Help needed - ukpc 9 parking charge notices, 7 at debt collection, 2 appealed

venousdata

Crystal clear. Thanks for the breakdown!

I’ve mentioned in my SAR that a single claim must be made for all tickets rather than individually, so hopefully they don’t go down that route.

In regards to possible defences...

- Can I still use the unclear signage defence even if BPA sides with UKPC?

- How can a valid contract exist that none of the neighbors have seen or signed/agreed on? Doesn’t the landowners need to be involved too? I have proof that they denied managing the area.

- Is there a way to prove that one of the signs were erected after the alleged breach of contact?

Thanks

Coupon-mad

- Can I still use the unclear signage defence even if BPA sides with UKPC?

Yes. But as you are a resident, then the main point is primacy of contract and derogation from grant, although you may struggle a bit to show you had a right or easement allowing parking near the bins & shed.

- How can a valid contract exist that none of the neighbors have seen or signed/agreed on? Doesn’t the landowners need to be involved too? I have proof that they denied managing the area.

This is a standard residential defence - primacy of contract - search the forum for Landlord Tenant Act defence.

- Is there a way to prove that one of the signs were erected after the alleged breach of contact?

I can't think of a way but as you live there then the signs are peripheral to your argument that the contract that prevails (and allows parking without permit or charge) is your lease or tenancy agreement.

So I recently moved to a new location with a private permit holder only car park. we have allocated spaces but with two cars in the household we sometimes need to park in the visitors bay.

Anyway, long story short, since moving in on September 2018 I've been parking beside a green shed for recycling bins on occasion when no other spaces were available, and have unknowingly racked up quite a few charges.

You moved to an unsuitable place. ANY site with a parking firm in is a big no-no, especially with two cars. This will haunt you forever with more PCNs every year until you move, or until the residents get UKPC removed by complaint to the MA and refusing to accept any contract that interferes with your leases.

It would be cheaper and less hassle to park on street and pay & display, or on a double yellow on street outside occasionally for brief stops (which is allowed for things like loading). Your property is also unsuitable for visitors at Christmas or other holiday times, as parking firms treat those weeks as their opportunity to visit all sites and whack out loads of PCNs as they know there will be more cars in a confined space.

Are you a tenant or a leasehold owner?

venousdata

I will definitely be moving and making sure to never make the same mistake again.

I’ll look in to the landlord tenant act - primacy of contract.

I am a tenant but the landlord has told me he signed no such agreement with UKPC and provided us with a copy of his leasehold agreement which I will read over tonight to see if there is anything relating to parking terms and conditions.

Coupon-mad

Make sure the landlord and Managing Agents are informed in writing why you moved, when you do. Make it crystal clear.

You need to talk about UKPC 'blighting' the location and the industry operating an 'outrageous scam' as outed in Parliament last year.

venousdata

Will do. Is it worth talking about the parliament thing in my defence or just my letter explaining why I’m moving to landlord and land owners?

Coupon-mad

Search the forum for Landlord Tenant Act defence and you will see how to write those defences.

I would also briefly refer to the will of Parliament, then LATER evidence gets submitted with your WS, and that Briefing would be an exhibit you can use a few pages from, in case your Judge isn't up to speed with the scammery.

venousdata

I’ve checked the original leaseholder terms and conditions and in the parking section I found that it DID mentioned that you should only park in your allocated space.

However... the parking company was not UKPC, so I’m assuming this is an old contract that’s no longer valid?

Also, the landowners who issued these papers have confirmed with me that they no longer manage the area.

Does this mean that the contract is invalid? Although the rules remain the same, both the parking company and the landowners are no longer managing the area.

Also, the contract showed some example images of how to send photographs to them to issue tickets, and in my case none of the examples were adhered to. The sign was not visible in the same photo as my vehicle.

I’m going to look up the landlord tenancy agreement in the forum as I think primacy of contract may be the best defence for me.

venousdata

Hi,

I’ve now received two POPLA codes amongst my rejected appeals, so I was wondering if my last post could contain a few good points to mention in my POPLA appeal?

Thanks

Coupon-mad

Does this mean that the contract is invalid? Although the rules remain the same, both the parking company and the landowners are no longer managing the area.

No, it's not void but it can be argued in a defence that there is no 'legitimate interest' or commercial justification and thus, the ParkingEye v Beavis case is fully distinguished.

Also, the contract showed some example images of how to send photographs to them to issue tickets, and in my case none of the examples were adhered to. The sign was not visible in the same photo as my vehicle.

Useful for POPLA appeals, but you will get more replies if you draft a POPLA appeal and make it clear which PCN is which as I'm confused by you mentioning court and POPLA.

venousdata

Hi, a quick update and another question:

1. ONE of my 9 parking charges has been cancelled! I was away for the past week and returned to find a letter informing me that a particular charge had been cancelled. I'm not sure why they cancelled 1 out of 9, but can this possibly be a point of defence? all 9 charges were for the vehicle being in exactly the same location so are more or less identical charges.

2. In the same week I've also received a letter form SCS law threatening for UKPC/SCS to issue a Letter of Claim if outstanding debt is not paid within 14 days from the date of the letter (now 8). I
also note that the SCS letter regards only 1 PCN and not all 8. What should I do about this?

I am working on my POPLA appeals for two other charges in the meantime.

I've already made a SAR so should hopefully hear back from them regarding that soon, but don't want them to claim 8 charges separately as in my SAR I've made it clear that any claim must be for all charges in one.


In regards to your confusion about court and POPLA... basically all charges are more or less for the exact same thing, just issued at different dates, so while the most recent are at POPLA stage, the oldest ones are nearing court stage I believe hence the SCS Law letter.

Thanks in advance!