform them that I tried to appeal via their online form but that their Charge Notice Ref isn't recognised.? And should I also write that because of this, this makes their letter not valid in this claim. The actual date of incident was 23rd June (as shown in their pics) and they wrote to me on the 4th July. Have they got a certain amount of days to issue me their PCN, and if so, then as their letter can be seen as invalid due to incorrect information ie unrecognisable ref no, then they would have to reissue me with another letter for this offence. Though I'm understanding that they can't issue me twice for the same offence.... Once again, thank you for your advice.

Send the template from the Newbies thread unaltered. Do not embellish it at all. It's designed so you don't inadvertently name the driver. Altering it risks you making that error.

MistyZ

Word on here is that Highview fold when they see the template appeal. As long as you don't name the driver.