100+ miles a day, diesel or petrol in 2019?

Nobbie1967

Mercdriver wrote: »

Appreciation will not last, neither will cobalt.

Agree re appreciation, but more cobalt will be found as the price rises in response to current supplies being exhausted. Minining requires big capital investment and it often takes a price spike to make the investment worthwhile. Remember when we were going to run out of oil in 20 years? That was about 30 years ago.

DrEskimo

forgotmyname wrote: »

Getting better but still not enough for most people. Can i drive 400 motorway miles at night with the lights/heater and stereo on etc?

Course you can. My father-in-law drove to Italy in his.

forgotmyname wrote: »

Just checked some prices and a 2 year old Zoe with a £20k ish new price is now just £10k with a 100 mile range. Larger battery versions are similar money but with the battery lease on top.

2 yr old Zoe's are the bigger battery Zoe's with a 186mile range in the summer. The older 22kWh Zoe's never started at £20k. Again, there are two versions of the Zoe for both battery sizes, battery leased and battery owned. You can get either variant in either guise.

forgotmyname wrote: »

So its lost approx £10k where a Clio would be approx £7k and lost under £5k from its new purchase price.

Appreciation? The only thing that shows is huge depreciation.

Enough fuel to take the Clio 40,000 miles over the 2 years after deducting the depreciation on the Clio. So which was better value?

See you are taking the RRP...not the discounted price, which anyone who has the internet and 5mins on Google would be able to achieve. You are also not comparing like for like. The £12k, manual, Play trim for the Clio is not comparable to the Zoe. The automatic petrol Dynamique trim is. These cost around £18k new, and discounted to £16k.

In contrast a Zoe, battery owned Dynamique is around £18k brand new discounted. I nearly ordered a new one from my local dealer. Literally rang up and said I want a Zoe, whats the best price, and with metallic paint and the rear camera, it was £18,280. As I said, about £2k difference to the comparable Clio. Two years ago people were getting discounted prices of £16k for the battery owned Zoe.

My personal used battery owned 41kWh Zoe was £14,500, which is a 66-plate with 5,000 miles on it from a main dealer. Has metallic paint and rear camera. I have been offered £15,250 from a dealer to buy it off me. That is £750 appreciation.

I have driven it 800miles in the last 3months and at national average £/kWh of 15p, that is £30 in 'fuel'. My annual insurance is £288, s over 3 months that is £72. That means if I sold tomorrow, my 3months of motoring has meant I have been paid £648.

Do you think if I bought a used 66-plate, 5,000 miles, automatic Clio Dynamique for about £12k from a main dealer, I would be offered £12,750 three months later to buy it off me? No, probably would be around £10k trade value. Same 800miles in fuel costs would be in excess of £100.

So yes, the Zoe is better value for money. You are just confusing the different models, and were not aware that the discounted price of the Zoe is substantially less than the RRP, and is very easily obtained.

macman

Why not delay your purchase of a new car until you know how long you’ll be commuting that distance for? 3 to 6 months is a crazy timeframe to base buying a car on that you will keep for maybe 3 years or more.
Does your current journey take you into the London ULEZ? If not, there are no other zones in which you will be penalised. I believe Oxford is the only other city currently considering a ULEZ.
And, if your new diesel is Euro 6 compliant, then it won’t apply anyway.
if your mileage is likely to reduce to about 50m per day, then petrol will probably be a better deal.

bengalknights

For pure MPG would recommend a Civic diesel those things seem to get 75+mpg on non local commutes

System

DrEskimo wrote: »

My Zoe was only, at most, a couple of grand more than a comparable Clio.

I don't have a battery rental charge on my Zoe.

Then I don't know where you're looking because I've been looking at that car and the difference on the Zoe between buying a Zoe with battery rental and buying the battery outright is SIX THOUSAND POUNDS.

£21,220 for the base line Dynamique Nav with battery lease, £27,820 for the base line Dynamique Nav with battery bought outright.

Renault Clios start from £13,615.

Or are you talking used cars?

almillar

Getting better but still not enough for most people. Can i drive 400 motorway miles at night with the lights/heater and stereo on etc?

When's the last time you did this in an ICE? And using lights/heater/stereo for 400 miles uses a tiny proportion of energy compared to actually moving the vehicle, anyone with real EV experience knows this.

Cobalt - you do realise it can be recycled? You do realise crude oil (where petrol and diesel comes from) is running out?

See you are taking the RRP...not the discounted price,

I've given my example before. £151 per month for my Zoe, 7,500 miles per year, for 2 years. £4,000 all in for 2 years, 15,000 miles motoring. No fuel (free to charge in NI), no tax, 2 services. In a lovely, quiet, well equipped little car. RRP ~£18,000 I think. Those offers are gone now, but this did actually happen!

Or are you talking used cars?

I think you're missing the past tense of the post. They were cheaper (and had smaller batteries) when I 'bought' mine in 2015. I imagine he's similar.

Ebe_Scrooge

almillar wrote: »

When's the last time you did this in an ICE? And using lights/heater/stereo for 400 miles uses a tiny proportion of energy compared to actually moving the vehicle

I hope you don't mind me a slight hijack here, but this has often puzzled me about electric cars - how do the heaters work ?

In an ICE, there is loads of heat produced as a by-product, so you've got more than enough on tap, it just needs diverting into the cockpit. But an electric heater (at least, a normal domestic electric radiator) uses a load of electricity. I'd have thought using a heater in an electric car would deplete the battery to a very large extent. I'm probably missing something, and I don't pretend to know much about electric cars, but it's always puzzled me.

shinytop

Ebe_Scrooge wrote: »

I hope you don't mind me a slight hijack here, but this has often puzzled me about electric cars - how do the heaters work ?

In an ICE, there is loads of heat produced as a by-product, so you've got more than enough on tap, it just needs diverting into the cockpit. But an electric heater (at least, a normal domestic electric radiator) uses a load of electricity. I'd have thought using a heater in an electric car would deplete the battery to a very large extent. I'm probably missing something, and I don't pretend to know much about electric cars, but it's always puzzled me.

You either wear a coat or suffer reduced range. Heating uses a lot of the battery power. The double whammy is that when it's cold the range is down anyway

Ebe_Scrooge

shinytop wrote: »

You either wear a coat or suffer reduced range. Heating uses a lot of the battery power. The double whammy is that when it's cold the range is down anyway

I thought that must be the case. But if that's true, I can't see how an EV really is a viable proposition for anything more than about 50 miles or so, during the winter. Even those that claim to have a range of 180 miles or whatever, I bet that's halved if the heater is on full belt constantly ?

shinytop

I'm not recommending it necessarily but I do a 120 mile round trip in a plug in petrol hybrid. I can plug in at both ends (one free). I probably get 65-70 mpg with a bit of help from the electrons. Downsides are the car is expensive, complicated and needs servicing every 10k miles. Upsides are it's not diesel and (for me) is cheap on company car tax.